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Thread: 2019 NFL Thread

  1. #1701
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    We played hard and gave it everything, but the Chiefs are the best team in the league. They were last year and couldn't get over the line, I think they do this year. Really hope it's the Packers playing them, the NFC is so competitive, particularly the North, that this looks like the biggest chance of an Aaron Rodgers Super Bowl.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fro View Post
    the world wants Mahomes vs Rodgers
    No

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fro View Post
    the world wants Mahomes vs Rodgers
    I don't lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rancid_Planet View Post
    Its a talk show. Dont let it hurt your feelings buddy.

    Well I'll say this about the game. I think we fell in love with the chance to pass the ball today and it cost us. I dont care if they were occasionally stopping Henry. Perfect game by KC.

    This super bowl is going to be great if Green Bay makes it. Boring if its SF.
    Just think Tennessee tried to set the tempo defensively with pressuring Mahomes and they couldn't get home. That wore them down over time. That and a negative swing to end the first half doomed them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Just think Tennessee tried to set the tempo defensively with pressuring Mahomes and they couldn't get home. That wore them down over time. That and a negative swing to end the first half doomed them.
    Yep. We need a pass rusher.

    But a GREAT season for the 9 and 7 Titans (first team to do that 4 years in a row btw). I'll treasure the win over the Raves forevr.

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    welp this is a blowout.

    Niners vs Chiefs is a good Super Bowl matchup. This Niners team is the best all around team this year, clearly. And the Chiefs offense is explosive. A classic best offense vs best defense kinda SB. Go Niners.

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    Everyone remember how it’s Mike McCarthy’s fault Aaron Rodgers only has 1 SB win, and not the fact more often than not, he simply can’t win big games?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Caito View Post
    Everyone remember how it’s Mike McCarthy’s fault Aaron Rodgers only has 1 SB win, and not the fact more often than not, he simply can’t win big games?
    He can't play defense too.

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    Rodgers is no long elite but he can show flashes. What ailed them in the past was his supporting cast more often than not. They were smoke and mirrors a lot of the way this season and they just ran into a monster today.

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    Temet Nosce Caito's Avatar
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    For the Degenerates like myself, FanDuel already has opening lines for the SB. Chiefs -1.5 O/u 52.5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Caito View Post
    Everyone remember how it’s Mike McCarthy’s fault Aaron Rodgers only has 1 SB win, and not the fact more often than not, he simply can’t win big games?
    Matt Lefleurreure fucking sucks.

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    The Rodger's turnovers hurt them tonight but lets not act like the playoff losses are all on him. He has 8 playoff losses...

    1) D gave up 45 points
    2) D gave up 37 points
    3) D gave up 45 points
    4) Led game-tying drive, never got ball again
    5) Led game-tying drive, never got ball again
    6) Led game-tying drive, never got ball again
    7) D gave up 44 points
    8) D gave up 37 points

  14. #1714
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    Bottom line is that he has only made one Super Bowl despite all the excuses.

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    Should be an exciting Superbowl. Stout defense vs. Explosive offense

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    There's only three QBs in the league right now who have more than one Super Bowl win. It's a team game. Is he still peak Aaron Rodgers? Absolutely not, but he's not a slouch by any degree. He just has to get used to a new normal in terms of performance. That team lacked an identity this season. You look at the teams that were playing this weekend and they stuck out like a sore thumb in terms of that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    There's only three QBs in the league right now who have more than one Super Bowl win. It's a team game. Is he still peak Aaron Rodgers? Absolutely not, but he's not a slouch by any degree. He just has to get used to a new normal in terms of performance. That team lacked an identity this season. You look at the teams that were playing this weekend and they stuck out like a sore thumb in terms of that.
    and depending on how long they play, could be zero heading into 2021.

    Brees and Rodgers should have more super bowls based on talent alone but they both had their faults and bad luck. They couldn't even make it to another one let alone win another one. Packers might not have even made it in 2010 had Cutler not gotten hurt.

  18. #1718
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    My brother has been a Chiefs fan since as far back as I can remember (he was a fan of the color red as a child lol and KC is barely 3 hours south of us). He's very excited.

    It's funny how the game can change for some of these teams. 4-5 years ago I attended my first NFL game, Chiefs v. Bengals. My best friend is a Bengals fan, and thank God the Chiefs at the time were like 1-9 or we might have been fucked with by the fans there lol. The fans shit on their own team more than anything, they were so terrible. Fast forward a few years and they're about to win the Super Bowl.

  19. #1719
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    I increasingly feeling like the niners are the best bet here. Like the pats/giants and broncos/Seahawks Super Bowls before us, the well rounded & defensively strong team will be too much for the pass heavy chiefs. I also think having Sherman is huge. I know he can only cover 1 guy but he has the mentality and experience to help get that secondary ready for this game.

    Niners 34, Chiefs 27

  20. #1720
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    T-minus 12 days until the Grbac Bowl.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fro View Post
    I increasingly feeling like the niners are the best bet here. Like the pats/giants and broncos/Seahawks Super Bowls before us, the well rounded & defensively strong team will be too much for the pass heavy chiefs. I also think having Sherman is huge. I know he can only cover 1 guy but he has the mentality and experience to help get that secondary ready for this game.

    Niners 34, Chiefs 27
    The Seahawks and Giants could throw the ball though or at least have the threat to throw the ball. Niners aren't winning throwing under 10 times. They will have to throw 25 at least and don't think they play their best when doing so. Niners are similar to the Titans but with a better defense. I see a similar type game though.

    Chiefs 31, Niners 20

  22. #1722
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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    The Seahawks and Giants could throw the ball though or at least have the threat to throw the ball. Niners aren't winning throwing under 10 times. They will have to throw 25 at least and don't think they play their best when doing so. Niners are similar to the Titans but with a better defense. I see a similar type game though.

    Chiefs 31, Niners 20
    I don't really agree with the thought process. Granted the opponent is radically different, but San Francisco just won twice where he threw the ball less than 20 times. Going back to Rancid's comment for Tennessee's theory with Tannehill, they just were't asking him to do it. I don't think Shanahan gives a damn. He'll run the ball until the opposition shows they're able to stop it. Style points be damned. Tennessee had the better runner but San Francisco has the better scheme and blockers for runners. Also, San Francisco clearly has better weapons on the perimeter than Tennessee.

    Not related to your post but more just in general, I think it's not wise to suggest that Garoppolo is incapable of being competent as a passer. He was slinging it in arguably the best regular season game this year.
    Last edited by BGMaverick; January 21st, 2020 at 2:22 PM.

  23. #1723
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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    I don't really agree with the thought process. Granted the opponent is radically different, but San Francisco just won twice where he threw the ball less than 20 times. Going back to Rancid's comment for Tennessee's theory with Tannehill, they just were't asking him to do it. I don't think Shanahan gives a damn. He'll run the ball until the opposition shows they're able to stop it. Style points be damned. Tennessee had the better runner but San Francisco has the better scheme and blockers for runners. Also, San Francisco clearly has better weapons on the perimeter than Tennessee.

    Not related to your post but more just in general, I think it's not wise to suggest that Garoppolo is incapable of being competent as a passer. He was slinging it in arguably the best regular season game this year.

    KC is also a top 3 rushing defense this year. GB was one of the bottom rush defenses. I have way more trust in Mahomes putting up 30 than I do putting the game in Jimmy G's hands. I just don't think SF will get away with running it 40 times and passing it 10. Just don't see it.

    Yes Jimmy G had a couple good to really good games but there hasn't been any consistency to make me believe he will do it in the biggest game. I trust KC's offense more than I do SF's regardless of the defense. If you were to ask KC, I bet they say they would love if the game came down to making Jimmy G throw the ball. Do you think the Niners will say the same?
    Last edited by PurePlayer; January 21st, 2020 at 2:42 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    KC is also a top 3 rushing defense this year. GB was one of the bottom rush defenses. I have way more trust in Mahomes putting up 30 than I do putting the game in Jimmy G's hands. I just don't think SF will get away with running it 40 times and passing it 10. Just don't see it.

    Yes Jimmy G had a couple good to really good games but there hasn't been any consistency to make me believe he will do it in the biggest game. I trust KC's offense more than I do SF's regardless of the defense. If you were to ask KC, I bet they say they would love if the game came down to making Jimmy G throw the ball. Do you think the Niners will say the same?
    You set yourself up for disappointment by asking that question.
    They'd be stupid if they said no. Also, asking that question is just asking for an answer you won't like because they believe in each other, no matter what.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    You set yourself up for disappointment by asking that question.
    They'd be stupid if they said no. Also, asking that question is just asking for an answer you won't like because they believe in each other, no matter what.
    what does this even mean?

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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    what does this even mean?
    A team isn't going to say, "ah hell, we got here in spite of our QB." They're going to believe in them to step up in the moment because he has at different points in the season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    A team isn't going to say, "ah hell, we got here in spite of our QB." They're going to believe in them to step up in the moment because he has at different points in the season.
    come on man. Obviously they are going to say that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    come on man. Obviously they are going to say that.
    Yeah, but you asked the question lol.

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    Why are people thinking the KC defense isn't any good? Outside of some slow starts, they've been great down the stretch and have lots of star power

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    Yeah, but you asked the question lol.
    Obviously any team is going to say yes. I am saying I doubt they really want it in his hands. could be wrong. He had good games. I just don't think he can keep up with KC if KC is able to stop the run. Their stats show they can stop the run.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Bandit View Post
    Why are people thinking the KC defense isn't any good? Outside of some slow starts, they've been great down the stretch and have lots of star power
    their run defense has been legit all year. their pass defense is average but i think they match up to the Niners offense honestly.

  31. #1731
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    Jimmy G is the prince who was promised. The heir apparent to Tom Brady, showing all of the same attributes, demeanor and mannerisms as Tom. It is only by the grace of Brady's agelessness that another team was able to acquire him. Alas, it was not meant to be that he would take up the reins for another decade of dominance in Foxboro. And yet, my feelings about his destiny remain the same. If you are to put the ball in his hands with the game on the line, he will deliver like his on-field father has so many times before him. So yes I trust in Jimmy.

    And Deebo-Sanders-Kittle is a nice trifecta of guys to throw to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bandit View Post
    Why are people thinking the KC defense isn't any good? Outside of some slow starts, they've been great down the stretch and have lots of star power
    I don't think they're bad, but if people can have suspicions about Garoppolo, there can be a tinge of skepticism about KC's defense, especially based on how San Francisco has looked.

    There's seven games this season just looking at the opposing runner and the attack of that offense that I'd want to look at the raw numbers to see how they fared against KC's run defense:
    Both games against Oakland, Jacksonville, Indy, Minnesota, Tenneesee in the regular season, and Baltimore.

    Looking at it, I'm not overly impressed with that I saw from the defensive output, in terms of rushing defense in those games. I think there's only two in there from a perspective of looking at the flow of the rush defense where I think they come out looking okay (Minnesota and Jacksonville). The general result of the Baltimore game is what KC is likely hoping plays out in the sense of rolling with the punches in terms of facing a run attack but getting enough on their own side of the attack on offense.
    Last edited by BGMaverick; January 21st, 2020 at 3:04 PM.

  33. #1733
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    I've not yet been convinced by Jimmy G to the level of a top 10 quarterback, but he's not a bad quarterback. By all means he can make a play to win big games. Jared Goff won a shootout with KC last year and everybody's down on him. Ryan Tannehill orchestrated a game winning drive against them in the regular season. I think there's more quarterbacks that can navigate a crucial game winning drive than there are not. Particularly with Samuel, Kittle and Sanders to play with. I get the Super Bowl is a different kettle of fish, but it's not all about who the best QB is. The ghost of Peyton Manning defeated the reigning MVP a few years back. Nick fucking Foles beat the GOAT. It's as much about the rest of the playmakers on both sides of ball as it is the quarterback. In fact, there's an argument that the team with the better QB that season has lost in the Super Bowl. Newton, Ryan and Brady were consecutive regular season MVP's to lose the big game. Goff arguably outperformed Brady during the regular season last year. Brady being better than Wilson at that point is probably the last time.

    I'm leaning the Chiefs, just based on what they've experienced this post season. They've found themselves in holes and have shown the character and resolve to have both games well in hand going into the fourth quarter after difficult starts. They won't collapse like Green Bay. They know they have playmakers on defence and the firepower on offence to go 21-0 over 5 combined drives. If the ball is in the hands of Mahomes and he's got Tyreek and Kelce, they can stretch the field quickly and efficiently. The 49ers don't have the chunk play capabilities of the Chiefs, providing the Chiefs don't collapse against the run like Green Bay did. They got to grips with Henry, so we'll see if their scheme adapts to what will likely be mostly Mostert rather than a back by committee. That I think is a difference maker. Coleman being an option as a different kind of back has helped get the most out of Mostert.

  34. #1734
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    TWO NEW RULES TO BE TESTED AT PRO BOWL

    --OPTIONS AFTER A SUCCESSFUL FIELD GOAL OR TRY ATTEMPT WITH NO KICKOFF

    The scoring team, Team A, has the following options:

    Team A may elect to give Team B the ball at Team Bís 25-yard line, beginning a new series of downs with a first-and-10.
    Team A may elect to take the ball at its own 25-yard line for a fourth-and-15 play.

    If Team A is successful in making a first down, Team A will maintain possession and a new series of downs will continue as normal.

    If Team A is unsuccessful in making a first down, the result will be a turnover on downs and Team B will take possession at the dead ball spot.

    --NOT A FALSE START ON A FLINCH BY A FLEXED RECEIVER

    It is not a false start if a flexed, eligible receiver in a two-point stance who flinches or picks up one foot, as long as his other foot remains partially on the ground and he resets for one second prior to the snap. A receiver who fits this exception is not considered to be ďin motionĒ for the purposes of the Illegal Shift rules.

    It is not a false start if all 11 offensive players have been set for at least one full second and any flexed, eligible receiver breaks his stance by picking up both
    The onside kick alternative is interesting. The personnel certainly matters, but if you have a better than decent qb I'd rather take my chances at a 4th-and-15 than an onside kick.

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    That almost sounds like a game ruiner. Id need to see it play out. But teams with a really elite qb might just never turn the ball over for an entire half now lol.

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    The onside kick thing doesn’t make sense....

    And by that I mean the starting point.


    Under normal onside kick rules you are kicking from the 35, and generally not allowed to touch it til it gets to the 45. So why not have the line where you are trying this “4th and 15” from the 35 or 40? Kinda of split the difference there. So now if it fails by an incomplete pass, which I’m sure most of these would be pass plays, instead of the defending team starting around the 25, they are closer to where they would’ve been on a conventional onside kick attempt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Caito View Post
    The onside kick thing doesn’t make sense....

    And by that I mean the starting point.


    Under normal onside kick rules you are kicking from the 35, and generally not allowed to touch it til it gets to the 45. So why not have the line where you are trying this “4th and 15” from the 35 or 40? Kinda of split the difference there. So now if it fails by an incomplete pass, which I’m sure most of these would be pass plays, instead of the defending team starting around the 25, they are closer to where they would’ve been on a conventional onside kick attempt.
    because its a lot easier to convert a 4th and 15 than an onside kick and it's so teams don't just go for it without a thought.

    I hate these rules. why reward teams who are down two or more possessions to make it easier to come back? if they do go with this stupid rule, they should not allow it until like under 5 minutes in the 4th or something like that

  38. #1738
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    Strong dislike of the 4th and 15 rule. The other rule...how often do we even see WRs called for false starts? I guess you see it with TEs but typically when that happens they're more in as blockers and do more than just lift one foot.

    So there's a site that shows penalties by position. In 2019 there were 77 false starts by TEs and 62 by WRs so more than I would have anticipated.

    Also Laremy Tunsil had the most false starts for a player by quite a distance. 14 where the player in second had 8.

    The website is here https://www.nflpenalties.com/
    Last edited by Pablo Diablo; January 22nd, 2020 at 10:54 AM.

  39. #1739
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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    because its a lot easier to convert a 4th and 15 than an onside kick and it's so teams don't just go for it without a thought.

    I hate these rules. why reward teams who are down two or more possessions to make it easier to come back? if they do go with this stupid rule, they should not allow it until like under 5 minutes in the 4th or something like that

    Just to play devil's advocate, do you think a team that is down two or more possessions will be able to easily convert a 4th and 15? I don't hate the rule but I don't think as many teams will go for it as you may fear.

    Apparently only about 6% of onside kicks resulted in recovery for the 2018 and 2019 regular seasons. I could only find guesses as to the conversion rate of 4th and 15s or longer and it was about 15%.

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    I believe I read that before they changed the kickoff rules 2 years ago, onside kick conversion rates were about 20%, and since then they have dropped to about 10%. I would be okay with employing a "4th and whatever" type play to replace onside kicks, since 10% seems pretty low to me. They should choose whatever yardage makes sense to make it have be no more than a 20% conversion rate (perhaps 15 yards isn't long enough?). And still allow the onside kick too, since that 4th and long play is going to be a lot easier for a team like the Chiefs than the some team with crap receivers and a lousy QB.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigAl View Post
    Just to play devil's advocate, do you think a team that is down two or more possessions will be able to easily convert a 4th and 15? I don't hate the rule but I don't think as many teams will go for it as you may fear.

    Apparently only about 6% of onside kicks resulted in recovery for the 2018 and 2019 regular seasons. I could only find guesses as to the conversion rate of 4th and 15s or longer and it was about 15%.
    For starters an illegal contact or defensive holding would automatically give a team a first down. I would suggest a team with a really good qb has a better than 15% to convert. A 4th and 15 for someone like Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, or Russell Wilson is a walk in the park compared to an onside kick

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fro View Post
    I believe I read that before they changed the kickoff rules 2 years ago, onside kick conversion rates were about 20%, and since then they have dropped to about 10%. I would be okay with employing a "4th and whatever" type play to replace onside kicks, since 10% seems pretty low to me. They should choose whatever yardage makes sense to make it have be no more than a 20% conversion rate (perhaps 15 yards isn't long enough?). And still allow the onside kick too, since that 4th and long play is going to be a lot easier for a team like the Chiefs than the some team with crap receivers and a lousy QB.
    i doubt any team would prefer to go for the onside kick regardless of the qb. Just getting a simple illegal contact gives them a first down. i think 4th and 20 makes more sense. but i'd prefer no change.

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    To be clear, I’m not saying the 4th and 15 things is awful. I’m not a fan but I can see it happening. I’m more curious why from the 25? That seems too deep in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    For starters an illegal contact or defensive holding would automatically give a team a first down. I would suggest a team with a really good qb has a better than 15% to convert. A 4th and 15 for someone like Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, or Russell Wilson is a walk in the park compared to an onside kick
    I didn't even think of that part of it, good point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Caito View Post
    To be clear, I’m not saying the 4th and 15 things is awful. I’m not a fan but I can see it happening. I’m more curious why from the 25? That seems too deep in.
    I agree with you that it's too deep. And whatever they're doing here with the pro bowl wouldn't necessarily be what they would go with in the event of a rule change. The rule proposal for this last year, which got rejected, I think it would have been from the 35 not the 25. That proposal also said you can do it only once per game, and in the 4th quarter only.

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    Ahhh. Missed those two caveats

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fro View Post
    I agree with you that it's too deep. And whatever they're doing here with the pro bowl wouldn't necessarily be what they would go with in the event of a rule change. The rule proposal for this last year, which got rejected, I think it would have been from the 35 not the 25. That proposal also said you can do it only once per game, and in the 4th quarter only.
    well that's better.

    why do you think that's too deep in? if the chances are better to convert, shouldn't they make it a harsher penalty if it's not converted?

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    This was the rejected proposal last year.

    The issue of penalties is definitely a good point. You would hate to see that conversion happen because of a ticky tack defensive foul, though you can imagine the refs would swallow their whistles unless it's something egregious.

    This is something, in my opinion, they should open up not just for the pro bowl but for the preseason and get a year or two of experience with it before voting to pass it. (If they even want to go down this route).

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    So long, Eli. Best thing your always confused ass ever did was prevent the Pats from getting that perfect season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    For starters an illegal contact or defensive holding would automatically give a team a first down. I would suggest a team with a really good qb has a better than 15% to convert. A 4th and 15 for someone like Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, or Russell Wilson is a walk in the park compared to an onside kick
    This is the can of worms the NFL probably doesn't realize they're opening up with this idea. I imagine a decent amount of teams would instantly just be gunning/begging for a call to just circumvent the scenario.

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    Eli is going to be an example of how a very average QB got into the Hall based off of two good postseason runs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Caito View Post
    Eli is going to be an example of how a very average QB got into the Hall based off of two good postseason runs.
    And how QB results can be overshadowed by team performance.

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    Absolutely.

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    If Eli had two superbowls for Jacksonville instead of the New York Giants and his last name was Smith not Manning, he'd have a harder time getting in.

    But it is what it is. And not for nothing, the guy is number 7 all time in passing yards and passing tds so it's not like he sucked it up for a whole career.

    Probably played about 5 seasons too long though.

    Side question, if not for the Mannings, how many rings does Brady have? Could he even lift his arms at this point?

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    Def two more. Coughlin's Giants always had a D that could come after Brady damn well. And Eli did make the throws he absolutely needed to when it came time in those games.

    As for Peyton, he did have a hand in stopping the Pats getting to a few SB's Who knows what happens if they had gotten there, but we'll never know.

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    The Antonio Brown saga continues. It's hard to feel bad for him given that he's such an all encompassing asshole who seemingly but it seems more and more apparent that he has some sort of serious mental health issue (not that I'm a doctor but I would guess bipolar or borderline personality disorder) and needs help.

    For those not up to speed, there's now an arrest warrant for him and his buddy assaulting a moving truck driver and essentially taking AB's possessions off the truck by force after refusing to pay the bill, and AB's girlfriend/baby mama posted this. I'm not sure if she's the one who was leaving the house with the kids when AB was yelling at the cops a week or two ago.


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    Its like Shannon Sharpe said. He's going to have hit bottom, bounce, then hit bottom again before he can fix himself.

    The question is. Can he do it in time to salvage his career? I'm leaning towards no.

    And yes he needs real help. The kind you have to want. Just going to see some court or league ordered shrink while he sits and gives them attitude won't fix him. Hes going to have to have a moment of clarity where he realizes he is sick and needs to talk to someone.

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    I’m not too worried about his career. I’m seriously starting to wonder if we should worry he may off himself. Not a joke.

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    That kind of narcissism makes me worry more he might kill someone else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rancid_Planet View Post

    Side question, if not for the Mannings, how many rings does Brady have? Could he even lift his arms at this point?
    Or if the Falcons and Seahawks run the ball.... you get my point.

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    rip manningface. i'll miss you so much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PurePlayer View Post
    Or if the Falcons and Seahawks run the ball.... you get my point.
    Or if Archie doesnt feed his kids human growth hormone to make them all giants.

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    Late to the party but part of the reason they want the 4th and 15 from the 25 is they do not want a team to be able to throw a hail mary into the end zone on the "kickoff."

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    They should let Eli play in the pro bowl. Seriously. I mean that game is a joke anyway and letting him play before retiring would actually be a reason to watch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fro View Post
    They should let Eli play in the pro bowl. Seriously. I mean that game is a joke anyway and letting him play before retiring would actually be a reason to watch.
    I can't imagine that moves the meter that much. It sure as hell wouldn't for me.

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    Man, it will be weird without Eli going one & done in the playoffs.
    Last edited by Mr. T; Yesterday at 11:53 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fro View Post
    They should let Eli play in the pro bowl. Seriously. I mean that game is a joke anyway and letting him play before retiring would actually be a reason to watch.
    I doubt he would want to. I don't think players really like playing in the Pro Bowl.

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