You know, looking at the top 25, I actually see TCU and Northern Illinois getting into the Top 10 this week. Who would have thought that?
You know, looking at the top 25, I actually see TCU and Northern Illinois getting into the Top 10 this week. Who would have thought that?
Two weeks to prepare and they do that? Wow.
Well, they might only fall to sixth or seventh in the polls due to all the other losses. At least I hope.
It's as I said. If they couldn't find an offensive line, they were screwed. Well, they didn't find an offensive line.Originally Posted by Anglefan
I don't know about 6th or 7th. Wisconsin was unranked (even though they should have been) and all of those nail-biters with SDSU and NC State come into play now. I would guess closer to about tenth.
My guess for the top ten:
- OU (Should recieve virtually all of the 1st place votes.)
- Miami (Might recive a couple of first votes, since they have been all year.)
- Virginia Tech
- USC
- Georgia
- Northern Illinois
- TCU
- Washington State
- Iowa
- Ohio State
Possibly Florida State over Iowa and Ohio State, and Ohio State may go over Iowa.
Northern Illinios will not be that high.
Wisconsin was 22nd.
Looking at that list, I would put OSU right behind Georgia.
Why? NIU and TCU are both undefeated and have actually beaten some impressive teams. Ohio State has lost, and damn close to losing to two unranked teams.
Ohio State has no damn place being above them, or above Iowa or Washington State. And as the "great football fan" that you herald yourself to be, you should be man enough to admit that.
Damn I rule. Too bad my tired ass couldn't stay up to watch it.
I know how the voters vote. They aren't putting those teams from secondary conferences in the top 10, especially this early in the season.
1. Oklahoma (58) 6-0 1,570 1
2. Miami (5) 6-0 1,514 2
3. Virginia Tech 6-0 1,452 4
4. USC 5-1 1,334 9
5. Georgia 5-1 1,333 10
6. Washington State 5-1 1,108 12
7. Florida State 5-1 1,086 5
8. Ohio State 5-1 1,065 3
9. Iowa 5-1 981 15
10. LSU 5-1 938 6
11. Arkansas 4-1 827 8
12. Wisconsin 6-1 733 22
13. TCU 6-0 730 17
14. Nebraska 5-1 704 7
15. Purdue 5-1 699 20
16. Northern Illinois 6-0 694 18
17. Michigan 5-2 675 19
18. Michigan State 6-1 581 23
19. Minnesota 6-1 369 13
20. Texas 4-2 293 11
21. Oregon State 5-1 258 25
22. Tennessee 4-2 249 14
23. Texas Tech 5-1 222 NR
24. Oklahoma State 5-1 218 NR
25. Auburn 4-2 181 NR
As you can see, TCU and NIU are still irrelevant to the voters at this point.I can understand them putting FSU ahead of OSU because they lost to Miami. It doesn't really matter where Iowa is because they play Ohio State this week.
Was that the Coaches' Poll? I shudder to think what the media poll will say.
And that was damn good route running by Lee Evans and a terrible bite on the out route by Chris Gamble.
Call me an old fashioned prick, but they are shaming the sport. TCU and NIU are both undefeated. Until they lose a game, they should automatically be placed above teams that have lost.
And even with the win against OSU, I don't know if Wisconsin should be as high as they are. That blowout by UNLV must be long and forgotten by now, I guess.
LSU should have tanked closer to about 15 for me.
Michigan as 17th
Minnesota only 25th? They deserve higher.
NIU should not be higher than most of the 1 loss teams....down 17-0 against Central Michigan?
And TCU just isn't as good as most of those 1 loss teams...
Yet, they won 40-24. What's your point?NIU should not be higher than most of the 1 loss teams....down 17-0 against Central Michigan?
I'm not questioning that. But, that isn't the point. The point is that TCU and NIU haven't lost a game yet. And, until the point where they lose a game, they should be ranked above the 1 loss teams. Otherwise, yet the hell do these schools have to play for? They can go undefeated, and still finish the season below teams that have losses. What the hell are we trying to teach these kids? That playing your best every single game just isn't as good as teams that slacked off a game or two?And TCU just isn't as good as most of those 1 loss teams...
My point...is that they haven't proven themselves. They beat an overranked Maryland team, and an overranked Alabama team, and that's it. Of course they don't deserve to be rated higher. They were getting worked 17-0 by Central Michigan...as previously stated.
That is the point. The pollsters are not responsible for seeing who tried the hardest. The pollsters are responsible for ranking the teams in the order in which they believe they belong. Maybe TCU should be ranked high in an effort poll, but since we don't have one of those, I guess that's a problem for them.
So you are telling me that you have no problem telling these kids that even though they have done the most important thing in football, win every game they have played, they just don't deserve any credit for it? That teams with losses are still more deserving than them? That is fucked up, and will destroy any attempt of new schools gaining national powers.
Why the hell would any kid want to pick TCU or NIU over Alabama or Maryland? At least those schools will get the chances if they win. You pick NIU or TCU, ou can win out and still not be good enough.
You wouldn't chose to go to TCU or NIU over Alabama or Maryland. They are not on the same level and aren't supposed to be. Some conferences play at a higher level. If NIU goes undefeated, they should not play in the national championship game. They don't play in a power conference, they don't get to contend for a national title. That's the way it always has been and always will be. I don't see why there's anything wrong with that. Everyone at these schools already knows this.
I beg to differ. I feel like if a team goes undefeated in any conference they should get some kind of consideration towards the title. Going undefeated is hard to do any for a school playing a shit schedule. Tulane goes undefeated a few years back and I don't think they even cracked the top ten which was crap in my view. And does not get an invite to the BCS as an at large.
Wynoming(spelling) a few years back at a one loss record and ranked in the top 6 in both polls and does not even play a bowl game.
I understand that there are differences in conferences and strengths of schedules and all but at the same time you should not completey punish a school from a smaller conference that goes undefeated.
And I can beat you money people have choosen smallers schools over Alabama and some other larger schools. That happens all the time when they don't want to go to a big program and want to try to help turn around a smaller school closer to home or something.
If there were an eight team playoff, I might agree with you that an undefeated team in any conference should get a shot to play for the title, but it is not possible that a team not in one of the six BCS conferences (and Notre Dame) is one of the two best teams in the country. They just don't have the same level of talent. If their schedule stacks up, then yes they should get the same consideration, but it doesn't.
They don't have the same schedule though because the other schools won't play them. That is also part of the problem.
I see what you're saying, but it's undeniable that they are not better than anyone in the top 10. End of story.
:applause:
TCU undefeated....Virginia Tech loses a two overtime game to Miami, or who loses a squeaker to Pitt....TCU championship game over Virginia Tech?
I agree in the sense that NIU or TCU should not be in the National Championship. However, if they should go undefeated, then they should be rewarded with a better bowl then say, the Motor City Bowl.
*wants a playoff*
If they stay undefeated, things will work out. Either Virginia Tech or Miami will drop. Either Washington State or USC will drop. Two teams out of Ohio State, Iowa, and Wisconsin will drop (unless Iowa loses to them both). The loser of LSU-Arkansas will drop. Purdue will drop.
Here's a little something to discuss...
Projected BCS Standings:
1. Oklahoma
2. Miami
3. Georgia
4. Virginia Tech
5. Southern California
6. Florida State
7. Ohio State
8. Iowa
9. Washington State
10. Arkansas
11. Northern Illinois
12. Wisconsin
The first thing that jumps out is 1 loss Georgia ahead of Virginia Tech. But not to worry, Virginia Tech's strength of schedule will greatly improve as the season progresses and they will pass Georgia (assuming they keep winning). Also notice Northern Illinois at number 11. It seems to me that they have a fairly good shot of cracking the top 6, which would mean an automatic BCS bowl bid.
Why would NIU crack the top 6? In theory, the only team(s) in the top 6 that will lose a game will be Miami or Virginia Tech. And 1 will drop between Iowa and Ohio State. That is only two spots. And I bet only one will open up because the loser of Miami-VT will still most likely be ranked above NIU.
It's sad. Those NIU boys have worked their ass off, could very well go undefeated, and not get shit for it. They will get a shit ass bowl, with shit ass money for the team.
It's an insult to the whole system.
NIU couldn't win a national championship even if they were good enough because the MAC isn't a BCS conference.
The whole problem with the ranking system is it's based just as much on the name of the school as it is the strength of the team.
Iowa is ranked 8 for beating Michigan. But they lost to Michigan State who, for some reason, is ranked behind Michigan even though they only have 1 loss (on an absolute fluke at that) compared to Michigan's 2. But Michigan will always get the benefit of the doubt simply because they are Michigan.
playoffs, playoffs, playoffs, it's the only fair way to do it, everything else is subjective.
Even if NIU cracks the top six they do not get an automatic invite to the BCS. They are not in BCS conference. Remember Wyoming a few years back that was in the top six and did not go to a bowl at all with one loss and in the top 5 in the country because they were in the WAC?
No, that did not happen. Wyoming has never been in the top five. Maybe that was BYU, but they still weren't in the top five or six.
If NIU has a problem with the way the bowl system is structured, they can either attempt to join a power conference (where they would be crushed every year) or go to 1-AA. They aren't going to go undefeated anyway. If they do, their coach is well aware of how things work and really has no place to be upset. It's all about money. NIU didn't even sell out their last home game. If their local market can't even support them, the national market sure as hell won't.
Yes it did. They beat BYU who was in the top 25 but not that high and they did not go to a bowl game and that is when the WAC and some of the other non-BCS conferences started throwing fits that their teams could not get in even if they were ranked that high. I will have to go looking to find the info to show what I am talking about.
I'll take your word for it on the top six rule, I just can't remember Wyoming ever being near that high.
Also, how could they be that high if they didn't even win the WAC? Obviously, the champion gets the automatic bid and the WAC has (had) more the one bowl tie in, I think.
Okay looking back and trying to think more clearing Wyoming was top ten(I am pretty sure having trouble finding stuff) and BYU was top 6(this I know they were 5 when the beat Wyoming for WAC title) after BYU beat Wyoming for the WAC title. BYU got the bowl tie in for the WAC and it was back in 97 and Wyoming sat home. Most argued that BYU should have gotten an at large for BCS and Wyoming should have got the WAC bowl game.
Since then I think a school from a non-BCS school can get invited if ranked high enough and the WAC now as more than one bowl tie in. Wyoming sat at home though.
So I was a little off but I know Wyoming sat at home and did not play a bowl game and that BYU did not do BCS. Again I am still trying to find more articles from back then.
I looked it up and that happened in 1996 which was one year before the BCS went into effect. BYU finished 5th after winning the Cotton Bowl and Wyoming finished 22nd after going 10-2 and didn't go to a bowl. So yeah, they deserved a bowl, but the BCS system wasn't in place then.
A team in the top 6 (I think it's top 6) in the BCS standings gets an automatic BCS bowl bid. This rule was just instituted a couple years ago.
In my opinion, NIU shouldn't play in a BCS bowl even if they run the table. Those kids may have played their asses off, but there's no effort component in the rankings, sorry. A one loss Virginia Tech or Oklahoma team, for example, would be much more deserving to get an at large bid. It's a shitty deal for the non-BCS conferences, but that's the way it's been for decades.
On a slightly difference subject, what do all of you think will be done with the Big East's automatic BCS bid next year since Miami, VT, and BC are moving to the ACC? If they take away their automatic bid, maybe that third at large bid could automatically go to the top team from the non-BCS conferences. Just a thought.
I could have sworn it was right after BCS started but you are right BCS had not started yet. Ugh. Well still BYU would have not played a BCS game had it been in affect and Wyoming was screwed as well because they were not in a major conference.
If the Big East can not find schools to replace the ones they lost I think their will just be a third at large bid unless they give another conference the automatic spot which I am not sure they would.
NIU Coach to his players if they win out the season:
I'm sorry boys. You played your butts off and won every game this season. I'm sorry cause you wasted your time. It didn't matter if you won every game or lost, you were still going to get pissed on because you picked a school that hasn't been a big name. And now people are going to laugh at you becuase you were stupid to pick our school. But do us a favor, don't tell your friends in your neighborhood's that coming here is a waste of your time.
The players know when they go there that they won't be competing for the National title. It's nice to be sarcastic, but you're totally ignoring the point. They aren't one of the two best teams in the country. The reason those players chose to go there is because that was the highest level of team that recruited them. They didn't choose between Miami and NIU. They don't have the talent and they don't have the schedule to compete for a National title.
Maybe they made the choice to go to NIU to try to elevate the program to National status. But, stupid them. I guess they forgot that the big programs, and fans of the big programs, want history to play a bigger role than records.
Daunte Caulpepper is a good example. He was recruited by UCF after Miami and Florida State turned him down because they thought his SAT scores were questionable. UCF took the chance on him.
After showing what a great quarterback he was, and keeping a high 3 point GPA, Miami and FSU came knocking on his door to try to lure him in. He stayed with UCF because they took him when the Big schools didn't, and he wanted to do everything he could for UCF in return. He passes up any chance of the Heisman or a National Championship to stay with a smaller school to elevate them.
Should we let his kind of effort and dedication die in vain? Or should we start holding schools accountable to their win-loss records? Now, if NIU or TCU lose, sure, drop them below all the current 1 loss teams. But until they lose, they deserve to ranked like a 0 loss team. Otherwise, these smaller schools will NEVER have a chance of competing with the big schools. And we will just have the same 5 champions for the rest of College Football. BORING. I want competition, not just waiting to see which one of them takes it this year.
Your point has nothing to do with the best team winning. If you seriously believe that NIU is one of the elite teams in the country, you are mistaken. They do not recruit the same level of athletes. I don't see why that is such a hard concept to grasp. They don't play the type of schedule that would allow them to compete. It wouldn't be fair to the rest of the teams that they play a grueling schedule while these guys don't and are competing for the same prize.
NCAA football is about money, that's why the power conferences are the BCS schools. Because they have money and can draw money. That is how the world works and it isn't going to change.
And it's people like you that the BCS wants. "We can't do anything about, so why complain?"
Well, I hate to tell you this, but we can do something about.
And schools like NIU are the ones that will help to change it. They have already beaten 3 BCS conference teams. So where is the dominance of the BCS conference teams? The MAC is considered a strong possibilty to become a BCS conference if Big East can't get some decent teams quick. Imagine the current Sophmores at Pitt that came to try for a National Championship, and all of a sudden are removed from any chance of getting it. They didn't change the team, or its skill, they just lost those three precious letters.
If you want to throw win-loss records out the window and go off plain team talent, Ohio State never would have made the National Championship game. Nobody in their right mind will tell you that, before New Year's Day, that Ohio State was one of the Top 2 talented teams in America that year. But, Ohio State was able to scrape by in some many games that they made it in on their lack of losses.
But, since Ohio State came from the Big 10, they get to enjoy the fun of that record. Forget the people like Michael Turner that have tried to earn the spot. He has only rushed for 756 yards this year. He ran for 1900 yards last year. He was only 100 short of Larry Johnson, and he didn't even get a single mention for it because he plays for a MAC team.
Is NIU the 3rd most talented team in NCAA right now? No, but do they deserve the spot right now? Yes.
In fact, I would even like to see NIU against Ohio State. I beat you they could give Ohio State a run for their money, maybe even upset them. NIU has one of the top running backs right now, one hell of kicker (you really should see Azar kick.) and a decent QB with some good recievers.
If NIU played in the Big 10 this year, I bet they would finish in the top 3 in the conference.
1. Ohio State has as much talent as any team in the country if you follow recruiting.
2. NIU would not be in the top half of the Big Ten. There are seven Big Ten teams in the top 20. They are not that good of a team.
I don't see what part of this you are having a problem with. They don't have the talent to compete with top teams or they don't play a tough enough schedule to be considered? I don't want any of your other bullshit, I want to know how you can justify putting them in the national title hunt knowing that is the case. I think you know that they are not among the elite teams.
1. Recruiting doesn't mean shit now. In a couple of years it will make a difference. Freshman players don't mean shit. They ride the bench most of the year. Most of the field will be Seniors and Juniors, with some talented Sophmores.
2. I really think they would be. But, we will never know because they will end up playing in some shit bowl against Rocco's School for the Blind.
I'm having a problem with a system that discourages smaller schools from trying to better themselves because they don't have a chance in this system. It favors older schools, and if you aren't on the BCS list of schools that are allowed to play, you are shit. No matter how good the talent is on your team.
And they can't play a tough enough schedule because the top schools won't pick them on their schedule. They are good enough to possible create an upset, but too low in the BCS system to count for any points for a win. Why play a team that may beat you, but doesn't benefit you? Once again, the system doesn't allow schools like NIU to have a chance.
It's simple. If you win, you should be rewarded for your win. If you lose, you should be punished. The top teams know that playing in a tough conference can cost you the national title chance. This is why the automatic entries were created for the Top 6 conferences. But win you teams like FSU with their 7-5 record getting an automatic bid, it's pathetic.
HOTTY TODDY!
Go Rebels!
Ole Miss beat Alabama today to go 3-0 in the SEC for the first time since Archie Manning was a senior. But we still have LSU and Auburn to play. And it is a rare thing for Ole Miss to beat LSU and Alabama in the same season.
Since Archie?! Wow, that's a long time between 3-0's in the division. Man, but doesn't it make sense that Eli, in his senior year, is the one to do it.
Yup. First time since the 70's.
How about those Michigan State Spartans? First place by themselves in the Big Ten now. John "Lansing" Smith has done a tremendous job turning that program around so quickly and if the final minute of meltdowns never happened against Louisiana Tech they would still be undefeated.
Bring on U of M in two weeks. East Lansing will be rocking. And I'll be there!
Great game by Ohio State's defense today. Score should have been about 29-6, but a win is a win. The offense is just so out of rhythm now. Luckily, Indiana and Penn State are next so they have a few weaker teams to get it together before facing Michigan State and Purdue at home and then going to Michigan. They should be 10-1 going in to Michigan if they can keep winning at home.
Agnlefan, now? Their offense has been MIA all year. Ohio State should erect a monument to their defense and special teams. Without them they could very easily be 1-10 going into Michigan.
The offense for OSU is, without a doubt, the worst of the Top 25 teams. And the wierd part is that the offense has tons of talent on the team. They should be one of the best. Sometimes it is hard to figure these things out.
I know that the old rule of thumb is that offense makes the highlights, but defense wins games. But, if the offense can't do anything, you get games like Wisconsin. The offense needs to back up that stellar defense, of the defense will be too exhausted by the time Ann ARbor rolls around.
As for other football news, Nov. 1 looks like the day to decide New Orleans. Miami vs. VT, and OU vs. OSU.
Miami looked damn good today, with the running game suprising everybody. Payton has been waiting years for this chance, and is answering the call. And Tyrone Moss looks like he is going to be a great runner for years to come. I'm a tad bit more comfertable going into Virginia Tech now.
OSU vs. OU. Oklahoma State has prevented OU from doing anything for two years now. Can they preform the Tri-fecta? OSU is looking sharp as hell. OU will have to shut down that awsome pass to win this game.
Without a doubt Ohio State has the worst offense of the top 25 teams, but they don't have anywhere near the worst offensive talent. I just don't understand what the problem is. Obviously, Krenzel still has some problems with his elbow because he is not throwing well. Gamble, Jenkins, and Carter should make it easy for him. There isn't a better trio in the Big Ten. Looks like they will have to stay creative with the run game because it isn't going to get solved this year.
The schedule is very favorable until Michigan and they are also beatable, so there is hope.
WOOO! Go Virginia! How can you not love the Cavaliers? Their coach is Al Gore and they've got LeBron James!! He's been invisible tonight! Get him in the game, Al! Cavs RAWK!
And the Cavs choke. Damn, that missed snap was ugly.
I think the idea of moving Gamble of the punt return and into the offense, as they did today, will make a positive impact in the next few weeks. I don't think Krenzel is too much of the problem. I still feel the worst part of that offense is still the men in front of him. That offensive line is just horrible. I would really start looking to the bench and seeing who I could put in their. Make the starters feel like their jobs are in danger. Motivate them. Call in the voodoo lord if you have to.
They may even want to consider having some of the D-Line going both ways. At this point, I wouldn't rule out any idea.
And my Cavs break my orange and blue heart again.
Just read on ESPN.com an article that talks about our discussion.
When the BCS committee meets this year about the new contract, they are talking about possibly adding a clause that would garuntee a BCS bowl for any team that goes undefeated, and is ranked in the Top 12 of the BCS.
What does this mean? If it was in effect now, NIU would get a BCS bowl if they remained undefeated. They are expected to be 10 or 11 when the poll comes out in a few hours.
Many are screaming that they deserve a BCS spot anyways, if they remain undefeated. Tulane, however, went undefeated in 1998, and finished 11th. They didn't get a BCS bowl.
I think they should get this clause. It would give the smaller conferences and schools a much better playing field. Now, you have a chance at one of those $13 million dollar Bowls if you play good. And if you win that bowl, you have even more power to scream louder about how good you are.
Even with that, they still wouldn't play for the National Title.
No, but it sure does reward them a hell of a lot more than playing in the Motor City bowl against some pathetic team. It puts them in a bowl that makes good money, and gives them the chance to prove that they are a good team or not.
And if they win in a BCS bowl, then they plenty of grounds to start arguing that maybe they did deserve to be in the race to play for the National Title.
I hope Bowling Green beats Northern Illinois and ends this stupid discussion....
I don't think they will. My guess, NIU will go undefeated. Their offense is just too strong right now. Thier offense is one of the most balanced right now in Div-1A. TCU won't, however.
Last edited by DAKPluto; October 20th, 2003 at 5:41 PM.
Who's gonna beat TCU? **doesn't know their schedule**
Louisville, Cinn, and Southern Miss are their three biggest worries left.
WOOOO! WVU is up 14-0 on VT!! The Buckeyes will be back in it before you can say...(I'll tell you later).
*doesn't get his hopes up*
WOOHOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The Mountaineers did it!! Damn, this helps Miami in tons of ways.
Puts more validation to the close game with Miami, and shows us how to beat 'em next week. Hell ya!!
Now, if OSU upsets OU for the third straight year, this race is wide open.
For Ohio State to make it, it will still take some work. FSU has to lose again, maybe against Florida.
Georgia has to lose, but with Florida, Auburn, and possibly Auburn again, they can.
Ohio State still has to survive the toughest parts of its schedule. And if they are going to do that, something needs to happen to their offense fast.
One last comment I thought of.
You know who else is cheering? Little ol NIU. Look at their picture now.
If they beat 23rd ranked Bowling Green this week, they do stand a good chance for a BCS bowl.
Take a look. With a win over Bowling Green, NIU should come over VT in the human polls, since WVU was unranked (although underrated.)
Georgia has two/three tough games left. Florida State isn't clear yet. OSU isn't clear yet. Purdue isn't clear yet. USC and Washington State still met each other.
So NIU (assuming they win the season) has one garunteed spot to gain with USC/WSU. Going over VT, if VT loses to Miami will happen. Ohio State/Purdue is going to be another spot.
Law of averages says FSU or Georgia will lose a game, most likely Georgia.
That is a possible 4 spots right there. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is spot number 6. That is the spot that NIU is aiming for. Now, teams below them have the chance to pass them, and they also have the chance to pass more than 4 above them. But this makes them a lot happer. They very well could play in the BCS.
Nebraska, LSU, and Michigan State would all likely pass NIU if they keep winning. I wouldn't bet on seeing NIU in a BCS bowl just yet. They need tons of help.
It kills me to think that if Michigan State hadn't blown that game against LA Tech (where Smoker got injured after racking up 250 yards in the first quarter) by letting up 2 touchdowns in the last minute they would be undefeated and probably ranked #3 right now.
But they would still have to come to Columbus.
Think of who you are talking about. I seriously doubt those three teams are going to win out.
Nebraska will lose the Big 12 Championship Game. LSU won't even see the SEC Championship game. Michigan State, although much better, won't win the Beg Ten.
NIU doesn't need much help. And many people are already saying that they should get a BCS bowl if they do win out and finish in the Top 12. Mainly because this is expected to be a clause entered into the new BCS contract starting in 2006. It would state that any team from a non-BCS conference that is undefeated and in the Top 12 would get an automatic entry into a BCS bowl.
Makes tons more sense than sending a 7-4 team to a BCS bowl, like FSU last year.
NIU is going to lose to someone anyway....I'm betting an upset by Bowling Green or Toledo. Then, this conversation will be pointless. TCU......will not remain undefeated either. Right now, it doesn't look as though Miami or Oklahoma will lose, so......
NO BCS CONTROVERSY!
**cheers**
USC, Auburn, Florida St., and the Big Ten champion swallow automatic bids. TCU and NIU stay out of the BCS, and all is well.
Michigan State is playing better than anyone in the Big 10 right now. If LSU gets by Auburn this Saturday then they should make the SEC championship. And don't dismiss Nebraska so easily, the Blackshirts are one of the best defenses in the country. If they do make the Big 12 Championship, with all the upsets this year, don't count them out. And that's assuming they play Oklahoma, which everyone seems to be doing. I wouldn't be surprised to see a Texas Tech or an Oklahoma State knock them off.
But even if you are right, remember that even if teams in front of them lose they may not drop below NIU. Also, two loss teams like Michigan and Auburn who could win out would probably pass NIU. I just think there's too much that needs to happen. I can't see NIU making the top 6.
Bowling Green is a better team and will beat NIU tomorrow.
What is all this talk that LSU and Auburn are going to be one of the teams to win the SEC West and play for the SEC title. Everyone knows that Ole Miss will be the SEC West Division winner this year.
They are undefeated in the SEC....right?
Ole Miss is 3-0 in the SEC and Auburn is 4-0 and I think LSU is 3-1.
Did you guys realize if things play out right that a three way tie between Georgia, Tenn., and Florida in the East would be decided by a vote of SEC ADs. There is something about it on sportsline.com
I love how everybody is blowing off NIU versus Bowling Green.
All I can say is this, tomorrow, I'll be on here to let you know that I told you so
In fact, I don't even think it will be close. BG's defense can't stop NIU offense. Right now, they have one of the best offense around.
Blah, stupid NIU. The rain killed them. Their offense doesn't lend itself to slippery ground very well. Damn it, there goes another chance to prove how stupid the BCS is.
Now Oklahoma is going to have to lose so we can show how stupid this BCS system is.
Other than NIU, only other "major" news so far would be Georgia. They barely scraped by UAB (yes, that UAB.) They will fall below USC now.
I think today was a great example of why a team should not be considered for the title game if they don't play in one of the power conferences. All of these teams in the Big Ten, SEC, Big 12, Pac 10, etc. have to play tough teams week after week. Just look at how tough the Big Ten is this year. It's competely unfair for a school that plays far inferior competition to be compared to the major teams of college football. NIU couldn't even go undefeated only playing a handful of quality opponents. If BG hadn't played Ohio State, they would supposedly be championship game worthy right now. Clearly, they aren't. Smaller schools would not be able to play in a major conference and win.
In other news, Purdue, go back to basketball. God, that was fucking sad. They looked like Notre Dame out there today. Also, how the hell did we lose to Wisconsin? At least they're out of the way now.
Oklahoma only has two teams on their schedule that are currently in the Top 25. What the hell happened to the Big 12?
Whoooooooo!
HOTTY TODDY!
4-0 in SEC play.
Only SEC undefeated in SEC play(unless Auburn makes a miracle comeback).
Go REBELS!!!!!
Ole Miss has 3 tough games left though. Auburn and LSU are going to be hard and that is obvious. The least obvious hard game is the Egg Bowl against State. Records go out the window for that game. Plus it is Jackie Sherril's last game and it is in Starkville.
Anyway Ole Miss has a good chance of going to the SEC title game in my view.
I think you are missing one big picture here. Big 10 has been tough, yes. But, Big Ten teams haven't favored too good outside of their own conference this year. How is this any different than one of the "lower" conferences?
Let's take a look:
Northwestern: Lost to Air Force and Miami(OH)
Indiana: Lost to UConn, Washington, and Kentucky
Michigan State: Lost to Louisana Tech
Michigan: Lost to Oregon
Minnesota: Won outside their conference, but played the easiest out of conference schedule in the Big Ten.
Ohio State: Has won outside the conference, barely.
Penn State: Lost to BC and Nebraska
Wisconsin: Lost to UNLV
Illinois: Lost to Missouri, UCLA, Cal
Iowa: Won all theirs.
Purdue: Lost to Bowling Green
Only three teams won outside of their conference, and one was so pathetically easy that it shouldn't even count (Minnesota)
However, 6 of the lost games came from "lesser" conferences. And the first place team in the Big Ten (MSU) lost to one of them, and so did one of the 2nd place teams (Purdue)
So, is the Big Ten really such a dominating force against the smaller conferences? Not really, Only 2 of the top teams in the conference (Ohio State and Michigan) didn't lose to a small conference team. And they ain't even leading their own conference.
That's a weak argument. Put any of those teams in the Big Ten and make them play eight games against Big Ten teams after having played three or four non conference games, usually against two power conference teams and see how they do. Is it fair that they can't compete for the national title? Maybe not. Would it be fair if they could playing a comparatively weak schedule? No way.
The only reason Michigan State lost to LA Tech was Jeff Smoker was injured.
Jeff racked up 250 yards of offense in the the first QUARTER. After that, when he was injured, Damon Dowdell struggled to get 50 yards for the rest of the game.
If Jeff hadn't have went down that game would have been a blow out.
You are going to try to argue that a game was responsible for 1 person?I'm sure even Anglefan will agree that this is no excuse.
Michigan State was leading 13-7 at the half. Smoker has nothing to do with the fact that Michigan State gave up 13 points in the 4th quarter.
Smoker has nothing to do with the fact that Luke McCown of LA Tech passed for 436 yards. Smoker has nothing to do with the fact that Shawn Piper caught 10 passes for 171 yards, an average of 17.1 yards per catch.
No, this loss rest right on the shoulders of a Michigan State defense that thought they had the game in the bag, and played down to their opponet, thinking they were a "lesser" school. And they got punished for it.
This is what this year has shown. The "smaller" conferences are not as weak as they used to be. The line between strong conferences and weak conferences is slowly starting to get pretty fuzzy. Now, the BCS committee and the NCAA have the option of allowing them to keep getting stronger, making the seasons even more exciting, or pushing those schools back down and just allowing the same 8-10 schools share Championships for the rest of time. (Boring)
Anglefan, what are you talking about? They played Big Ten teams, and many of them beat the top teams in the conference. This should be a sign to you that maybe they are getting a lot better than you are giving them credit for.
If Smoker hadn't gone down State would have hung over 40 points on them and the late touchdowns would be inconsequential.
When Smoker was in the game LA Tech simply could not stop him. He had 135 yards passing in the firs quarter and Jaren Hayes had over 100 yards rushing in the first quarter.
When he left the game they couldn't spread the field and run the shotgun offense like they want to. Dowdell sat under center with two tight ends and couldn't move the ball anywhere. Late in the game on a third down he didn't like the fact that coach wanted to run the ball (and the clock) so he cowboyed up and ran a pass play. It fell incomplete and when LA Tech scored with 2 seconds left in the game, those 25 or so seconds he could have run off the clock started to look like they mattered.
States defense actually did a good job of not letting them score after letting up a big 1st quarter play until there was a minute left in the game. And even then, they had stopped them on 4th down with a big sack, but a face mask call gave them the first down and moved them inside the 20. From there everything broke down. Freshman QB Drew Stanton dropped the onside kick, he had it in his hands, and he dropped it.
Never mind. I don't want to talk about this game anymore.
That is sad that anybody thinks a game can rely on 1 person. The other 60 some people on the team don't matter, just that one person
To be a great team, you have to be able to play without a key member. This is what makes teams like Miami, OU, and even Ohio State special. Ohio State was able to perform last year without Clarett in many games. They have been able to perform this year without Clarett and without Krenzel for several games. But, Ohio State also witnessed how you have to rely on the bench sometimes. They learned this in Wisconsin. Even taking out the top QB (in a very dirty way, BTW) wasn't enough. The backup came in and the offense didn't miss a beat. Sorgi wasn't some vital key that couldn't be replaced, like Smoker apparently is. The team stayed with their plan and didn't change.
Michigan State however proved that they can't rely on the bench. This will be their downfall. And playing in a conference known for their power and brute strength, this will kill them before the end of the season.
As you can see, the seven teams in the Big Ten that are going to Bowls this year only lost four non conference games. Michigan's was on the road to a team in a power conference. MSU would have won had Smoker not gotten hurt, no doubt. BG is a good team. There are always going to be upsets. Since the Michigan game wasn't really an upset, that means the meat of the Big Ten was only beaten three times in the non conference schedule.
The point is, those little schools would not be able to beat Big Ten teams every single week. One week is meaningless. Northwestern beat Wisconsin, that doesn't mean they are better or can compete for the Big Ten title.
Oh, gee, is that all. Only 4?
But your bottom 4 teams account for 10 losses. What makes them anymore worthy than the schools from the lower conference?
Yeah, to a 5-3 team though, that also lost a game to a lower conference team.Michigan's was on the road to a team in a power conference.
Hint, there is 21 other guys on the field that play for the team. Maybe if they played like a power conference team, then Smoker wouldn't have to play to beat a shit ass team.MSU would have won had Smoker not gotten hurt, no doubt.
But they are a non-power conference team. How can they be good, remember?BG is a good team.
So the "toughest" conference lost three games to shit ass teams? Pathetic.There are always going to be upsets. Since the Michigan game wasn't really an upset, that means the meat of the Big Ten was only beaten three times in the non conference schedule.
Oh, and Michigan's lost not an upset:You don't really believe yourself, do you?
My point is, they came in 3 times and won. Maybe they deserve more credit than you deserve. I'm sure Bowling Green would be able to beat at least half of the teams in the Big Ten, had they been a part of it. And shouldn't that be enough? Or are you going to start calling for the removal of Penn State, Indiana, Illinois, and Northwestern?The point is, those little schools would not be able to beat Big Ten teams every single week. One week is meaningless. Northwestern beat Wisconsin, that doesn't mean they are better or can compete for the Big Ten title.
So what are you saying? Everybody who beats a Big 10 team should be let into the Big 10? I don't get your point.
There is a lot of talent in the country, the weak teams are no longer as weak as they used to be. But just because a team here and there can win a game here and there doesn't mean they belong. Every conference has good teams who loose to worse non conference teams.
Where the hell did I say that? What I have been saying, the whole time, is that maybe the lower schools deserve more credit and more chances than what they have been given.
DING! DING! DING! That's what I've been saying the whole damn time!! They have been getting better. This is why their chances and oppertunities should get better to. But, right now, they aren't.There is a lot of talent in the country, the weak teams are no longer as weak as they used to be.
But haven't you noticed that it happens more than it did in the past? Why do you think the MAC has gotten such a buzz lately? Because every year it seems like they are upsetting more and more BCS conference teams.But just because a team here and there can win a game here and there doesn't mean they belong. Every conference has good teams who loose to worse non conference teams.
An interesting stat I saw earlier this year (during the Utah vs. Oregon game) was that the Mtn. West conference actually had a winning % against BCS teams that year. They were something like 11-5 versus schools from the power conferences. That's a pretty substantial amount. It should be a big wake up call to everybody that the non-power conferences aren't the shabby, pathetic conferences they use to be. They are starting to get some really good teams that are becoming at the level where they can start competing with the "big boys."
DAKblick, I don't feel like arguing with you anymore because you become irrational. Michigan losing to Oregon was not an upset. And there were only three of the seven bowl teams in the Big Ten upset. In sports, upsets always happen. You still can't refute the point that they couldn't compete in the Big Ten. If you think you can, you're kidding yourself. Don't laugh at my points, especially when I am right.
How the hell is Michigan losing to Oregon not an upset? Oregon fucking sucks this year.
Don't take my word for it though:
http://www.gwinnettdailyonline.com/G...F0ACFB25AE.asp
http://www.michigandaily.com/vnews/d.../3f6c9bb11e25a
And I can't say they wouldn't compete in the Big Ten. If Michigan State can go from the shit ass year they had last year to the performance they are having this year, anybody can do it. If given the chance. Or is Michigan State just producing upsets all year? Because last year they couldn't compete in the Big Ten at all. Right now, the lower conference schools don't get those chances because the big conferences and the BCS system won't let them have that chance.
Michigan State can go from shit ass team to powerhouse because they can recruit kids off the hopes of doing big things. After a good year, when recruiting should be good, schools like NIU, Bowling Green, and TCU have nothing to offer.
My final point, the schools did what was required of them to prove they deserve some chances. They won key games against top schools.
The most important weekend in NCAA football is this weekend Nov 1st!!!!!!!1111
14th ranked Oklahoma State in the BCS vs. 1st ranked OU in the BCS.
Bedlam weekend is going to be sweet. I attend OSU but I rather that OU wins and wins the championship and then next year we kick their ass.
But we are up 2 wins on them so it is hard to say what the outcome will be.
As an Ohio State fan, I hope that...
Oklahoma State beats Oklahoma
Virginia Tech beats Miami
Washington State beats USC
Florida beats Georgia
Amazingly, I think these are all at least possible.
OU vs. OSU, shouldn't happen. But it shouldn't happen for the last two years. So maybe.
VT vs. Miami, I wouldn't hold my breath on that one. And I'm not just saying this as a Miami fan. I don't think VT can handle Miami. The only chance they will have is trying to play Beamer ball on our new kickers. But with lines in front of the kickers like we have, It isn't likely.
Wash. State vs. USC. Least likely to happen. I don't think Wash. State has a snowball chance in hell. Look for a big blowout here.
Florida vs. Georgia: The most likely to happen. Florida always has Georgia's number, and Florida has been hot, where Georgia has been playing like shit.
At the most, you will get two of your four. But, it is a start. But, Ohio State needs to worry more about winning out. They hit the toughest part of the schedule now.
Please explain why it shouldn't happen??
Two schools in the big school and also in the same State! How can you not have bedlam?? There is Miami vs. Florida. Texas vs. Texas Tech and also A&M.
So justify your statement.
Why? Because OU has the best team in the nation right now. In theory, they shouldn't lose to anybody.
To be perfectly honest, I think OU will win out the whole year. I don't think even Miami can beat them this year. Jason White is the best QB around right now, and has the team surrounding him to allow him to be the best.
To put it simply, OU is a much better team than OSU.
Oh, one other note.
Yes, in a rivilary game, the differences in the teams do tend to shrink. But, in this case, it still shouldn't make much difference. OU should still win this game with thier talent. Not always the case, as the last two years have shown us, but they should win.
Should and will are not always the same though.
And on a third note, did anybody else see that the Democrats in the state of California are trying to get all California schools kicked out of the NCAA?
They want student athletes to be paid by the schools, and to have agents. This is very much against NCAA policy.
Imagine NCAA if Cal, USC, UCLA, etc. were all kicked out of the NCAA.
http://espn.go.com/ncaa/news/2003/1028/1649193.html
Well, tomorrow is the big day.
Survival Saturday they are calling it.
Either the national picture race will be much, much clearer, or will turn into a huge race.
A loss by either Miami, Oklahoma, or both will give just about any 1 loss team a chance. However, both schools also have a chance at one loss, so both will still be in the running themselves.
But, historically, the earlier the loss, the better. So, USC looks to be in a good spot. If USC beats Washington State, they will be in, most likely, with a Miami or OU loss.
But they will be big Florida fans this weekend.
If both teams lose, USC and possibly Georgia or FSU is in.
Ohio State: They need a good deal of help. They will need losses by USC, Georgia or FSU, and Michigan State (Ohio State will have to deliver this loss, of course) Get that, and they are in. But, Ohio State can't worry about that. They have to win out their schedule, and they have now hit the bulk of it. One slip by that offense, and they won't even be in a BCS bowl.
Florida State: They need help too. A Miami loss doesn't help them. Taking into account past records, the Quality Win will keep Miami above Florida State, even if both win out. FSU really needs a loss by OU to have a chance.
Georgia: Florida, Florida, Florida. That is one of two key games left. If Georgia can beat Florida, and the SEC championship, they just might still come out over USC. But, I don't think they will win out. Not the way they have been playing. LSU for the SEC
USC: Keep doing what you have been doing, you can beat Washington State. All you need is one of the top two to lose, and you are in.
Everybody below those teams, you need tons of help that I can't spend the time getting into. Only one that has a good control of their fate is Nebraska. They win the Big 12, they may just be able to do it.
Oh well, my prediction for the Sugar Bowl: OU vs. Miami
My predicted winner: I hate to say it, but OU. I think they have the best team in the land this year, and can't be beat.
WTF!
Ole Miss says they are going to hold McClendon out of today's game because of possible rules violations. Okay cool. Sucks that our all-purpose yards leader is out until cleared up but cool.
So I am sitting here watching my stat tracker of the game and all the sudden I see that McClendon is in the game in the 4th quarter. Okay if that was not strange enough he was playing QB instead of RB. WTF! Since when was he the back up QB? And why is Eli taking a break. I know that they are up 22 or 22 points but still. Even then why McClendon?
Anyway Ole Miss is winning and will still be undefeated in SEC play barring a comeback here. Whooooo! We are well on our way to the SEC title game at least unless we blow the next three games.
Edit: Bah. SC just threw a 98 yard TD. Putting them 10 points out with 6 minutes left.Ole Miss has one of the worst pass defenses but one of the best rush defenses.
Edit2: Son of a.....3 point game with a little less than 2 minutes left.
Last edited by MTR; November 1st, 2003 at 4:48 PM.
Looks like the stat tracker was fucked up earlier. McClendon did not play. Eli was the only one that played QB now that I have gone back and looked at stats.
*exhales*
Oh God, I'm going to be sick. Once again the Buckeyes barely pull it out. Doesn't matter if you win by 1 or 100, a win is a win.
WOOOO! Bring on the Spartans!
All I have to say is OU is the greatest team in NCAA football. And they are going to go all the way and win the championship.
Looking at the rest of OU's schedule they have to play Texas A&M (OK State beat them), Baylor (shit team), and Texas Tech (OK State beat them)
And right now Virginia Tech is up 17 nothing against Miami in the 3rd. I laughed out loud when I saw that.
Miami can kiss their championship game good bye.
Miami is going down, and it looks like the BCS will get tested this year after all.
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