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Thread: WWE What Ifs

  1. #101
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    I would have loved to see Bret debut at the Lethal Lottery. Having him take DDP's place. DDP was an alternate and I think this might be where Vince got the idea with Austin at the Rumble since DDP was eliminated and came back in to win the thing. But it would have been great to see Bobby Walker injured only for Bret to show up and win the thing. The winner got a world title shot so it would only be fitting to see Bret win it in his debut. DDP never got the title shot anyway so it would make more sense.

    The deal was only for three years so I would probably see Bret returning after the three years was up after getting stuck in the mid card due to the NWO. He might have been the alternate instead of Sting to lead the NWO if Hogan refused. Of course this would probably mean that he would eventually become a member. Until Piper comes into the picture and Bret switches sides. Sorry Mongo you out of team Piper. But he would be feuding with the Horsemen at this point. When he returns his feud with Austin would get to begin and we know the great chemistry those two would have in the ring since HBK was out of the picture by then and the Hart Foundation stable would start at that point.

    In WWF world this means no screw job resulting in Neidhart and Bulldog sticking around and Owen staying in a tag team with Bulldog which keeps him alive. Pillman would get the main event slot vs Austin instead of Bret. Come to think of it, him signing could have been the best thing because the chain it would have caused.
    Last edited by Bluegunn; March 25th, 2022 at 4:13 AM.

  2. #102
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I'd have to go and research the timeline but I wonder if Bret would've been able to leave the WWF and BRET would be the 3rd man at Bash at the Beach.

    Bischoff tries to spin it that the general idea was that Hall and Nash returned to take over WCW due to how they were treated. But how does Hogan fit in that narrative? It was no doubt a WWF invasion. Imagine the #1 babyface leaving WWF and joining his fellow main eventers Diesel and Razor. It would've been a crazy approach, especially with Bret always talking about how Hogan wouldn't wrestle him. Now Bret would finally get his match.

    WCW lead by Hogan? No heel turn from Hogan, how does that work out for him? Maybe Hollywood happens down the road?

  3. #103
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    If I remember correctly Bret resigned with the WWF right before Survivor Series '96, so he was probably a free agent between WM12 and then.

  4. #104
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Bret had one of those deals where he had to appear before the deal ended. So he was away for awhile. So if he wanted to go to WCW early he would have to return early and probably job to Austin. But his official deal ran out after his match with bulldog in September. He signed to return a month after. So if he waited that would put him to return around the same time as piper. Pretty sure he would be pro piper at first if he waited.
    Last edited by Bluegunn; March 28th, 2022 at 9:13 AM.

  5. #105
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Here's a wild one:

    What if Million $ Man won the Mania 4 tournament?

    What does Mania 5 look like? Do we get Mega Powers and do they explode?? WWF was still very much a babyface territory so seeing Ted with the title until the following Mania seems like a stretch. Fantasy booking Ted loses the title back to Savage at Summerslam and we still wind up with Savage turning heel facing Hogan at Mania 5.

  6. #106
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    I've read numerous times that the original plan was for Randy Savage to win the IC title from the Honky Tonk Man and for Ted DiBiase to win the WWF title at WMIV, I do think Bruce Prichard denied that. Pretty sure that HTM himself has said in shoots that the original plan was for him to drop the IC title to Savage at The Main Event but that he refused and they had Savage win by count out instead. Both Honky and Bruce are kind of known shit talkers though so who knows..

    I really don't know how they would get to the Mega Powers exploding, Savage turning heel on Hogan and Hulk winning back the WWF title if Savage was IC champ and Ted DiBiase WWF champ. From what I understand the plan was always to have the Mega Powers explode at WMV right from when they were formed (September-October '87).

    /Guess they could have done IC champ Savage vs. WWF champ DiBiase at SS with Savage winning and having to relinquish the IC title just like the Warrior after WMVI. Hogan could have had his feud ender with André at SummerSlam inside the cage instead of doing that match at WrestleFest one month earlier.
    Last edited by OD50; March 28th, 2022 at 10:43 AM.

  7. #107
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    I've read numerous times that the original plan was for Randy Savage to win the IC title from the Honky Tonk Man and for Ted DiBiase to win the WWF title at WMIV, I think Bruce Prichard denied that though. I really don't know how they would get to the Mega Powers exploding, Savage turning heel on Hogan and Hulk winning back the WWF title if Savage was IC champ and Ted DiBiase WWF champ. From what I understand the plan was always to have the Mega Powers explode at WMV right from when they were formed (September-October '87).
    It was probably one of a few ideas to get the title off HTM. I could see him losing to any of the top midcard babyfaces like Savage, Steamboat, Snake, even Beefcake or Duggan. Warrior was lightning in a bottle and they were smart banking on him over everyone else.

    Hypothetically if Savage gets a 2nd run with IC it would be a short run where he drops it prior to Summerslam and then turns around and beats Dibiase. Just like Bret in 1992. He lost the IC strap at Summerslam, Sept he's the WWF champ. Only I don't see this title change happening untelevised. It would be either Summerslam or a SNME.

    My question is, when did they come up with the Mega Powers angle? It's been several years since I listened to the Prichard podcast episodes about these events so I don't remember if this was something planned at Mania 4. I'm not talking necessarily the break up but just the idea of why are we having Hogan help Savage? Just that quick rub before No Holds Barred filming?

  8. #108
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    It was probably one of a few ideas to get the title off HTM. I could see him losing to any of the top midcard babyfaces like Savage, Steamboat, Snake, even Beefcake or Duggan. Warrior was lightning in a bottle and they were smart banking on him over everyone else.

    Hypothetically if Savage gets a 2nd run with IC it would be a short run where he drops it prior to Summerslam and then turns around and beats Dibiase. Just like Bret in 1992. He lost the IC strap at Summerslam, Sept he's the WWF champ. Only I don't see this title change happening untelevised. It would be either Summerslam or a SNME.

    My question is, when did they come up with the Mega Powers angle? It's been several years since I listened to the Prichard podcast episodes about these events so I don't remember if this was something planned at Mania 4. I'm not talking necessarily the break up but just the idea of why are we having Hogan help Savage? Just that quick rub before No Holds Barred filming?
    The Mega Powers formed at the SNME from Hershey, I think it was taped in September '87 but aired in October. From what I've read the Mega Powers exploding angle was planned all along and the main reason for them teaming up. They also wanted Savage to have a little "Hulkster dust" sprinkled on him (Prichards words not mine..) to make him even more over and the perfect guy to draw at the gate and hold the belt warm when Hogan went off to film No Holds Barred. The cynic in me have a feeling that Hogan saw Savage getting white hot after WMIII and did the same thing he did one year earlier against Paul Orndorff, who also was starting to get crazy over as a face. A) Rescue him from heels to show what a great guy you are. B) Team up. C) Become "best friends". D) Have him turn heel on you. E) Defeat him all over the country.

  9. #109
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    The Mega Powers formed at the SNME from Hershey, I think it was taped in September '87 but aired in October. From what I've read the Mega Powers exploding angle was planned all along and the main reason for them teaming up. They also wanted Savage to have a little "Hulkster dust" sprinkled on him (Prichards words not mine..) to make him even more over and the perfect guy to draw at the gate and hold the belt warm when Hogan went off to film No Holds Barred. The cynic in me have a feeling that Hogan saw Savage getting white hot after WMIII and did the same thing he did one year earlier against Paul Orndorff, who also was starting to get crazy over as a face. A) Rescue him from heels to show what a great guy you are. B) Team up. C) Become "best friends". D) Have him turn heel on you. E) Defeat him all over the country.
    Smart if that was actually Hogan's doing. Huge gates against both men. Iconic angles. Orndorff definitely worked better as a heel and Savage was never going to be Hogan especially in the late 80's.

    I just don't see the IC title factoring in to any of this which is why I'm going to believe Bruce 100%.

  10. #110
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Smart if that was actually Hogan's doing. Huge gates against both men. Iconic angles. Orndorff definitely worked better as a heel and Savage was never going to be Hogan especially in the late 80's.

    I just don't see the IC title factoring in to any of this which is why I'm going to believe Bruce 100%.
    Yeah, I do feel like Savage was beyond the IC title at that point. He was definitely the best "interim" WWF champion they could possibly have had though, from what I understand he drew pretty damn good at the house between WMIV and WMV.

    /A sort of related "what if" is what would have happened to the IC title if Ricky Steamboat hadn't asked for "maternity leave" right after winning it in the biggest IC title match of all time? It's said that Butch Reed was supposed to get the title since Steamboat was leaving but he no-showed the Superstars taping and HTM was chosen instead. So when, and against whom would Steamboat have lost the title if he had stuck around? I still see HTM as a good candidate, he was getting really over as an obnoxious heel at the time and unlike the WWF title the IC title was more of a longish reign "heel" title (Muraco, Valentine, Savage). Rick Rude could have captured the IC title from Steamboat in fall/winter '87, keeping it for a bit and then being in Honky's spot at SummerSlam '88 against the Warrior.
    Last edited by OD50; March 29th, 2022 at 6:06 AM.

  11. #111
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    What if they did a Razor vs Diesel WWF title match in 94-95 during his reign? That’s a title match I felt they missed the boat on as Razor would’ve been a natural title contender.

  12. #112
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    What if they did a Razor vs Diesel WWF title match in 94-95 during his reign? That’s a title match I felt they missed the boat on as Razor would’ve been a natural title contender.
    I would've definitely preferred Razor v. Diesel instead of Diesel v. Mabel or British Bulldog. I wonder if Razor stayed if he would've turned heel in 1996 and feuded with Shawn??

  13. #113
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    A Razor/HBK ladder rubber match for the WWF title in 1996 with Razor back to being a heel would have been really cool.

  14. #114
    World Champion Dave Wyndorf's Avatar
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    What if wcw bought wwf

  15. #115
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald View Post
    What if wcw bought wwf
    I guess that depends on WHEN. If we're talking if roles were reversed and it's 2001, I doubt we'd have mainstream wrestling on tv after 2003-4. If WCW bought the WWF that means everyone involved in the WWF that makes the decisions died and/or went completely broke.

    I think we would've seen some people come together and we'd get something like TNA.

    Now if WCW bought the WWF in say 1996 we might have wrestling in the mainstream until maybe 2005 lol.

  16. #116
    The 'me' in 'team' Dreyski's Avatar
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    ukraine
    Who would have been the biggest beneficiary if the Womens' Revolution had happened twenty years earlier?

  17. #117
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Molly for sure. She would not have to go bald to get the match on the card.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreyski View Post
    Who would have been the biggest beneficiary if the Womens' Revolution had happened twenty years earlier?
    We'd all have been worse off if we hadn't gotten Trish and Stacey Kiebler et al in bra and panties matches

  19. #119
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    RTC came out of it at least.

  20. #120
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreyski View Post
    Who would have been the biggest beneficiary if the Womens' Revolution had happened twenty years earlier?
    Well I guess that depends on what you're talking about because 20+ years earlier we did get somewhat of a Womens Revolution when we went from Sable, Terri, Miss Kitty's titties to Trish, Lita, Molly, Victoria, Jazz giving us more actual wrestling.

    In America, there weren't too many Charlotte's hanging around. If you're talking about a more "wrestling" based women's division happening in 2002ish we were definitely getting that but the stench of the Attitude Era was still somewhat of a draw as well. Even today we're seeing women being able to show more, be more sexual in their appearances and angles (peep NXT for example).

    I think if you're talking about when we were getting people like Mickie James, Gail Kim, Beth Phoenix, Michelle McCool even they were getting some time and a lot of attention. I definitely think we could've seen the WWE use them a little more in higher profile situations. There's a reason TNA heavily improved once Gail, Mickie, and Victoria came over because they were some of the best women in America.

  21. #121
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    What if............?

    What if Vince Russo doesn't leave the WWF? What if Russo is given the bump in pay he requested due to having to write an extra show (Smackdown)?

  22. #122
    The 'me' in 'team' Dreyski's Avatar
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    ukraine
    David Arquette becomes WWE champion.
    Dominic Mysterio on a pole match?

  23. #123
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreyski View Post
    David Arquette becomes WWE champion.
    Dominic Mysterio on a pole match?
    lol. Well we have to remember those things were done in WCW. I mean they've had "on a pole" matches way before Russo ever entered the business.

    I wish I could remember who's idea it was to put the World title on Chyna. Not saying it was a bad idea, kind of sounds like him. I'm just curious what people think the landscape might look like had he stayed. From all accounts aside from maybe Jim Cornette he wasn't exactly a piece of shit. He just did better with McMahon over him.

  24. #124
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    All joking aside. So who does he book to run over Austin? How does he Debut Angle?

    Big Show also does not get title run with Russo which was not that good to begin with.

    Last Smackdown Russo wrote involved a mud wrestling match with Ivory and the Kat where she loses her top. First thing they did when Russo gone was break up Y2J and Mr Hughes. So he left a week before No Mercy and Jarrett leaves with him after the PPV.
    Last edited by Bluegunn; April 9th, 2022 at 10:44 AM.

  25. #125
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    If what Tito Santana claimed was true and he was picked to be champ instead of Bret and Vince decides Mexico over Canada what happens? Santana vs flair had a couple good matches

  26. #126
    World Champion Dave Wyndorf's Avatar
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    "Tito screwed Tito"

  27. #127
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    What if Jesse hadn't called him Chico one too many times?

  28. #128
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I still don't believe Tito when talking about he was almost World champion in 1992. He was almost 40 and hadn't really been pushed since the finals of the IC title tourny in spring 1990 against Perfect. That was kind of the passing the torch moment where you had the guy who was probably the biggest babyface to wear it in the 80's lose to the upcoming next big thing in Hennig. Bret was 35, not exactly a young pup but he looked young and was without a doubt one of the most popular rising stars.

    Think about this....How far in advance do you think Bret winning the title in 1992 was thought out? From August-October the title went from Savage to Flair to Bret. Unheard of booking style for WWF and really any promotion at the time. So did they pivot to Bret because Flair was going to be gone before Mania 9? Makes you wonder what role Flair was going to have. Maybe Flair v. Bret at Mania 9 and Hogan v. Yokozuna on the undercard? Wild.

  29. #129
    F this & JC that mth's Avatar
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    Far as I know, we never found out where the exploding limo storyline was supposed to go, right? So I guess my "what if?" is what if the Vince/exploding limo storyline was able to play out as intended?

    There's definitely a lot of meat to work with as you could have wrestlers accusing each other left and right and give a lot of midcarders some motivations for feuding. Obviously you can have your top angle where maybe a hapless babyface is being framed by a heel who is "defending Vince's honor" either legitimately or as BS cover for trying to get a championship match, build up to a big blow off match where you can do the big twist, it was actually the heel all along or maybe, and most likely I think, Vince faked his own death (revealed by him doing a run-in during the match, of course).

  30. #130
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    It was cringeworthy enough as is and dragging it out any longer than already would’ve been worse.

  31. #131
    F this & JC that mth's Avatar
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    Please elaborate.

  32. #132
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    Please elaborate.
    Okay quite happy to.

    Tbh I wasn’t in love with this angle in the first place and didn’t have much faith in a reveal. WWE are historically not the best at these long-term whodunnit angles. They had to backtrack Rikishi after that went shit so HHH paid him off. Vince’s illegitimate son. Was supposed to be Kennedy and circumstances yeah didn’t quite pan out but fuckin Hornswoggle? And let’s be honest, although there’s a suspension of disbelief involved with WWE, there’s way too much involved to do here in this case it’s Vince McMahon who’s the wrong type of figure to pretend to be blown up in this kind of angle as he’s the big boss and kayfabe and all, how could they let the McMahon family run things while real life, we know he’s fine plus not as if you can really publicise that shit in the real media. I don’t think it would have done much to get the culprit over anyway as again we know he’s fine and kayfabe-wise, why should he be pushed anyways?

    Best part (and more a piss-takey guilty laugh) was Paul London grinning at that. I also have a theory they may have regretted this which is why they had Vince in a coma and recover. Suspension of disbelief and all but I think this was a step too far.

    It’s like the A-Team shooting bullets and never hurting anyone and especially that episode where there was an exploding helicopter into a cliff face and the guys still walked out fine (sorry watched that one the other day). Funny but yeah maybe too ridiculous for today’s landscape.
    Last edited by Badger; April 15th, 2022 at 8:49 PM.

  33. #133
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Just rewatched the episode. Thinking they would have went through the ones speaking. Jesse, Trump, Foley, Austin. But detective Foley would probably be back on the case. Possibly the no shows could be blamed. This was right before the bastard child angle so Kennedy might have been an accomplice.
    Last edited by Bluegunn; April 15th, 2022 at 9:05 PM.

  34. #134
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    Just rewatched the episode. Thinking they would have went through the ones speaking. Jesse, Trump, Foley, Austin. But detective Foley would probably be back on the case. Possibly the no shows could be blamed.
    Though whoever was blamed, I don’t think it would have done much to legitimise them more anyway as trying to keep up with the pretense something as outlandish as that would be difficult today even by WWE standards.

  35. #135
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    With the release of Kushida makes me wonder how Kenta would have done if he only stayed healthy.

  36. #136
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    What if Nia Jax had not been a danger to work with, and hadn't gotten herself released for not getting the vaccine. Does anyone else think she was penciled in to beat the EST and be added to the Bloodline?

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    With the release of Kushida makes me wonder how Kenta would have done if he only stayed healthy.
    I don't know if they're one in the same other than being Japanese....It's like wondering after Tucker was released what would've happened with Chris Harris.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3puppies View Post
    What if Nia Jax had not been a danger to work with, and hadn't gotten herself released for not getting the vaccine. Does anyone else think she was penciled in to beat the EST and be added to the Bloodline?
    The first part about her supposedly being a danger to work with has nothing to do with anything else. It's wrestling. Asuka has knocked out 2 women on tv. The same night Nia Jax was chastised for doing something to Kairi Sane, Charlotte Flair stiffed a jobber with a spinning elbow and broke her jaw.

    WHAT IF...Nia Jax beat Bianca Belair and joined the Bloodline? It would've been interesting. Any time you add a female to male dominated group it adds something different immediately. Nia would've been like a Chyna imo. I could easily see her on the apron with the other 3 men facing 4 men and nobody thinking twice about it.

  38. #138
    Midcarder Tommi_Li's Avatar
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    What if The Rock came down to the ring to cost Roman Reigns the victory at WM38?

  39. #139
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Kushida and Kenta both started off strong, got stuck in the 205 division and then tagged with a partner only because they were both Japanese.
    But still, not sure what hhh wanted to do with Kenta had he stayed healthy.

  40. #140
    too big to fail Tainted Eclipse's Avatar
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    ussr
    what if Road Dogg got Billy Gunn's summer 1999 push? Dogg was MEGA over at the time. the easy answer is it doesn't matter because vince was never gonna push road dogg as a singles because of the look -- but hypothetically how far could he have gone with a real singles push? can't deny the crowd reactions

  41. #141
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    I think he was considered. He was an Armstrong after all. His issue was his drug problems at the time. Real question was why was he not given the nod to face gunn at the finals?

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tainted Eclipse View Post
    what if Road Dogg got Billy Gunn's summer 1999 push? Dogg was MEGA over at the time. the easy answer is it doesn't matter because vince was never gonna push road dogg as a singles because of the look -- but hypothetically how far could he have gone with a real singles push? can't deny the crowd reactions
    What people forget is that Road Dogg was going through some shit especially between 1999-2000/2001. Billy Gunn was also pretty over. Road Dogg even had the IC title before Billy.

    And that push Billy Gunn had in the summer of 1999 was a flop so I'm glad he didn't get that push. I honestly think they were meant to be tag-team legends. If Road Dogg did get the push I think that he could've pulled it off and taken it further than Billy.

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    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Agreed. I think they missed the boat on a proper Road Dogg vs Jarrett feud. Again turning Billy to feud with Jarrett after heel work against Rock. Talk about no direction. Billy could have feared with many other faces.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    Agreed. I think they missed the boat on a proper Road Dogg vs Jarrett feud. Again turning Billy to feud with Jarrett after heel work against Rock. Talk about no direction. Billy could have feared with many other faces.
    The weird thing for me is that despite 1999 being an extremely popular year for WWF, and wrestling in general, there were a lot of weird decisions going on. I was really struggling as a fan to enjoy the big 3 because they were doing too much all at once and felt like there was no real direction. Billy Gunn....ok you want to break him and Road Dogg up and try to move on from DX, that's fine. Problem is it was like with Roman Reigns. You saw the potential for a main eventer, it was just a little too soon to break up The Shield and then insert Roman into a main event feud with Randy Orton.

    Just like Billy wasn't ready to go from the tag scene, winning KOTR, and then feuding with The Rock of all people. I know Billy started getting a reputation of hurting people during this time. Maybe he had that reputation in general because I know Austin wasn't trying to work with him, Rock wasn't a big fan of having to work with him at Summerslam...but they had to make more stars. Remember they also started pushing Val Venis and Al Snow a little more around this time.

    Road Dogg had potential IMHO to be a top tier IC title babyface. He would probably have to change up his look a tiny bit to hit the main event scene but then again, look at Foley. Motherfucker main evented WrestleMania in sweats lol.

  45. #145
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    What if we got Corporate Ivan Koloff?

  46. #146
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    We would get the 3 stooges of the wwf. Imagine Koloff coming out to real American

  47. #147
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Let's jump back into the time machine. Survivor Series 1999. We're about to get IMHO the Attitude Era dream triple threat match with Austin v. The Rock v. Triple H for the WWF title. Austin is too fucked up to wrestle, they do the drive by angle, and Big Show steps in, wins the title.....

    WHAT IF Austin was able to wrestle that match? Was he going to win? Was he going to put over Trips or The Rock and have the surgery?

    Big Show winning and then going into a feud with Big Bossman sucked lol. IF he had gone in and feuded with Triple H and then Triple H parlays that win into the Cactus stuff, might've made Show a bigger deal. I just wonder if him winning as also a last minute decision. If Austin had been able to make it to that match I bet Rock/Trips wins and they continue to Mania.

    Which btw Mania 16 should've been Rock v. Triple H.

  48. #148
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    They just didn't commit to Triple H until the Cactus feud, despite him winning the World title. His first title win came on Raw after that convulted build up to Summerslam where the match changed a half dozen times, Mankind gets added then wins. Loses it before the next PPV to Vince McMahon. Wins it at Unforgiven in a massively over the top booked match. Beats Austin with more OTT booking then loses it to Big Show of all people. That period was all about crash TV as they established Smackdown and moved on from Russo, not really finding their feet until the influx of new talent (Radicalz, Jericho, Angle, Rikishi, Dudleyz, Tazz) got rolling after some growing pains.

    On the title match, I think they were always writing Austin out afterwards, as he was touch and go until the night before. Probably does a stretcher job after a sledgehammer shot or something with Trip winning, then either he comes back to win the title at 'Mania or it goes like it did. Foley turning heel against Rock for his Cactus Jack retirement swansong in the co-main.

  49. #149
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    They just didn't commit to Triple H until the Cactus feud, despite him winning the World title. His first title win came on Raw after that convulted build up to Summerslam where the match changed a half dozen times, Mankind gets added then wins. Loses it before the next PPV to Vince McMahon. Wins it at Unforgiven in a massively over the top booked match. Beats Austin with more OTT booking then loses it to Big Show of all people. That period was all about crash TV as they established Smackdown and moved on from Russo, not really finding their feet until the influx of new talent (Radicalz, Jericho, Angle, Rikishi, Dudleyz, Tazz) got rolling after some growing pains.

    On the title match, I think they were always writing Austin out afterwards, as he was touch and go until the night before. Probably does a stretcher job after a sledgehammer shot or something with Trip winning, then either he comes back to win the title at 'Mania or it goes like it did. Foley turning heel against Rock for his Cactus Jack retirement swansong in the co-main.
    I was actually there live for Triple H's first World title win. Ames, IA. So random even my oldest son is shocked Triple H of all people won his first World title here in Iowa. Austin didn't even show up to Raw despite being in town. Some radio personality bumped into him at the gym and then let everyone know he wouldn't be at the show. This lady and her young ass daughter behind us were PISSED he didn't show.

    I agree. A lot of title switching not just during 1999 but even 1998. It's crazy when you think about how Austin never had a long title reign until he went heel again at Mania 17. That was the longest reign he had, something like 4 months before dropping it to Angle.

  50. #150
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    What if Owen was alive to see the Hart Dynasty come to the WWE?

  51. #151
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WWXChairman View Post
    What if Owen was alive to see the Hart Dynasty come to the WWE?
    Explain. Are we talking Natalya/Kidd/DH Smith or the return of the family at Mania when Bret fought Vince?

  52. #152
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    2009 was when the trio came in so Owen would be 44. Retired for sure by then. I don't think he would be around wwe at that point. I could see him for sure coming in for the Bret match. Possibly have him and Bret take on Vince and HHH tag match instead of the planned one in one and have hhh turn on Vince. It would have been better than what we got. With HBK eliminating HHH at the rumble he could have turned heel briefly.
    Last edited by Bluegunn; May 6th, 2022 at 5:29 AM.

  53. #153
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    What if The British Bulldog and The Undertaker were a tag team?

  54. #154
    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WWXChairman View Post
    What if The British Bulldog and The Undertaker were a tag team?
    Death and Dreadlocks

    (Sounds like a Korn cover band)

  55. #155
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    What if Rocky Johnson hadn't taken an independent Saudi booking during the first Wrestlemania weekend, without permission from Vince, thereby breaking his contract with WWF? How far could Rocky have gone, either on his own, or together with Tony Atlas?

  56. #156
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3puppies View Post
    What if Rocky Johnson hadn't taken an independent Saudi booking during the first Wrestlemania weekend, without permission from Vince, thereby breaking his contract with WWF? How far could Rocky have gone, either on his own, or together with Tony Atlas?
    Not far imo. By Mania 1 he was already 40+ and I don't think him and Tony would've lasted. They had a lot of shit going on outside the ring that was causing them issues in the wrestling world. He might've been part of the first 2-3 Mania's at the most.

    I will also admit I'm not super familiar with his status in wrestling. Was he someone that fans were wanting to see in a bigger role outside the tag division?

  57. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rancid_Planet View Post
    Death and Dreadlocks

    (Sounds like a Korn cover band)
    They would have been great rivals for my fantasy booking team Fro Life (Carlito/Darren Young) with manager John Cena.

  58. #158
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    What if Dexter Lumis was still here and called up to the main roster? Wouldn’t expect big push but over enough to be a tag champ at least?

  59. #159
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Probably would have his name changed to Dexter or Lumis anyway. More likely the latter lol.

    Already know the Nash reply haha.

  60. #160
    F this & JC that mth's Avatar
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    I think he'd just pop up in some backstage bits stalking about and then he'd get into a micard feud with somebody like Baron Corbin for awhile, then an odd-couple tag team that maybe gets a shot at the titles but never wins them. Then he gets released.

  61. #161
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    I think he'd just pop up in some backstage bits stalking about and then he'd get into a micard feud with somebody like Baron Corbin for awhile, then an odd-couple tag team that maybe gets a shot at the titles but never wins them. Then he gets released.
    To be honest, that still sounds better than some of the dross we get on Raw.

    At the very least I think he could bring fresh comedy life to the 24/7 title as the usual crowd would be shit scared to challenge him. I think he could fit in somewhere.

  62. #162
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    And let’s be honest @mth Dexter vs the Boogeyman could’ve still happened backstage for the 24/7 title but alas no!

    Same goes for a tag team!

  63. #163
    F this & JC that mth's Avatar
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    Why are you pouring salt into my fresh wound?

  64. #164
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Sorry it was meant as a kinda tribute lol.

  65. #165
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    What if WCW acquired Bob Backlund?

  66. #166
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    That would depend when. If it was like 95 he could’ve had some good matches but after that, not sure he would’ve gone far tbh. I doubt he’d have been a fit for the NWO and probably steamrolled along with the rest of the roster.

    What if the Big Boss Man had beaten Mr Perfect for the title at Mania 7.

  67. #167
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    My wild guess is that he would have lost it to the Mountie somewhere between mania and SummerSlam.

    Quote Originally Posted by WWXChairman View Post
    What if WCW acquired Bob Backlund?
    He would have wrestled in the black and white legends match at Slamboree against Dick Murdoch or Wahoo McDaniels..

    /Come to think of it, Bob Backlund replacing Jim Brunzell in the six-man tag at Slamboree '93 against Muraco, Snuka and Dick Murdoch would have been some pretty cool nostalgia.
    Last edited by OD50; May 8th, 2022 at 7:03 AM.

  68. #168
    Her right to choose. Tyson's Avatar
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    If Brock had put Braun over, back when Strowman was white-hot.

  69. #169
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WWXChairman View Post
    What if WCW acquired Bob Backlund?

    I think he would best fit into the varsity club. If anywhere.

    Here is an interesting one. If the war was not over would wrestlemania 7 have sold out?

  70. #170
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WWXChairman View Post
    What if WCW acquired Bob Backlund?
    If we're talking WCW and not mid 80's NWA after he lost to Iron Sheik....It really depends on when you're talking about, at least for me. If we're going with WCW 90's, he probably would've done better in the early early 90's but he would've been lost in the shuffle.

    NWA in the early to mid 80's, that would've been a pretty big get for NWA. Backlund v. Flair would've definitely happened and I bet Bob would've won the title.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyson View Post
    If Brock had put Braun over, back when Strowman was white-hot.
    Yeah I think Braun and the WWE would've been better off. Was this before the bullshit tag stuff with Seth and the little kid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    I think he would best fit into the varsity club. If anywhere.

    Here is an interesting one. If the war was not over would wrestlemania 7 have sold out?
    WM 7 happens at a very interesting time in pro wrestling, at least here in the States. I truly believe this was the early stages of the downslide in popularity. WM was originally booked at the LA Memorial Coliseum, which at the time held about 90,000 fans. WWE probably thought hey, we sold 90,000+ at Mania 3, the next 2 were at Trump plaza which wasn't a huge venue but kind of important in sports/entertainment. 6 was at the Sky Dome, 60-70,000+ fans. So maybe they thought they could bang out that 90,000 venue.

    Switching to the Sports Arena was smart. That place only holds about 15,000 and that was pretty much all they had sold for the Coliseum by what, February? Honestly I think even if the war was still going on there wasn't much to get excited about. I remember ordering that ppv and it sucked. Warrior/Savage and Bossman/Perfect were, imo, the only good matches. Although this was the first time I ever saw a blatant blade job.

    The crazy part is...the next year, Mania 8....62,000 fans lol. It wasn't much better of a card but who knows.

  71. #171
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    8 sold well only because it was originally hogan vs flair advertised. Then they switched out for hogan retirement. Wrestle fest sold 61k tickets And that was a house show.

  72. #172
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    My wild guess is that he would have lost it to the Mountie somewhere between mania and SummerSlam.
    Or he loses it back to Perfect so we still get Perfect vs Bret at Summerslam. Also Boss Man vs Bret at Summerslam could’ve been an interesting dynamic.

    Either way, face Boss Man with an IC title run no matter how small it would’ve lasted could’ve been fun. I think he was certainly over enough at the time.

  73. #173
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I was hoping Bossman would beat Perfect. It's one of Bossman's best matches of all time and that feud was fire.

  74. #174
    Her right to choose. Tyson's Avatar
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    canada
    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Yeah I think Braun and the WWE would've been better off. Was this before the bullshit tag stuff with Seth and the little kid?
    Yep, early-to-mid 2017.

    Braun was up against Roman, getting face pops as the heel because Reigns was getting XPac heat at the time for getting the Superman Cena treatment. Back when Strowman was flipping ambulances and generally getting booked like the monster that he is/was; the same time period when the ring imploded during Braun’s match against Big Show. Dude was whitehot and super over with the fans, got two Universal title shots (SummerSlam and No Mercy) but part-timer Lesnar retained both times instead.

    Massive, pun intended, opportunity lost…

  75. #175
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    Yeah that was INCREDIBLY bad booking. It was around that time (along with the Jinder superpush) that I checked out.

  76. #176
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    There was a serious lack of awareness with WWE's booking no doubt.

    I'm not saying they've recovered, but that was a very weird era. The mistake was having the McMahons and Trips come out and say they were going to listen to the fans again and did pretty much everything none of the fans wanted lol.

  77. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    He would have wrestled in the black and white legends match at Slamboree against Dick Murdoch or Wahoo McDaniels..
    I could see him pinning Dick Murdoch and then taking Bobby Heenan as his manager.

  78. #178
    Its in Revelations people Jenova's Avatar
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    What if Vince was not revealed as the Higher Power.

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WWXChairman View Post
    I could see him pinning Dick Murdoch and then taking Bobby Heenan as his manager.
    You think Heenan would've came out of retirement to manage Bob Backlund of all people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenova View Post
    What if Vince was not revealed as the Higher Power.
    What if it was Russo's choice, Christopher Daniels? Imagine how fucking dumb that would've been in that era to just try and shoehorn a nobody into the main event.

    If not Vince then who? I was not a fan of anything Ministry related. It actually made me a bigger fan of ECW because I wasn't high on what WCW were doing. So my tape trading went into high gear, started watching more Japanese wrestling, death match wrestling.

    For me it would've needed to be someone huge from WCW or someone shocking like Paul Heyman. If they could've snagged Hogan, Kevin Nash, Ric Flair had actually been talking to WWF around 1998-1999 about returning....But when it was Vince it was a letdown.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    I think he would best fit into the varsity club. If anywhere.
    I could see him bailing Jim Duggan out of trouble and then maybe they have a decent tag run.

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    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenova View Post
    What if Vince was not revealed as the Higher Power.
    There were a few options. The jackyl was a great option. Jake could have been if it was not a tough time in his life. Christopher Daniels was also considered but he would have been a silent reaction to those unsure of his work. I think debiase could have been interesting. He was rich, had history with both Austin and undertaker.
    Last edited by Bluegunn; May 16th, 2022 at 5:59 AM.

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I've never really heard Russo talk about WHY he wanted Christopher Daniels. He was sort of in the WWF at the time having wrestled on the C shows. I literally just watched a LHW title match between him and Taka Michinoku someone uploaded on Youtube from Jakked. There was nothing about Daniels in 1998-1999 that made me think he would've worked. At all.

    Shout out to the Jackyl. That would've been cool because despite him being lower card personality, I think they would've came up with a good enough story that he could sink his teeth in to make believable. Like I said earlier....I wasn't really high on this Ministry stuff and the Higher Power had to be Vince as anyone with more power than him in that universe would need a great story to explain how that could be.

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    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    So what does everyone think would happen with DB if he was not injured the first time? What was the long term plan for him?

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    So what does everyone think would happen with DB if he was not injured the first time? What was the long term plan for him?
    Well....the rumors are that he was supposed to be John Cena at Summerslam v. Brock Lesnar. Makes sense with how the match was laid out but it resonated and elevated Lesnar to god status by doing it to John Cena of all people. That's what should've happened to Hogan in 1994 against Vader at Starrcade instead of Hogan v. The Butchercake.

    I think personally the long term plan would've been to have him work with Kane, Orton, and Batista until Summerslam where he would lose to Brock. After that if Shield were broken up I'd say him and Rollins would've definitely mixed it up. He would've teamed up with Roman, Ambrose, and probably revisited his feud with Sheamus and Bray Wyatt. WM 31 would either have him working the ladder match still OR against Sheamus lol.

    I don't think they would've pushed him too far down the card because WWE thinks very high of Sheamus, look at his accomplishments up to that point.

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    What if the WWE went along with the limo explosion and McMahon being dead and Paul London smiling-possibly being part of that even though that was a shoot smile...?

  86. #186
    F this & JC that mth's Avatar
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    @Badger already made it clear, he doesn't want to talk about it.

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Inside joke?

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    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    mth and I discussed this same topic a while ago lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    mth and I discussed this same topic a while ago lol.
    Let's here it or link me up I'm curious to see what you guys were discussing. It's such a fascinating time in wrestling, and not really in a good way. But they were really trying to kill Vince a few times with the limo, the stage....But the whole thing with Paul London is wild and I've heard him talk about it in the past, how he was just doing it because basically he didn't give a shit.

    But I think they could've rolled with it and got something out of him despite not really thinking the greatest of him on his own.

    I'm just curious what people thought the WWE's direction was going to be. IDK if I've ever really listened to anyone in the WWE talk about what the endgame was for that other than it keeping Vince off tv-as a character-forever.

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    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    It’s in this thread about 50-odd posts back.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    It’s in this thread about 50-odd posts back.
    Totally missed that one. Including the giant picture of the limo on the fire @mth posted lol.

    Neither of you have to respond to this but here's my quick take which has probably changed over the years:

    The rumors were that someone Mr. Kennedy would be involved in what happened and it would've tied in with him being Vince's son. Some type of power struggle storyline where maybe Kennedy, Shane, Stephanie, and I assume Linda would be battling for control in the wake of Vince's "death". Then Vince comes back, claiming he faked his own death, and fuck the rest of you lol.

    But as it was said by you Badger in your post, the WWE didn't have a good track record. Higher Power, the mystery driver, shit let's take it back to the Gobbly Gooker.

    The funny thing is how times have changed. People were very invested still in kayfabe back in 2007 and I don't think there would be much pushback in terms of "Vince isn't really dead this is so stupid" today because of things like the Broken Universe, the Fiend, I mean they tried to tell us Taker died and rose to the skies 30 years ago in a casket match. Sacrificing Mideon in 1999 wasn't exactly real lol. But in today's world, the last 5 years or so with Mickie James getting killed in TNA......It's more relaxed.

    I think with Paul London they could've used him smiling. I mean they shot that walk out scene multiple times and he smiled each time. They could've fleshed that out but obviously Benoit murdering his family killed any steam that had. So fucking cryptic too when thinking back to that episode of Raw.

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    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    What if it was ambrose that turned on the shield? It was looking that way before it turned into Rollins.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    What if it was ambrose that turned on the shield? It was looking that way before it turned into Rollins.
    How interesting would it have been if you took Ambrose and put him in Rollins' spot? I'm talking the exact same Authority's next chosen one gimmick, he wins MITB, he cashes in on Lesnar/Roman....Honestly it's even more interesting in my head than it might've been on tv but you never know. Dean coming out in a suit, nice clothes, he has Kane, Orton, Big Slow, Noble, and Mercury as his henchmen. Triple H and Stephanie praising him every week.

    It's wild thinking where Ambrose is NOW and how his career would've been totally different had they went with him instead of Seth Rollins.

    But what if they went with Roman? Don't get me wrong, love the Tribal Chief but I think he would've killed it with The Authority. I think this was around the time he did an interview talking about being in it for the money and just sounded real arrogant--but on tv he's supposed to be the next big babyface.

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    What if the Hart Foundation accepted more non-Harts?

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    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    How interesting would it have been if you took Ambrose and put him in Rollins' spot? I'm talking the exact same Authority's next chosen one gimmick, he wins MITB, he cashes in on Lesnar/Roman....Honestly it's even more interesting in my head than it might've been on tv but you never know. Dean coming out in a suit, nice clothes, he has Kane, Orton, Big Slow, Noble, and Mercury as his henchmen. Triple H and Stephanie praising him every week.

    It's wild thinking where Ambrose is NOW and how his career would've been totally different had they went with him instead of Seth Rollins.

    But what if they went with Roman? Don't get me wrong, love the Tribal Chief but I think he would've killed it with The Authority. I think this was around the time he did an interview talking about being in it for the money and just sounded real arrogant--but on tv he's supposed to be the next big babyface.
    Considering Batista went back to do movies I think Roman would be the perfect replacement for him. But without the J and J services.

  96. #196
    Top Hulkamaniac Bluegunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WWXChairman View Post
    What if the Hart Foundation accepted more non-Harts?
    I think four members was good for them. Bret was already on his way out after Pillman passed away so it was pointless to replace him. Steve Blackman was the only other roster member with connections to Stampede.

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    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    I remember a kayfabe "rumor" in RAW Magazine that Yokozuna might join the Hart Foundation. They never said "Yokozuna" explicitly but that a "huge" former WWF champion might join them next There also was this image of the HF with a silhouette of Yoko standing behind them. Would have been very odd to say the least.

    /Maybe Owen pitched the idea because he had enjoyed working with Yoko in Camp Cornette in 95-96?
    Last edited by OD50; May 27th, 2022 at 6:55 AM.

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    World Champion Murphy's Avatar
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    Loved Camp Cornette looking back.

    Might do me a 96-96 run through soon.

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    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    Same, Camp Cornette is probably quite an underrated and almost forgotten stable. I actually think 1996 is quite an underrated year for the WWF overall, lots of good stuff going on and most of the awful 1993-1995 toon era gimmicks were being phased out in favor of Mankind, Marc Mero, Brian Pillman, Steve Austin and others. I would love to watch all the RAW's from '96 sometime since we didn't get any WWF/E programing in Sweden between 1994 and 2004. I have obviously seen all the PPV and IYH shows from '96 but probably very little from the television shows. I used to buy those "Best of RAW" VHS tapes in 1996-1997 so I did see most of the bigger matches and some angles though. Remember being stoked to watch Austin/Vader and HHH/Cactus Jack on those tapes. I think there was a Bret Hart/Vader match on one of those tapes as well. Also the first ever (televised) three-way match in the WWF, think it was Goldust vs. Owen Hart vs. HHH.
    Last edited by OD50; May 27th, 2022 at 3:09 PM.

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    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegunn View Post
    What if it was ambrose that turned on the shield? It was looking that way before it turned into Rollins.
    I LOVE this.

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