Survivor Debate.....Topanga Tribe vs. Kapowski Tribe
This debate will be 3 posts per team. A team will have 24 hours to respond after the other team's posts. Any member of the team make any of the posts. One person could post all 3. You may confer with each other, etc.
400 word Cap per post. The team to post first receives a 50 word bonus on their first post.
Quoting another poster does not count towards your word count, but quoting a source in thread does.
Each poster will be entitled to 3 pictures and/or video per round/post.
Winners will be determined by a 3 judge panel
The winning team will be immune from elimination
THE TOPIC:
2020 has been a weird year for WWE. Let's get 2021 off to a better start. Decide who should win one of the Royal Rumble Matches (you may pick either the men's or women's match). Demonstrate how your pick will produce a beneficial result for the company and your selection is superior to your opponent's.
2020 has indeed been a weird year, not just for WWE but everyone in general during the difficult time that we are in. The Royal Rumble match(es) is something that the fans look forward to every year and especially on the back of this year, we need winners we can all feel good about so no Boo-tista here and who can start that all-important journey on the road to Wrestlemania.
We’re going to focus on the men’s here so who should get the honour of winning it next year, most deserving and produce a beneficial result for the company? Should it be a part-timer with name value to give a boost for setting up the Mania event? Should it be someone new who has just burst onto the scene and could make a splash or should it be someone who has been around the block for a bit but now is the time to cement his legacy and get on the road to being a big-time main-event star? All of these things were considered but one name stands out and I think Kofi sums it up quite nicely in the below video:
Yes there is no need to be sour and we should clap for Kapowski’s choice to win the 2021 Royal Rumble and feel the poooowweeerrr!!!!!
Big E ticks a lot of boxes here. He has a great look and powerful too so he would look fantastic and credible throwing bodies over the top rope. He is over, charismatic and well-liked by the fans so him winning would definitely be a feel-good moment on the back of this horrible year. More importantly though, it would feel organic as he has slowly been on the rise ever since they hinted at his singles push in that video I just posted and the set-up would be fairly simple.
He is already on a slow-burn singles push feuding with Miz and currently Sheamus so keep the slow but strong push going. Survivor Series is coming up so put him in an inter-brand elimination tag match and have him survive to make him even more credible winning out for his brand. Keep him in singles feuds that do not necessarily revolve around titles. Keep him chasing that dream until Royal Rumble comes up where he does the business. This would culminate in him finally realising the dream and becoming champion at Wrestlemania.
It’s simple and effective. Kofi got to realise his Mania dream albeit through a different route but this feels so right for E to win and it come full circle for Kofi and New Day to congratulate him after setting him on this path.
The choice for the winner of the 2021 Royal Rumble is clear. There's been one man that has been given everything to shine this year. He was the first man ever to hold the NXT Title and the North American Title at the same time, he is the man who was instantly propelled into the highest profile feud on Raw on his debut. He's been one of the most popular characters across all three brands this and you should...
BASK. IN. HIS. GLORY.
Keith Lee has has an incredible year in the company and is one of the few people to come out of a turgid time with some credit. His year started by winning the NXT North American Championship and was quickly followed by a huge showing in his Royal Rumble debut, where he battled Brock Lesnar and was eventually thrown over the top by both The Beast and Braun Strowman. In July he continued his fantastic year, being the man to finally beat Adam Cole (BAYBAY) for the NXT Title, becoming the first double champion in history. These events all followed a Survivor Series in 2019 where Lee was the last man standing against Roman Reigns before just being beaten by the number one man in the company.
That's an incredible showing in the past year for Lee and it's clear for everyone that he's heading towards the very top sooner rather than later. The signs are all there and the next progressive step is a Royal Rumble win. Age is on Lee's side at just 35 and he is clean cut, hasn't been in any trouble throughout his career and is more than ready for the main event.
From a company view point he also offers a fresh direction. You'd have to be living under a rock to not have heard about the BLM movement and how racial equality is high on the agenda across the United States and the globe. Having a black Royal Rumble winner and, eventually, World Champion on their flagship show would be a big positive for a company with a less than stellar record when it comes to race relations. He'd be more than just a token champion though, he's a genuine powerhouse, can go toe to toe with anyone (as seen with Lesnar and Reigns recently) and is the clear and obvious choice to win the 2021 Royal Rumble.
Keith Lee is no doubt a good candidate for the Royal Rumble 2021 winner and one which I heavily considered myself. There’s no real denying what you’ve said the the company seems to think very highly of him and he has gone toe to toe with main eventers like Lesnar and Reigns. Is he the number one choice to win the next Royal Rumble? I don’t think so and here is why.
Keith is a great talent who worked his way up through the ranks in NXT winning gold, so was Big E being the second ever NXT champion himself capturing the title from Seth Rollins. On his RAW debut he was thrust straight into a match with Orton which was somewhat overshadowed due to the change in his music and gear which was heavily criticised (I realise not all his fault). Putting that aside, he has somewhat adjusted since and mixed it up with both McIntyre and Orton but in my view perhaps a bit too early without being given much room to grow.
There’s a draft coming up tonight on Smackdown and on Raw next week with Lee being eligible for draft on Monday. Although anything can happen in the Dubya Dubya…E, it’s a reasonable guess that he’s staying on Raw with Strowman coming over as they look to have started a program. I fear at this point anyway they may have blown their load on him a bit with at least two of his potential Mania opponents should he win the Rumble because it would not seem as fresh.
Big E on the other hand has had natural growth. He’s been around for about eight years while being a year younger than Keith and really found his niche in the New Day. Now he’s been given a re-introduction to singles and unlike Keith, they are taking it slower with him and a Rumble followed by a Mania win would be a tremendous climax with Kofi congratulating him after originally setting him on the path.
BLM/race relations could be a great angle for a Lee Rumble win but also a great one for E too who has also been outspoken about it so thank you for bringing it up. Here’s E and Kofi taking the knee as a tribute (with Vince’s blessing):
Plus check out this video linking the Bubble Sports podcast with E giving his BLM thoughts:
Keith is a great talent who worked his way up through the ranks in NXT winning gold, so was Big E being the second ever NXT champion himself capturing the title from Seth Rollins.
I accept that Big E was an NXT champion...SEVEN YEARS AGO now. Its been almost a decade since he was given the ball in the development and in all that time he hasn't progressed to the same level on the main show. There's no shame in that, Bo Dallas was a great NXT Champion but floundered on the main show for example. Big E should be commended for still being relevant seven years later but that doesn't make him the best candidate for the Rumble.
Big E looks to be in line for a push in the coming weeks and months but compare that to the push that Lee is getting? Big E has been sparring with Sheamus (who was the last person to get a genuine rub off Sheamus?!), whilst Lee has been in a program with the veteran of the company and the WWE Champion.
Lets compare Big E and his partners with another trio that are fondly thought of. The New Age Outlaws and X-Pac. All loved by fans, thought of as part one of the best groups of all time and all...absolute flops as singles stars. Kofi got his big push....that lasted a couple of months before being bought back to the midcard, much like X-Pac. Road Dogg and Xavier can be compared too, both are decent enough across the board but not exceptional in any regard. That leaves us with Billy Gunn and Big E. The two men that are thought of to be the most likely to succeed of their trios. Billy Gunn was pushed into a program at the top of the card and flopped horribly. Does any of us see E as WWE Champion in a years time or will he be back alongside his buddies? The New Day are amazing but there is plenty of evidence to say that they need each other to be at their best. A singles run just doesn't look like it's going to work for any of the trio.
Originally Posted by Badger
BLM/race relations could be a great angle for a Lee Rumble win but also a great one for E too who has also been outspoken about it so thank you for bringing it up. .
It's probably indicative of how much stronger our argument was that you had to use one of our points for you own. But even if we forget that, we can also see that Keith Lee has spoken out on the issue of race relations as well as sexual exploitation of women and even being taken advantage of himself. He ticks so many boxes on a company level.
I’m aware E’s NXT title reign was a long time ago, I was merely drawing parallels between them in that they both obtained NXT gold before being called up to the main roster. It is indeed a testament to E that he has managed to still stay relevant years later and he is more than deserving of a shot. No disrespect to Bo Dallas but E has so much more going for him and can do even better.
There may be some parallels to be drawn between the New Day and the New Age Outlaws/X-Pac. Successful stables, multiple time tag team champions but I would say the New Day have eclipsed them. They have the longest tag team championship reign at 483 days and seven SD tag title reigns. Comparing each individual side by side, while it may be more difficult to make a case for Woods and can sorta see the Road Dogg comparison (personally think Woods is better in the ring but that’s subjective, Kofi/X-Pac doesn’t really work. For one, Kofi has been a world champion and it was certainly longer than a couple of months, try 180 days. He was a successful champion until they brutally pulled the rug out from under him by having Lesnar squash him in seconds, that doesn’t mean whatsoever that his reign was a flop. As for Gunn and Big E, yes Gunn did flop horribly when pushed into a program at the top of the card but for all your talk of evidence, there is no evidence to suggest the same fate will fall upon Big E. They are taking their time with it, making a big deal that E is going solo and there is no doubt going to be a big pay-off with it and I think a Rumble win would be a fantastic pay-off.
Using the same point for E in regards to the BLM movement isn’t indicative that your argument is stronger. I was saying it would be a positive point for both so Lee doesn’t hold an advantage over E in that regard. I’m going to close this out by saying that while Lee has had higher profile singles matches than E lately, having E win the Rumble would be great story progression and provide fresh opportunities. There’s a good chance Lee will get there but could benefit more from a longer journey like E has.
**This post contain some Smackdown spoilers. I've put these behind spoiler tags just in case**
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The parallels between the two end with winning the NXT title though, such is the treading water that Big E has done since that point. He's never done enough to stand out in the past seven years and even now he's not showing anything spectacular to warrant a mega push.
Kofi's title win was undoubtedly a flop, he had a forgettable reign, and was then beaten by Lesnar in seconds without a rematch or even a stay in the main event. The New Day is a great gimmick but it's limited in how far up the card it can be. Even with his title reign (something that I doubt would've happened if there was just one world title), Kofi was really reliant on both Woods and E being there with him and
as seen on Smackdown last night, Big E won't have them with him. He's alone and i don't think there is enough about him for a long term successful push.
Keith Lee hasn't been muddied by poor booking, silly gimmicks or tag team partners. He's been his own man throughout his NXT run, gaining popularity and achieving some big things in that time. He's clearly seen as the next big project and the majority of those projects win the Rumble. Nakamura and Drew prove this with the Rumble being used to elevate people that had had monster year before the Rumble. I would say Lee has had a monster year but Big E can hardly argue the same thing. He's working the same gimmick as 3 years ago, doing the same things and not really advancing much further than the upper mid card at best.
Agreeing with one of our points and using it in your own post, when it hasn't been mentioned by you before is definitely indicative that our posts are the stronger ones. You say that Keith Lee could benefit from a longer journey like Big E. Does that mean we can expect him to get his chance in about six years time when he deserved his lifetime achievement push too?
I think it's clear to see that Big E is being pushed for a run NEAR the top and I hope he does well but Keith Lee is being pushed for a run AT the top and he's the clear best choice to win the 2021 Royal Rumble.
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Originally Posted by Badger
