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Thread: RAW Feb 10th 2020

  1. #1
    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    RAW Feb 10th 2020

    Feeling like watching some Raw...until I dont.

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    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    Nice match.

    Man Becky wrestles so differently now. She has completely adopted the Vince approved style of punch/kick/punch big spot big spot....oooh Bazler.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Omg wtf she's a zombie eating brains now?

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    Well, that was cool as fuck. We veering away from PG now, gang.

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    Main Eventer Horatio's Avatar
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    grenadines
    Kudos to King. Vampirism beats cannibalism anyday...

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    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    Who is the create a wrestler looking motherfucker?

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    What an awful bf Seth is not checking on becky

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    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    Thought MVP was all done.

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    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    Seems like Drew is the size that they act like Roman Reigns is.

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    ... Beer-Belly's Avatar
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    Drew is really making this work. I'm definitely digging it.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rancid_Planet View Post
    Who is the create a wrestler looking motherfucker?
    He goes by the name of Mojo Rawley

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    E-Bow The Poster Rancid_Planet's Avatar
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    Ok now I dont like wrestling again.


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    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    Bobby Lashley gets the opposite of a crowd reaction.

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    Main Eventer Horatio's Avatar
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    grenadines
    Ricochet landed that 630 nice and shitty

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    Interesting to see they went with the picture in picture route for Raw. Certainly a unique way to bring Baszler back into the mix with Becky. It is good to see that she found the potion that Rowan had hidden to shrink her and that she got free from the cage...at least temporarily.

    Such a minor detail but it annoyed me that neither Lana or Lashley had any wedding ring/band. Way to stay committed to the bit lol. If MVP is looking to be someone's business manager, he was barking up the wrong tree with McIntyre but he'd have a hell of a prospect in Ricochet. For the match itself, that was a good showing for Ricochet and a decent template for how the match with Lesnar could go.

    Sarah Logan definitely got the short end of the stick despite being on TV. She was squashed by Rhea Ripley and Ruby Riott essentially said she wasn't significant in the Riott Squad by her saying Liv was her best friend. Ouch.

    The approach they're taking with Orton appears to be a good one. The people from Edge's past coming over multiple weeks is a good way to keep the story fresh in everyone's mind, allows for different people to step up, and allows Orton a way to look more dastardly. Christian and his peeps may be in trouble soon. Either way, still like the idea of Orton and McIntyre crossing paths at Elimination Chamber with Drew winning, Edge returning, and setting up the match for Mania.

    Tuwaiq me up, or not Tuwaiq me up, that is the question...at least AJ is going to be okay for Mania and Rusev has something to do in Saudi Arabia.

    Fun eight-man main event. Murphy was selling like a champ. Looks like Rollins has found his groove with this group.
    Last edited by BGMaverick; February 11th, 2020 at 12:58 AM.

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    Honestly, Bobby Lashley, Lana Lashley, and MVP would be a Hell of a little trio.

  16. #16
    The Fresh Maker Mazer's Avatar
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    Lana Lashley is honestly kind of a badass name. They need to start using it.


    I mean its no Drake Maverick, but honestly what is?

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    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    I wish the Claymore kick was hit out of nowhere, like the RKO. Not a fan of this 3-2-1 shit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald View Post
    I wish the Claymore kick was hit out of nowhere, like the RKO. Not a fan of this 3-2-1 shit.
    I understand why they do it - it's like the "tuning up the band" that HBK used to do before the superkick, as it gets the entire crowd ready for a "don't miss" impact. But it makes the opponent look so stupid, especially when its done to someone every week. While it has helped the fans embrace the Sexy Scotsman, his face turn is more attributable to the fact that he's not hanging with Corbin any longer.

    We got the return of the VIP Lounge after ten years - I kept thinking this is something nobody asked for.

  19. #19
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    lol @ Shayna. A million bucks says that Vince saw her MMA-rugged teeth and thought "imagine what she could do to someone with those teeth!" What the fuck was that bullshit? Kudos for trying something different, but I guess kudos to the kids who think it's smart to get in a shopping cart and fly down a hill.

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    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    We could have a first ever "Whoever bites the neck of their opponent first wins match"

  21. #21
    an affront to god mth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald View Post
    We could have a first ever "Whoever bites the neck of their opponent first wins match"
    aka Vampire Rules

    vs. Gangrel vs. Kevin Thorn

  22. #22
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    If anyone should be eating other talent it should be Sarah Logan.

  23. #23
    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    It's astounding how often WWE does something "different" that I wholeheartedly think is stupid. Shayna biting a chunk out of Becky's neck? Why? Now she's going to be that chick that bites peolpe. Why could she just pummel Becky and put her to sleep?

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    Quote Originally Posted by VHS View Post
    It's astounding how often WWE does something "different" that I wholeheartedly think is stupid. Shayna biting a chunk out of Becky's neck? Why? Now she's going to be that chick that bites peolpe. Why could she just pummel Becky and put her to sleep?
    Why? Because it was different lol. You just thought it was stupid. I'm sure a lot of people thought it was stupid but it was different a different way to attack someone. At least they tried something. What happens next is what determines if this is DOA or not. They've got time and they've got one compelling character. They have to build the second one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Why? Because it was different lol. You just thought it was stupid. I'm sure a lot of people thought it was stupid but it was different a different way to attack someone. At least they tried something. What happens next is what determines if this is DOA or not. They've got time and they've got one compelling character. They have to build the second one.
    You know what else would have been different? Crushing Becky under a cargo container like in Lethal Weapon 2. Or blowing Becky's hand off w/ a shotgun like in Robocop. I've learned to stop waiting for shit to play out and just judge it on the now. It was stupid and nothing they do in the future will justify it as anything but stupid.

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    When an animal asserts dominance over another animal, they will bite the neck of the lesser animal.

    That's how I took it

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    I hope they bring her out in a straitjacket and face mask

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    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinner View Post
    When an animal asserts dominance over another animal, they will bite the neck of the lesser animal.

    That's how I took it
    Just the neck? Wow, those animals are so mysterious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    lol @ Shayna. A million bucks says that Vince saw her MMA-rugged teeth and thought "imagine what she could do to someone with those teeth!" What the fuck was that bullshit? Kudos for trying something different, but I guess kudos to the kids who think it's smart to get in a shopping cart and fly down a hill.
    Quote Originally Posted by VHS View Post
    It's astounding how often WWE does something "different" that I wholeheartedly think is stupid. Shayna biting a chunk out of Becky's neck? Why? Now she's going to be that chick that bites peolpe. Why could she just pummel Becky and put her to sleep?
    Having not watched Shayna in NXT, I was wondering if this was her thing. If this was the first time she did it, then it's completely random and begs the question why she needed to be so extreme.

    Becky driving herself to the Hospital was a bit too much for me as well. It's usually the other way around. Wrestlers typically drive themselves back to the arena. I know she was pissed, but seeing a babyface being a dick to the paramedics was weird too. They're really determined to turn her into Austin.

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasori View Post
    Having not watched Shayna in NXT, I was wondering if this was her thing. If this was the first time she did it, then it's completely random and begs the question why she needed to be so extreme.

    Becky driving herself to the Hospital was a bit too much for me as well. It's usually the other way around. Wrestlers typically drive themselves back to the arena. I know she was pissed, but seeing a babyface being a dick to the paramedics was weird too. They're really determined to turn her into Austin.
    Naw she's never done anything remotely close to that nonsense lol.

    Her being a "dick" to paramedics, as a babyface, not weird at all. Countless babyfaces do what she did, usually worse. She didn't even kick their ass like Roman would have. They've been booking her like a Stone Cold for over a year and a half and I'm digging it. Everyone else is so paint by numbers it's nice to have someone not be the same as everyone else.

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    I kept thinking they should have saved that spot and not had it done to Becky, but instead to Charlotte or Lana or another blonde, so it would show up better. Becky's red hair hid the damage they were trying to show.

    I laughed at the ref / paramedic fumbling with the plastic gloves - I swear he put them on to inspect her, then took one off, then tried to put it on again? Was he trying to break another fake blood capsule or something?

    I would like Joe or Kevin Owens to point out next week that Seth is the world's worst fiancé - he didn't care about what Becky was going through? If the WWE wants to have it both ways, and acknowledge the real-life relationship between its stars, then they have to accept how stupid this looks.

    I haven't been a fan of the Seth/Messiah, Murphy, AOP stuff as I don't think Seth is strong enough to portray a leadership role, and while I love Joe and KO, I don't think much of the Viking Raiders. I figured AOP would get lost in the shuffle, but they are making Razar look pretty strong.

  32. #32
    an affront to god mth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasori View Post
    Having not watched Shayna in NXT, I was wondering if this was her thing. If this was the first time she did it, then it's completely random and begs the question why she needed to be so extreme.

    Becky driving herself to the Hospital was a bit too much for me as well. It's usually the other way around. Wrestlers typically drive themselves back to the arena. I know she was pissed, but seeing a babyface being a dick to the paramedics was weird too. They're really determined to turn her into Austin.
    Because it makes her look like an unhinged dangerous maniac? She could have just shown up and choked her out but that'd be pretty standard and about at a 6 ("Oh yup, here's Shayna, as expected, I guess that's cool...") but showing up and biting a goddamn chunk out of someone's neck puts you at 11 out of the gate and makes people really stand up and take notice ("Holy shit, I didn't see that coming, that's nuts...") and your feud kicks off as an intense blood feud on day one.

  33. #33
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    Because it makes her look like an unhinged dangerous maniac? She could have just shown up and choked her out but that'd be pretty standard and about at a 6 ("Oh yup, here's Shayna, as expected, I guess that's cool...") but showing up and biting a goddamn chunk out of someone's neck puts you at 11 out of the gate and makes people really stand up and take notice ("Holy shit, I didn't see that coming, that's nuts...") and your feud kicks off as an intense blood feud on day one.
    You are the only person who thought that when this happened last night lol.

    Sometimes "predictable" is perfectly fine. Doing something different isn't always good and this was just straight up stupid. The WWE had plenty to build with and this was like someone asking you to build them a house, and right in the middle of the living room they decided to put the toilet, facing away from the tv, with a piranha in the bowl.

    People did stand up and take notice and say "Holy shit, didn't see that coming" THAT WAS DUMB lol. Let's just bring out the dungeon of doom while we're at it.

  34. #34
    an affront to god mth's Avatar
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    Or it's stupid, sure.

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    Shaynabal Baszlcter

  36. #36
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    Or it's stupid, sure.
    I just hope it's not a thing they saddle Shayna with where she's going around biting motherfuckers.

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    Agreed, I certainly don't want Shayna to have a "biting people" gimmick. I'm hoping this was a one off thing to make her debut impactful (or stupid) and things move on.

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    Becky flipping out on the paramedics made no sense either. She's in her wrestling gear and doesn't even have her phone on her. So she's driving a stolen ambulance w/ the lights on to the hospital? Does she know the address? Does she know how to get there without Google Maps? Did she park in general parking or where the other ambulances are? Did she explain to the workers that she commandeered it herself and left the paramedics at the venue? Would they accept that or call the police on her?

    WWE is written by an AI, I swear to Cthulhu.

    If I were HHH I would be facepalming so hard over this whole thing. They spent so much time building her up to be this badass on NXT and now she's on the main roster... boom she's a biter.

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    Just saying, I thought Shayna biting a chunk out of Becky's neck was badass.

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    Plus, we all know women can't drive, so the chance of her getting to the hospital without getting into an accident is pretty slim.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VHS View Post
    Becky flipping out on the paramedics made no sense either. She's in her wrestling gear and doesn't even have her phone on her. So she's driving a stolen ambulance w/ the lights on to the hospital? Does she know the address? Does she know how to get there without Google Maps? Did she park in general parking or where the other ambulances are? Did she explain to the workers that she commandeered it herself and left the paramedics at the venue? Would they accept that or call the police on her?

    WWE is written by an AI, I swear to Cthulhu.

    If I were HHH I would be facepalming so hard over this whole thing. They spent so much time building her up to be this badass on NXT and now she's on the main roster... boom she's a biter.
    You're putting too much logic into wrestling.

  42. #42
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I have a feeling that they will act like last night never happened lol. If Vince is still about looks, Shayna is fucked. I'm telling you, he saw those fucking teeth and his genius kicked in like it did with Ambrose (That's good shit it's so YOU!) It makes you wonder who was responsible for booking Survivor Series though. Was Vince in a coma for all of that build?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    Just saying, I thought Shayna biting a chunk out of Becky's neck was badass.

    You also have 666 in your name so we know how you roll brother

  43. #43
    an affront to god mth's Avatar
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    Shayna's teeth aren't even bad. You're talking like she's some snaggletooth situation and I'm looking at pics of her and they look pretty fucking normal. You really think Vince is going to go off on one slightly crooked tooth? ...ok, to be fair, yeah, he probably would.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    I have a feeling that they will act like last night never happened lol. If Vince is still about looks, Shayna is fucked. I'm telling you, he saw those fucking teeth and his genius kicked in like it did with Ambrose (That's good shit it's so YOU!) It makes you wonder who was responsible for booking Survivor Series though. Was Vince in a coma for all of that build?

    - - - Updated - - -




    You also have 666 in your name so we know how you roll brother
    I am with you, though, in the sense that I don't want it to be her gimmick. I liked it for the impact, because it shows how ruthless she truly is. But it would be a shame if that ended up being a thing that overshadowed her MMA background and ring command.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald View Post
    Plus, we all know women can't drive, so the chance of her getting to the hospital without getting into an accident is pretty slim.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Donald again.

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    As was said earlier, sometimes predictable is fine enough. Sometimes it's not, though. What did Baszler do in the build to Survivor Series? She did what everyone was saying would be completely fine for last night. She jumped Bayley and Sasha and wrecked them. That's fine and predictable but I can make a case for saying that's simply not good enough for someone like Becky. Are we saying Bayley and Sasha are being presented on the same level and acting the same way and resonating as Becky? I would say hell no to that. In addition, Becky took the shine away at Survivor Series because Baszler won the match between the champs, yet Becky stood tall. You can make a case that Baszler's motivations are leaning towards being pissed and aggressive to make up for that fact, and going up against the top competitor in the division.

    IF this becomes the new thing for Baszler, it's likely going to be really rough. If this was just an entry point and makes a new character a very intimidating or violent threat, then I commend them for finding a different entry point.

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    We used to have Dr. Issac Yankem, then we had Christ Benoit and toothless aggression, now we've got Shayna biting the champ, finally an angle with TEETH in it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    Shayna's teeth aren't even bad. You're talking like she's some snaggletooth situation and I'm looking at pics of her and they look pretty fucking normal. You really think Vince is going to go off on one slightly crooked tooth? ...ok, to be fair, yeah, he probably would.
    Some of them are pretty chipped up from all the years of fighting in MMA. And you're right, he probably would based on one tooth lol.

    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    I am with you, though, in the sense that I don't want it to be her gimmick. I liked it for the impact, because it shows how ruthless she truly is. But it would be a shame if that ended up being a thing that overshadowed her MMA background and ring command.
    Sometimes wrestling just produces dumb shit, if it didn't, it wouldn't be wrestling lol.

    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    As was said earlier, sometimes predictable is fine enough. Sometimes it's not, though. What did Baszler do in the build to Survivor Series? She did what everyone was saying would be completely fine for last night. She jumped Bayley and Sasha and wrecked them. That's fine and predictable but I can make a case for saying that's simply not good enough for someone like Becky. Are we saying Bayley and Sasha are being presented on the same level and acting the same way and resonating as Becky? I would say hell no to that. In addition, Becky took the shine away at Survivor Series because Baszler won the match between the champs, yet Becky stood tall. You can make a case that Baszler's motivations are leaning towards being pissed and aggressive to make up for that fact, and going up against the top competitor in the division.

    IF this becomes the new thing for Baszler, it's likely going to be really rough. If this was just an entry point and makes a new character a very intimidating or violent threat, then I commend them for finding a different entry point.

    Stone Cold pretty much attacked everyone from Jim Ross to The Rock the exact same way. Does that mean we were supposed to think Jim Ross and The Rock were on the same level?

    Shayna coming out and putting Becky to sleep, that's Shayna's MO. She's done it to everyone from Kairi Sane to Bayley. And yes, I would like to think that Bayley, who's been champion almost just as long as Becky, should be considered a top tier player so no I don't think it would cheapen the attack if Shayna did what she's done EFFECTIVELY over several years.

    The problem that a lot of us are having and some don't even realize is that we're on the fucking defensive with how NXT talent is used. Why? Look at the majority of NXT talent that's came up in the last year or 2. It's mind blowing how many have been fucked in booking, some are barely even used because they get called up and creative has zero plans.

    Remember Aleister Black? Yeah me neither.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    You're putting too much logic into wrestling.
    Logic needs to be put back into wrestling.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post

    Stone Cold pretty much attacked everyone from Jim Ross to The Rock the exact same way. Does that mean we were supposed to think Jim Ross and The Rock were on the same level?

    Shayna coming out and putting Becky to sleep, that's Shayna's MO. She's done it to everyone from Kairi Sane to Bayley. And yes, I would like to think that Bayley, who's been champion almost just as long as Becky, should be considered a top tier player so no I don't think it would cheapen the attack if Shayna did what she's done EFFECTIVELY over several years.

    The problem that a lot of us are having and some don't even realize is that we're on the fucking defensive with how NXT talent is used. Why? Look at the majority of NXT talent that's came up in the last year or 2. It's mind blowing how many have been fucked in booking, some are barely even used because they get called up and creative has zero plans.

    Remember Aleister Black? Yeah me neither.
    Everything doesn't have to be done the same way. That's what I've been saying on this topic. As you alluded to, predictable is fine. It totally is. That doesn't mean doing something different, even if it is perceived to be stupid, is not fine. It depends on what happens later. This is chapter 1 or 1a.

    We clearly disagree then on Becky and Bayley and that's fine. I just don't think she's remotely in the same playing field as Becky in terms of resonating with the crowd or being a major point of emphasis. That's not entirely on her but Becky had similar issues and similar reasoning and she broke through to a new height.

    Speak for yourself on Black lol. I do remember Black. I look to see what he's doing each week. Every week. The only thing I can comment on with him now is two things: they clearly want to be on television every week and get over the fact he's strong in the ring. The second thing is they're trying incredibly hard to make him into the previous incarnation of Bray Wyatt who spoke and you had a hell of a time trying to actually understand what he was saying. I think they're trying too hard with him verbally but I'm gathering that they are being very strategic with what he does if it's going to be something significant. They took their time with Murphy and Black and it paid off for both in different ways. I thought Black would be marginalized if he was going to be thrust into the stuff with KO and Rollins and I like that he hasn't been put there. That tells me they want him to stand out. They've got to have something in mind for him over the big picture (even if it starts clunky). I'm just curious to see what it is.
    Last edited by BGMaverick; February 11th, 2020 at 3:45 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Remember Aleister Black? Yeah me neither.
    Black's hardly the best pick for your point when he's been on TV every week for months, getting matches and promo time, recently had a solid feud with Murphy tearing it up in multiple matches, and is currently getting mic time in the ring every show. Like Mick Foley Tweeted last night, he's one good feud away from jumping up the ladder.

    EDIT: What BG said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Everything doesn't have to be done the same way. That's what I've been saying on this topic. As you alluded to, predictable is fine. It totally is. That doesn't mean doing something different, even if it is perceived to be stupid, is not fine. It depends on what happens later. This is chapter 1 or 1a.

    We clearly disagree then on Becky and Bayley and that's fine. I just don't think she's remotely in the same playing field as Becky in terms of resonating with the crowd or being a major point of emphasis. That's not entirely on her but Becky had similar issues and similar reasoning and she broke through to a new height.

    Speak for yourself on Black lol. I do remember Black. I look to see what he's doing each week. The only thing I can comment on with him now is two things: they clearly want to be on television every week and get over the fact he's strong in the ring. The second thing is they're trying incredibly hard to make him into the previous incarnation of Bray Wyatt who spoke and you had a hell of a time trying to actually understand what he was saying. I think they're trying too hard with him verbally but I'm gathering that they are being very strategic with what he does if it's going to be something significant. They took their time with Murphy and Black and it paid off for both in different ways. I thought he'd be marginalized if he was going to be thrust into the stuff with KO and Rollins and I like that he hasn't been put there. That tells me they want him to stand out. They've got to have something in mind for him over the big picture (even if it starts clunky). I'm just curious to see what it is.
    Everything doesn't have to be done the same way but if what you're doing is already effective, why change it? And honestly, for me, I don't see what happened last night as a positive and I don't really care WHY she did it in terms of kayfabe. I don't care if it was some shout out to animals showing dominance, I don't care if it was my theory on her teeth, just like I don't care why they crucified Stone Cold to a symbol or why they saddled Lashley with the storyline he's in with Lana lol. Some shit is just dumb and doesn't need a 2nd look.

    What I'm saying is that while you might think Becky deserves a different kind of attack from Shayna because of how she attacked Bayley and Sasha, it goes back to the first sentence I started off this post with. If it's effective, why change it? Again, probably just a lot of us having sour grapes about how NXT talent is handled 90% of the time so we're all up in arms over something that will probably HOPEFULLY be left on Feb 10th, 2020.

    I've yet to see Black do anything of worth to be honest. Cool, he shut out Murphy and I'm not sure either guy has truly benefited. If either one has, it's clearly Murphy. Who's the one main eventing and heavily featured AND tag-team champions with the #1 heel and who's wrestling Eric Young in squash matches still? He wasn't even on Raw last night. Sucks because Black is dope, but they called him up and basically gave him ZERO of worth since Mania 35. Forgettable Cesaro feud and a handful of matches with a guy nobody gave a fuck about either. Time for them to stop fucking around with Black and let's hope post Mania he's all good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Everything doesn't have to be done the same way but if what you're doing is already effective, why change it? And honestly, for me, I don't see what happened last night as a positive and I don't really care WHY she did it in terms of kayfabe. I don't care if it was some shout out to animals showing dominance, I don't care if it was my theory on her teeth, just like I don't care why they crucified Stone Cold to a symbol or why they saddled Lashley with the storyline he's in with Lana lol. Some shit is just dumb and doesn't need a 2nd look.

    What I'm saying is that while you might think Becky deserves a different kind of attack from Shayna because of how she attacked Bayley and Sasha, it goes back to the first sentence I started off this post with. If it's effective, why change it? Again, probably just a lot of us having sour grapes about how NXT talent is handled 90% of the time so we're all up in arms over something that will probably HOPEFULLY be left on Feb 10th, 2020.

    I've yet to see Black do anything of worth to be honest. Cool, he shut out Murphy and I'm not sure either guy has truly benefited. If either one has, it's clearly Murphy. Who's the one main eventing and heavily featured AND tag-team champions with the #1 heel and who's wrestling Eric Young in squash matches still? He wasn't even on Raw last night. Sucks because Black is dope, but they called him up and basically gave him ZERO of worth since Mania 35. Forgettable Cesaro feud and a handful of matches with a guy nobody gave a fuck about either. Time for them to stop fucking around with Black and let's hope post Mania he's all good.
    Black was on Raw...

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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    Black's hardly the best pick for your point when he's been on TV every week for months, getting matches and promo time, recently had a solid feud with Murphy tearing it up in multiple matches, and is currently getting mic time in the ring every show. Like Mick Foley Tweeted last night, he's one good feud away from jumping up the ladder.

    EDIT: What BG said.
    First off let me correct myself because I forgot that Black did wrestle last night....against my fuckin homeboy Akira. And then he cut the same fucking boring promo he's been cutting forever. Only this time he's jerking off the fans (Thank you for sticking with me!) and he's not in a janitor's closet.

    And he's a perfect pick for my point. He's finally on tv after how many months of being stuck in the closet and this is what we get? A "feud" with Buddy Murphy and now we're back to him headkicking jobbers. AWESOME.

    Yeah, no offense to Mick Foley because he is in my top 5 of all time, but this guy used to go out of his way to prop Melina so maybe his "He's one good feud away from jumping up the ladder" doesn't exactly mean much when right now Black apparently is only about 1 or 2 rungs up a 20ft ladder.

    They need to give him something amazing. So far we haven't seen shit. If the WWE were truly sold on the guy, he would be doing SOMETHING of worth. Like I said to BG, look @ where Murphy is at and look at where Black is at. One of them got the push, the other was Black lol.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Black was on Raw...
    And I actually watched it live, very stoned, but yeah I addressed my memory loss. I mean, who could forget that awesome 2 minute squash and repeat promo? Amazing work WWE!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Everything doesn't have to be done the same way but if what you're doing is already effective, why change it? And honestly, for me, I don't see what happened last night as a positive and I don't really care WHY she did it in terms of kayfabe. I don't care if it was some shout out to animals showing dominance, I don't care if it was my theory on her teeth, just like I don't care why they crucified Stone Cold to a symbol or why they saddled Lashley with the storyline he's in with Lana lol. Some shit is just dumb and doesn't need a 2nd look.

    What I'm saying is that while you might think Becky deserves a different kind of attack from Shayna because of how she attacked Bayley and Sasha, it goes back to the first sentence I started off this post with. If it's effective, why change it? Again, probably just a lot of us having sour grapes about how NXT talent is handled 90% of the time so we're all up in arms over something that will probably HOPEFULLY be left on Feb 10th, 2020.

    I've yet to see Black do anything of worth to be honest. Cool, he shut out Murphy and I'm not sure either guy has truly benefited. If either one has, it's clearly Murphy. Who's the one main eventing and heavily featured AND tag-team champions with the #1 heel and who's wrestling Eric Young in squash matches still? He wasn't even on Raw last night. Sucks because Black is dope, but they called him up and basically gave him ZERO of worth since Mania 35. Forgettable Cesaro feud and a handful of matches with a guy nobody gave a fuck about either. Time for them to stop fucking around with Black and let's hope post Mania he's all good.
    I'm not arguing against your point but there's nothing wrong with my point, either. Again, that's something I've been trying to convey over the course of this. There's multiple ways to skin a cat or convey a message so it's just a matter of what happens after the fact.

    As for Black, you can say Murphy is getting pushed but Black is getting his own shine. Just matters what comes of the different paths. I've already commented on the presentation aspect of it all but the fact of the matter is he's either going to float into oblivion or they're playing their cards to set up for something strong for him in a gradual (probably glacial) pace. Right now he's clearly going to be in limbo because he's not going to Saudi Arabia so I wouldn't hold my breath on that progression to happen in the next month.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post

    As for Black, you can say Murphy is getting pushed but Black is getting his own shine. Just matters what comes of the different paths. I've already commented on the presentation aspect of it all but the fact of the matter is he's either going to float into oblivion or they're playing their cards to set up for something strong for him in a gradual (probably glacial) pace. Right now he's clearly going to be in limbo because he's not going to Saudi Arabia so I wouldn't hold my breath on that progression to happen in the next month.
    Black just needs more. His call up was extremely premature and made absolutely zero sense when it happened. Instead of returning to NXT like he should have (and probably Ricochet with him as well), they had him basically sit around doing nothing and that hurt him in the long run. Good showing at Rumble getting in the mix of that beatdown and I'm actually glad he isn't part of this whole scenario with Rollins v. Owens because he wouldn't be the main focus and I'm done with seeing him and Murphy wrestle over and over every fucking week lol.

    Last night just showed they're spinning their wheels with the guy. Same matches, same promos, people don't even remember he's on the show with all that shine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Black just needs more. His call up was extremely premature and made absolutely zero sense when it happened. Instead of returning to NXT like he should have (and probably Ricochet with him as well), they had him basically sit around doing nothing and that hurt him in the long run. Good showing at Rumble getting in the mix of that beatdown and I'm actually glad he isn't part of this whole scenario with Rollins v. Owens because he wouldn't be the main focus and I'm done with seeing him and Murphy wrestle over and over every fucking week lol.

    Last night just showed they're spinning their wheels with the guy. Same matches, same promos, people don't even remember he's on the show with all that shine.
    Murphy is getting his level of push, Black is getting his level of his. They're different but they're still involved. What happens when Murphy and Rollins lose the titles and Black moves into a bigger program will help determine how they're doing.

    Black needs more, yes. But he could be in a completely worse situation. All I'll say is, if he becomes Cedric Alexander (especially in reference to last night) then something went wrong.

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    I suspect they're biding their time with Black until the time is right and then he's going to take off. Lots of potential feuds are tied up at the moment that need to resolve before he can get in the mix. Wouldn't shock me if he jumps to the top of the card shortly after Mania by feuding with Rollins or even being Drew's first challenger.

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    Another example, in reference to the specific example ND is providing with the call-up with Black from NXT....if Black becomes Apollo Crews, something really went wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Murphy is getting his level of push, Black is getting his level of his. They're different but they're still involved. What happens when Murphy and Rollins lose the titles and Black moves into a bigger program will help determine how they're doing.

    Black needs more, yes. But he could be in a completely worse situation. All I'll say is, if he becomes Cedric Alexander (especially in reference to last night) then something went wrong.
    Oh yeah he could be in a completely worse situation. He could be fighting some religious war in a 3rd world country or working at a gas station on the southwest side of Detroit.

    Riddick Moss is involved. I just think that for Black, they have to stop this whole jabroni beating tour and give him a real feud. And the promos need to stop. He's out there praising the Universe, using all the appropriate WWE buzzwords that babyfaces use and it does not work at all. Honestly, never thought the guy could cut a promo regardless of where he was at which is probably why all the good shit he did in NXT revolved around much better talkers.

    Work on the promos, work on not coming across like a CM Punk fanboy. Where's Tommy End? That's the Black I want to see, not this watered down version that just beats up Main Event guys like EY and Akira every week.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    I suspect they're biding their time with Black until the time is right and then he's going to take off. Lots of potential feuds are tied up at the moment that need to resolve before he can get in the mix. Wouldn't shock me if he jumps to the top of the card shortly after Mania by feuding with Rollins or even being Drew's first challenger.
    Jesus Christ they've been biding their time for almost 10 months, how much more time does the WWE need to stop fucking around? That's the problem when they only book 4-5 people to matter and have 50 that just get forgotten.

    It would shock me to see him get that mega push against Rollins or Drew. They would have to do a lot of work to go from Black v. Eric Young to Black v. Rollins or Drew. Those are the top 2 guys on Raw without question sans Lesnar who I never count due to inactivity. So that's a major leap, that's on some Jinder Mahal shit. But at least people want to see Black elevated, nobody but maybe Jinder and Vince wanted to see him get the ultra push.

    Maybe Black going to Smackdown would be a plus after Mania. But again, in terms of a top tier feud like you're suggesting, what happens between now and then is critical. I'd be shocked if Black was on any ppvs for the next 3-4 months other than a spot in the Andre battle royal with how they're booking him.

    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Another example, in reference to the specific example ND is providing with the call-up with Black from NXT....if Black becomes Apollo Crews, something really went wrong.
    Why were both of your examples of something going completely wrong centered around black wrestlers? Am I missing a joke here lol? Hopefully BLACK doesn't wind up like 2 BLACK wrestlers?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post


    Why were both of your examples of something going completely wrong centered around black wrestlers? Am I missing a joke here lol? Hopefully BLACK doesn't wind up like 2 BLACK wrestlers?

    There's no joke.

    The first, Alexander, was a guy who was suddenly pushed into a big story and absolutely disappeared after that, and was fodder for an NXT guy last night. He was essentially the fourth-most important person involved in the angle he was involved in.

    The second, Crews, was a guy who was suddenly called up from NXT and wasn't developed as best as he could have been in NXT and clearly had no direction when called up and has done LESS than Alexander in the time he's been up.

    If Black goes the route of those two guys in terms of progression, they botched him.

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    If Black ends up like EC3, then he's not only in trouble, he's probably going to be in AEW.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Jesus Christ they've been biding their time for almost 10 months, how much more time does the WWE need to stop fucking around? That's the problem when they only book 4-5 people to matter and have 50 that just get forgotten.

    It would shock me to see him get that mega push against Rollins or Drew. They would have to do a lot of work to go from Black v. Eric Young to Black v. Rollins or Drew. Those are the top 2 guys on Raw without question sans Lesnar who I never count due to inactivity. So that's a major leap, that's on some Jinder Mahal shit. But at least people want to see Black elevated, nobody but maybe Jinder and Vince wanted to see him get the ultra push.

    Maybe Black going to Smackdown would be a plus after Mania. But again, in terms of a top tier feud like you're suggesting, what happens between now and then is critical. I'd be shocked if Black was on any ppvs for the next 3-4 months other than a spot in the Andre battle royal with how they're booking him.



    Why were both of your examples of something going completely wrong centered around black wrestlers? Am I missing a joke here lol? Hopefully BLACK doesn't wind up like 2 BLACK wrestlers?

    10 months has been a bit longer than maybe it should be but you've got to take into account there are a lot of moving parts. And wrestling fans aren't known for their patience, either. But the thing is, you're sitting here thinking "He should be doing more. i want him to be doing more" and therefore, I would suspect a lot of other folks are feeling the same way (I'm a massive Black fan and feel that way myself). That's why when it actually happens, and he steps up to the level you want him at and know he's capable and "should be" at, you're going to be pretty jazzed about it. I know I'm going to mark out if/when he suddenly interrupts and goes nose-to-nose with Rollins before Black Massing his ass to the mat. I think they know that, I mean, his promo on RAW was about how he's stuck in a cage for goodness' sake, that seems pretty on the nose for knowing he's treading water until something big goes down. I wouldn't say it's a Jinder jump as Jinder was a total jobber barely on TV and Black's been on a win streak for almost a year but yeah it's a jump but it's a jump that folks like us are chomping at the bit for which as you said, is very much the opposite of Jinder. Damn my optimism, i guess, but I think the dude's going to be making that jump real soon (Claymore vs Black Mass, anyone?).

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    There's no joke.

    The first, Alexander, was a guy who was suddenly pushed into a big story and absolutely disappeared after that, and was fodder for an NXT guy last night. He was essentially the fourth-most important person involved in the angle he was involved in.

    The second, Crews, was a guy who was suddenly called up from NXT and wasn't developed as best as he could have been in NXT and clearly had no direction when called up and has done LESS than Alexander in the time he's been up.

    If Black goes the route of those two guys in terms of progression, they botched him.
    I'm just wondering why it had to be 2 black wrestlers in your examples. You even beat home with adding Apollo Crews like what the fuck, yeah if anyone winds up like that guy you're not even botched you're just fucked lol.

    I think what you're trying to say is that if you're white, you're alright, if you're not, your botched. Kind of rhymes too. Even Riddick Moss is a champ.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    If Black ends up like EC3, then he's not only in trouble, he's probably going to be in AEW.


    10 months has been a bit longer than maybe it should be but you've got to take into account there are a lot of moving parts. And wrestling fans aren't known for their patience, either. But the thing is, you're sitting here thinking "He should be doing more. i want him to be doing more" and therefore, I would suspect a lot of other folks are feeling the same way (I'm a massive Black fan and feel that way myself). That's why when it actually happens, and he steps up to the level you want him at and know he's capable and "should be" at, you're going to be pretty jazzed about it. I know I'm going to mark out if/when he suddenly interrupts and goes nose-to-nose with Rollins before Black Massing his ass to the mat. I think they know that, I mean, his promo on RAW was about how he's stuck in a cage for goodness' sake, that seems pretty on the nose for knowing he's treading water until something big goes down. I wouldn't say it's a Jinder jump as Jinder was a total jobber barely on TV and Black's been on a win streak for almost a year but yeah it's a jump but it's a jump that folks like us are chomping at the bit for which as you said, is very much the opposite of Jinder. Damn my optimism, i guess, but I think the dude's going to be making that jump real soon (Claymore vs Black Mass, anyone?).
    EC3=non-black. Good example.

    I'm all about being patient but I would say since he was called up a year ago, they haven't really done him any positives. That thrown together team with Ricochet...I get that it was a way to showcase NXT talent but then they didn't go back like DIY did. Ricochet is in the mix but Black, not so much. And I think my patience has been depleting because I see how the majority of NXT talent gets used on the main roster and it's just mind blowing how it seems Vince and co would rather watch the top tier guys or the guys/gals with focus down there get booked weird.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    I'm just wondering why it had to be 2 black wrestlers in your examples. You even beat home with adding Apollo Crews like what the fuck, yeah if anyone winds up like that guy you're not even botched you're just fucked lol.

    I think what you're trying to say is that if you're white, you're alright, if you're not, your botched. Kind of rhymes too. Even Riddick Moss is a champ.
    You're reading into it way more than I was because I literally didn't consider the race. I considered the situation they were in, citing specific instances and call-up scenarios with no plans and featured on programming on Friday and Monday.

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    an affront to god mth's Avatar
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    I assume ND is joking about the black guy stuff but one can easily point to guys like Sanity, Bo Dallas, Tyler Breeze, Ascension, etc., for white folks who also got the shaft after their call-up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    You're reading into it way more than I was because I literally didn't consider the race. I considered the situation they were in, citing specific instances and call-up scenarios with no plans and featured on programming on Friday and Monday.
    Oh dude I'm literally fucking with you that's why I used the sunglasses emoji lol. It was kind of funny in my world with the last name, the 2 black wrestlers, yeah just dumb fun for me lol.

    But you're right in the grand scheme of things. Black was basically on the same level as Cedric, or hell even Buddy Murphy. THANK GOD for that stupid fucking storyline on Smackdown with Roman, DB, Rowan, etc. because it was the only time since Murphy left 205 where he seemed like he was worth a damn. A lot of people in wrestling these days can go out and have a good match, look at Adam Cole for fuck's sake. But you need a little more and that angle gave Murphy more than just a dude sitting on a stool with some smoke rolling up in a closet.

    Can you believe this guy is married to Zelina Vega? That alone made me a fan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Oh dude I'm literally fucking with you that's why I used the sunglasses emoji lol. It was kind of funny in my world with the last name, the 2 black wrestlers, yeah just dumb fun for me lol.

    But you're right in the grand scheme of things. Black was basically on the same level as Cedric, or hell even Buddy Murphy. THANK GOD for that stupid fucking storyline on Smackdown with Roman, DB, Rowan, etc. because it was the only time since Murphy left 205 where he seemed like he was worth a damn. A lot of people in wrestling these days can go out and have a good match, look at Adam Cole for fuck's sake. But you need a little more and that angle gave Murphy more than just a dude sitting on a stool with some smoke rolling up in a closet.

    Can you believe this guy is married to Zelina Vega? That alone made me a fan.
    Fair enough lol.

    The slow pace of everything is frustrating in a lot of ways with Black, no doubt. Like we've both said, they need to correct course with the promos and elevate him. Even based off what he said last night, a starting point is decent with Rowan then move on to another guy.

    As for Vega, definitely wouldn't have expected that when I heard that when it came out. If they're not talking about the business, I'm curious as hell what they are talking about in terms of their interests lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Fair enough lol.

    The slow pace of everything is frustrating in a lot of ways with Black, no doubt. Like we've both said, they need to correct course with the promos and elevate him. Even based off what he said last night, a starting point is decent with Rowan then move on to another guy.

    As for Vega, definitely wouldn't have expected that when I heard that when it came out. If they're not talking about the business, I'm curious as hell what they are talking about in terms of their interests lol.
    Black v. Rowan is a feud that I'm not high on because I don't care one bit about Rowan...BUTTTTT....If he's going to be around, that would be the feud I'd book as well.

    Vega-Black honestly reminds me of Moxley and Renee Young. Opposites attract for sure!

  71. #71
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    So Bayzler is the new "Jaws" now? Curious to know if that was Heyman's or Vince's bright idea?

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    So Bayzler is the new "Jaws" now? Curious to know if that was Heyman's or Vince's bright idea?
    Yeah just going by the past with ECW and early Smackdowns I don't know if that's Paul Heyman or not. I mean it's ultimately Vince and are we even sure Paul has any real stroke aside from being part of creative? Like how high on the food chain is he? Does he trump Stephanie and the like?

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    I don't think Stephanie has been involved with creative for years.

    From what we've heard, Heyman has a lot of influence regarding Raw creative right now. Possibly more than anyone else besides Vince has in years. He's second to Vince obviously but seems to be ahead of everyone else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    If anyone should be eating other talent it should be Sarah Logan.
    Her or Sonya Deville.

    Sonya does a different kind of "eating" on the girls, though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ringo View Post
    I don't think Stephanie has been involved with creative for years.

    From what we've heard, Heyman has a lot of influence regarding Raw creative right now. Possibly more than anyone else besides Vince has in years. He's second to Vince obviously but seems to be ahead of everyone else.
    That seems to be the perception with Stephanie. She's more of an office executive who can be on-air talent, but most of her stuff seems to be geared towards making appearances of different kinds and being an administrative face of the company.

    The more I think about it, I don't know who else can really be that involved in the process from a creative/decision-making process outside of Vince and Paul. There's guys like Hayes and etc but I doubt they actually come up with actual progressions for storylines and etc. Those types of guys feel more like guys who produce matches/finishes.

  76. #76
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Guys there's over 20 "writers" employed by the WWE. And if Triple H and Stephanie are backstage at every Raw, Smackdown, etc. I have to imagine they have some reason other than hanging out with Flex McMahon. But I don't work there so I have no idea what their roles are. The idea that it's just Vince, Paul E, and Triple H making all of this happen seems a little out there considering we know that there are writers upon writers littered on the payroll.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Guys there's over 20 "writers" employed by the WWE. And if Triple H and Stephanie are backstage at every Raw, Smackdown, etc. I have to imagine they have some reason other than hanging out with Flex McMahon. But I don't work there so I have no idea what their roles are. The idea that it's just Vince, Paul E, and Triple H making all of this happen seems a little out there considering we know that there are writers upon writers littered on the payroll.
    Obviously we don't know but my line of thinking is that there is a framework of a story that is understood and a directive given to the writers to work with, and then it's thrust upon those writers to manufacture the nuts and bolts of the show from that point. It then hits multiple levels of revisions based on approval of the key people involved, whoever they may be.

  78. #78
    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    The line of communication between the idea and the execution needs to be shorter. Because right now someone gets an idea... it’s passed on to the next level... they relay it to their team... then they relay it to the one that sends it to Vince... and then he slaps his mark on it.

  79. #79
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    Maybe someone just liked how Beth's bloody hair looked in the Rumble and wanted to recreate it without using a move that smashed her head or neck because it's a bad look with concussion protocol and all. And biting is what they came up with.

    In fact I think that's it. Yep I solved the puzzle. I am so smart.

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by VHS View Post
    Becky flipping out on the paramedics made no sense either. She's in her wrestling gear and doesn't even have her phone on her. So she's driving a stolen ambulance w/ the lights on to the hospital? Does she know the address? Does she know how to get there without Google Maps? Did she park in general parking or where the other ambulances are? Did she explain to the workers that she commandeered it herself and left the paramedics at the venue? Would they accept that or call the police on her?

    WWE is written by an AI, I swear to Cthulhu.

    If I were HHH I would be facepalming so hard over this whole thing. They spent so much time building her up to be this badass on NXT and now she's on the main roster... boom she's a biter.
    I imagine Becky called dispatch and said "Tell me where the fookin' Hospital is you arseholes!"

    After getting to the Hospital, Becky probably kicked the doctor in the balls while saying "I'll patch meself up!"

    I was reading some youtube comments, and someone made a good point. You don't drive all the way back to the arena to cut a promo, you go back to kick ass. At least have security hold her back from getting at Shayna because of her injury.

  81. #81
    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasori View Post
    I imagine Becky called dispatch and said "Tell me where the fookin' Hospital is you arseholes!"

    After getting to the Hospital, Becky probably kicked the doctor in the balls while saying "I'll patch meself up!"
    See, if WWE shot something like this then it would have been bloody fun lol.

    *Goes to kick doors open*
    *Automatic doors slide open*

    Becky: OH. Hey, where da bandages at? I got a chunk hangin' off me neck!

    Staff: You need to fill out these forms first.

    Becky: Piss on your forms, I gotta get back to RAW and kick some ass!!!

  82. #82
    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    usa
    They're trying to make Becky a female Stone Cold, and have been but she's just not that good. You know who'd be more believable in this role? Asuka (though her lack of English wouldn't hepl), Shayna Baszler, or Ronda Rousey.

    I'd be a lot more excited if Ronda was in the Becky role actually. Have no desire to see Becky vs. anyone. I really miss steam punk Becky.

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