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Thread: All Elite Wrestling

  1. #8901
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    what the fuck are you old people talking about, who is that
    Its right up your alley Hero.

    Frankly, I'm disappointed. I'm tempted to call you a stupid daikini, but I am not sure if that's right for you.

  2. #8902
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    is this shit on streaming?

    that skull guy looks cool

  3. #8903
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    So overall, Rampage beat the 30 min smackdown overrun in the demo. Becky/Sasha lost to Punk/Sydal, but interestingly enough Bunny vs Ruby tied with the contract signing.

    I think they're head to head again for a bit this week? So, let's see what gets thrown out there this week, lol

  4. #8904
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    is this shit on streaming?

    that skull guy looks cool
    Disney+

    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    So overall, Rampage beat the 30 min smackdown overrun in the demo. Becky/Sasha lost to Punk/Sydal, but interestingly enough Bunny vs Ruby tied with the contract signing.

    I think they're head to head again for a bit this week? So, let's see what gets thrown out there this week, lol
    Out of respect for those of you from your era who were raised with the whole "everyone gets a trophy" mentality I just want to try and old chant from back in the day:

    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*

    AEW lost. Smackdown won. Smackdown on a channel not very many people even have. Rampage already has a reputation. Where did the 500k fans go that tuned in for Punk? They literally lost half a million viewers in a matter of weeks. That's crazy. For a company who's hardcore fanbase prides itself on praising ratings like 800,000-1.2 million, where's that energy now? Instead it's "The key demo" What a joke. What was it 0.32 v. 0.34...? Just take the L with all that money he's got.

  5. #8905
    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    what the fuck are you old people talking about, who is that


  6. #8906
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Disney+



    Out of respect for those of you from your era who were raised with the whole "everyone gets a trophy" mentality I just want to try and old chant from back in the day:

    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*
    SHUT THE FUCK UP *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*

    AEW lost. Smackdown won. Smackdown on a channel not very many people even have. Rampage already has a reputation. Where did the 500k fans go that tuned in for Punk? They literally lost half a million viewers in a matter of weeks. That's crazy. For a company who's hardcore fanbase prides itself on praising ratings like 800,000-1.2 million, where's that energy now? Instead it's "The key demo" What a joke. What was it 0.32 v. 0.34...? Just take the L with all that money he's got.
    Rampage's half hour beat Smackdown's final half hour purely in viewers

  7. #8907
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    Rampage's half hour beat Smackdown's final half hour purely in viewers
    Old man yells at cloud

  8. #8908
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Chants never last that long either.

  9. #8909
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    Rampage's half hour beat Smackdown's final half hour purely in viewers
    So?

  10. #8910
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    Old man yells at cloud
    You could learn a thing or two.

  11. #8911
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    So?
    So that was the head to head part.

  12. #8912
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    So your argument is moot. You said Smackdown beat Rampage, but when they were actually going head-to-head with WWE's biggest segments of the night, AEW outdid them.

  13. #8913
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    So your argument is moot. You said Smackdown beat Rampage, but when they were actually going head-to-head with WWE's biggest segments of the night, AEW outdid them.
    LOL remember the other day when you tried to say you don't have an excuse for everything....here you are.

    Here's my argument: Smackdown beat Rampage. Slice it up however you want Man of 1,000 Excuses, but they lost.

    Again, you don't make excuses yet here you are trying to slice it up. Anything to try and make AEW seem like they never do anything less than WWE lol. For fuck's sake.

  14. #8914
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    You same AEW marks propped up AEW beating Raw in the key demo like it was a real victory. Like I said, anything to make it seem like AEW always has the drop on WWE.

    I can't wait for the non-excuse making quitter Psycho666 (oh edgy!) to make another excuse.

  15. #8915
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    So your argument is moot. You said Smackdown beat Rampage, but when they were actually going head-to-head with WWE's biggest segments of the night, AEW outdid them.

    shhh facts have no place in an argument with ND

  16. #8916
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    shhh facts have no place in an argument with ND
    The fact that Smackdown beat Rampage?

  17. #8917
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    The fact that Smackdown beat Rampage?
    you don’t know how to read and that’s ok

  18. #8918
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    For the thirty minute that the two programs were head to head, more people watched aew


    i know, numbers are hard and you’re not that bright, but you should probably stop acting like a petulant child because you’re wrong.

  19. #8919
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    10-10:15: 363,000 vs. 272,000
    10-15-10:30: 293,000 vs. 293,000


    Full 30 min: 328,000 vs. 282,500


    can anyone good at math tell me which numbers are larger this is so hard and difficult to figure out

  20. #8920
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    The other day you guys were bragging about Dynamite beating Raw in the 18-49 demo.

    Smackdown had more viewers than Rampage. Smackdown lost 60% of their audience moving to FSN and Rampage still couldn't get a decent rating. They had a 13% increase, wow.

    I just don't see why you guys pretend like you're about one thing and then change it up when AEW doesn't pull it off.

  21. #8921
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    LOL remember the other day when you tried to say you don't have an excuse for everything....here you are.

    Here's my argument: Smackdown beat Rampage. Slice it up however you want Man of 1,000 Excuses, but they lost.

    Again, you don't make excuses yet here you are trying to slice it up. Anything to try and make AEW seem like they never do anything less than WWE lol. For fuck's sake.
    I'm just pointing out where your argument obviously falls short. No excuses needed.

  22. #8922
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    I'm just pointing out where your argument obviously falls short. No excuses needed.

    numbers hard

  23. #8923
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    I'm just pointing out where your argument obviously falls short. No excuses needed.
    It didn't fall short. Who had more viewers? Smackdown.

  24. #8924
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    numbers hard
    I've read your posts about educating, it's scary.

  25. #8925
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    It didn't fall short. Who had more viewers? Smackdown.
    Not when viewers had to choose which show they wanted to watch live.

  26. #8926
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    Not when viewers had to choose which show they wanted to watch live.
    More people watched Smackdown live than they did AEW. Is this even a real conversation right now??

  27. #8927
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    More people watched Smackdown live than they did AEW. Is this even a real conversation right now??
    It is, surprisingly

  28. #8928
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    It is, surprisingly
    How difficult would it be for you to not make an excuse for AEW?

  29. #8929
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    See my comments on Bobby Fish

  30. #8930
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Amazing that so many people watched Rampage live when at the exact same time they could have been watching that extra half hour of Smackdown. Huge win for AEW.

  31. #8931
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    https://twitter.com/sammyguevara/sta...il92SmnjQ&s=19

    This is the holy shit moment that wasn't on TV.

  32. #8932
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    See my comments on Bobby Fish
    What about them?

  33. #8933
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    The Martin/Black match was really good. The nod at the end was an unnecessary but fun touch.

    I definitely laughed when Punk made the comment about Serena's hair.

    The comedy was probably more memorable to me than the actual match between the trios. Like the teasing they did between Britt and Ana. It's a good progression for both of them and has added sizzle based on the implication of who they're dating and the different level of animosity that can be created by that. It can be good to utilize that as long as you don't beat the viewer over the head with it.

    Miro's promo was really good and used his message in a warped perspective now. Shame he's not in the tournament but I'm guessing that's fitting for the narrative he's using now.

    Page needed to deliver a money promo to give his character direction, address his absence, and set the stage for the road ahead and he really delivered. They've got time to build off that and it's safe to say that the promo established a very strong foundation for his reintroduction.

    Good grappling for the main event.

  34. #8934
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I don't understand the World title eliminator tournament one bit. Why is Moxley wrestling #10? Why is Danielson wrestling Rhodes? It would be one thing if these were matches to get IN to the tournament and then you'd have a pretty good 8-man tournament. Who knows....maybe #10 will win it all and throw everyone off.

  35. #8935
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Too many people that shouldn't lose right now.

  36. #8936
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    Too many people that shouldn't lose right now.
    I agree with this. Its going to be interesting to see how AEW handles managing these competing priorities over the next 3-6 months. Hard to keep as many people that separate in the long-term.

    I enjoyed this week's programming quite a bit. I didn't enjoy this week's Tony Kahn interview statements, too much of a weird ego vibe right now.

  37. #8937
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    Too many people that shouldn't lose right now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mazer View Post
    I agree with this. Its going to be interesting to see how AEW handles managing these competing priorities over the next 3-6 months. Hard to keep as many people that separate in the long-term.

    I enjoyed this week's programming quite a bit. I didn't enjoy this week's Tony Kahn interview statements, too much of a weird ego vibe right now.
    So you put lames in the WORLD TITLE ELIMINATOR to avoid someone taking a loss?

    That's a huge problem with AEW. Too many padded records. Quality over quantity is something they need to really think about.

    The ratings don't lie. Rampage lost over half their audience. Dynamite hasn't really grown beyond what we all expected when NXT moved to Tuesdays. When they do put on a heavy card, it doesn't really move the needle but at least it's better than watching Sting beat up the youth or Moxley v. some nobody.

  38. #8938
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    There was realistically no way for Rampage to keep that ratins audience. Punk was something that most people wanted to see live. It was one of the few things that could significantly cut into recordings. I'm not sure that the decline in total viewership isn't less than traditional ratings suggest.

    That said, Tony Kahn is making weird flexes on ratings that exist inside margin of error.

    There's a level of specificity in these ratings arguments that are asinine. Ratings are estimates. And increasingly imprecise. They're arguably less relevant now than social media tracking. The thing is, those numbers are not readily available to the public, so 90s logic and availability makes us overinflate. Of course, they are also easy to point to by company reps on social media and investor calls.

    Its going to be interesting to see what happens when the model changes.


    https://variety.com/2021/tv/news/nie...gs-1235069796/

    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv...ts-1235010407/

    https://variety.com/2021/tv/news/nie...us-1234970113/

  39. #8939
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    I don't get these demograph ratings. So Smackdown gets more viewers but because AEW gets more in a certain age category they claim it as more.

    Doesn't make sense to me. Do people outside of that bracket not count like?

  40. #8940
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    AEW will claim anything as a win. It's like listening to die hard supporters of Hillary Clinton. Only here in this thread it's die hard supporters of Trump.

  41. #8941
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chatty View Post
    I don't get these demograph ratings. So Smackdown gets more viewers but because AEW gets more in a certain age category they claim it as more.

    Doesn't make sense to me. Do people outside of that bracket not count like?
    The 18-49 male demographic is among the most valuable to advertisers. Its viewed that people in this category have some level of autonomy in their purchasing decisions, but are more less likely to have established brand loyalty.

    Like in the last 20 years, I've had toyotas, kias, fords, and a lincoln as vehicles. I will likely not go through as many different auto companies in the next 20 years.

    Advertisers expect I'll be less likely to flip companies as I get older. And often they're right. So they want to get me before I buy my 3rd apple product, and therefore never allowed to consider the specs on a competing product again.

    So shows with higher ratings in that demo can sell ads at a higher rate for shows that have the exact same viewership at different demographics.



    Which still is kind of a weird thing for companies or fans to flex on.

    Although I kinda have enjoyed Jericho calling himself a demo god anyway. What can I say? I can't stay mad at him.

  42. #8942
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    Quote Originally Posted by chatty View Post
    I don't get these demograph ratings. So Smackdown gets more viewers but because AEW gets more in a certain age category they claim it as more.

    Doesn't make sense to me. Do people outside of that bracket not count like?
    During the 30 minutes the 2 programs were head to head, more people watched AEW. Nothing to do with demographics. For the other 2 hours when Smackdown was on TV and AEW was not, Smackdown had more viewers.

  43. #8943
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    Tony Khan is definitely in tool mode with how much he's boasted about this stuff lately.

    The important thing for me isn't so much AEW beating WWE but more that the closer they get, the more likely they are to sustain as competition and keep support from the network and all that jazz. Not only is that good for AEW, but I feel the more successes they have, the more WWE will feel pressured to give a full effort with their product regularly.

  44. #8944
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    I'm a big believer in competition there as well.

    And honestly, I'm not a brand loyalist. I agree with Yes Movement Daniel Bryan "American Dragon" Danielsen. There's too much tribalism among fans.


    Like its fucking emotionally challenging to be both enjoying Roman Reigns' heel run and the potential for Hangman Page to go over Kenny Omega?


    And yes, I legitimately get more worried about the long-term sustainability the more I hear Tony Kahn talk. hopefully, as the inevitable bumps come his way, he brings it back in.

  45. #8945
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    I think he's just playing off of the buzz and the idea that all publicity is good.

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    I don't get the fascination. I would enjoy talking someone who was in their 30's, 40's during the Monday Night Wars. Everyone of my older relatives or friends' siblings who were older, none of them watched wrestling. They knew The Rock, Stone Cold, nWo, but they also knew other shit that was popular-didn't mean they watched it. Obviously you look in the crowds and you see these people but were they truly brand loyal or were they just loyal to sports entertainment?

    That's why you'll hear Eric and Bruce talk about how it wasn't 9-10 million fans watching Nitro and Raw it was more like 7 maybe 8 million and a lot of channel surfing.

    I just think some fans get caught up in the mob mentality, like they're part of the company the same way I'm sure straw hat guy and Faith No More guitarist in the ECW crowd were.

  47. #8947
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    If you watch WWE or any company and all you can think of is "I can't wait to shit on the other company when this is over!" You have a mental issue. It's weird.

  48. #8948
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    You'll never look at Orange Cassidy the same way again.


  49. #8949
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasori View Post
    You'll never look at Orange Cassidy the same way again.

    On the flip side:
    https://twitter.com/allan_cheapshot/...3zO71hNfg&s=19

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Those versions both suck balls. This is the only persona he should be known for, the all powerful Fire Ant:


  51. #8951
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    I think he's just playing off of the buzz and the idea that all publicity is good.
    He might be. He also might be James Dolan who thinks his dad's success makes him successful.

    But the whole "WWE watches AEW at NXT, we JUST CONCENTRATE on OUR SHOW', but also "I have more money than WWE and I can't wait to kick their ass straight up"


    Ultimately, its all a wash as long as AEW continues to put out a wrestling show I enjoy.

    But it seems like he's going to become a bit of card. Or maybe not. This is AEW's biggest spotlight. He might chill with thime.

  52. #8952
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    He's not stupid, let's just make that perfectly clear. He's a super mark. When people watch AEW they need that anti-WWE rhetoric. They need Dan Lambert so they can pretend to boo the naysayers, the Jim Cornette's, the Russo's, whoever the fuck.

    See, 25-30 years ago, Vince McMahon would've been right there on Twitter, on the the Canadian talk shows, taking a shit on Tony Khan. In a way he still is, remember that line about how he said he would keep providing them talent? That was brilliant. Vince is just too old to truly give a shit about another wrestling company because despite demos and tv ratings, AEW doesn't have the global presence and that's fine. I don't know if that's Tony's goal.

    5 years from now will Tony Khan even be running AEW?

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    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    It's like watching ECW back in the day. I wasn't into Bischoff releasing the results of Raw, it honestly didn't bother me because A-I didn't know if he was lying and B-you can't get a real feel of the product by reading results.

    But ECW were ruthless, even when they were in business with the WWF at the time. And I think a lot of people tuned in to listen to Shane Douglas or Taz take a shit on Ric Flair, HBK, Vince, Hogan, etc. Whatever was mainstream, whatever was #1-fuck 'em.

  54. #8954
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    Tony's gonna end up being the next Feinstein.

    You heard it here first

  55. #8955
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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  56. #8956
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    Tony's gonna end up being the next Feinstein.

    You heard it here first
    When I first read this, I saw it as Weinstein.


    I thought that he's a bit out there, but I'm not sure that we go there.

  57. #8957
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazer View Post
    When I first read this, I saw it as Weinstein.


    I thought that he's a bit out there, but I'm not sure that we go there.
    You were not alone in your first read assessment, ha.

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    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Although, I do want Psych to now dive deeper into his Feinstein theory.

  59. #8959
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    So is Khan going to get a #metoo moment? Or am I thinking of someone else?

    Psycho, how can you have such incredible taste in rap music (Going to see my favorite rapper GZA) yet act like such a jabroni? I guess I should ask myself that same question........

    From now on I will no longer shit on you.

  60. #8960
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    Feinstein isn’t better then Weinstein, unfortunately.

  61. #8961
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    So is Khan going to get a #metoo moment? Or am I thinking of someone else?

    Psycho, how can you have such incredible taste in rap music (Going to see my favorite rapper GZA) yet act like such a jabroni? I guess I should ask myself that same question........

    From now on I will no longer shit on you.
    You're thinking of Weinstein (as we all were). And not Feinstein.

  62. #8962
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    I'm glad it's finally official. Now if only Garcia had better taste in rap. Westside Gunn fucking sucks.

  63. #8963
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    I'm glad it's finally official. Now if only Garcia had better taste in rap. Westside Gunn fucking sucks.

    what about Austin gunn

  64. #8964
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero! View Post
    what about Austin gunn
    He's aight. I know you don't really watch Sammy's vlog but I think you'll like this.

  65. #8965
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  66. #8966
    Letís Go Brandon! Hero!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    He's aight. I know you don't really watch Sammy's vlog but I think you'll like this.
    I do and I am excited. Always happy to see more Luchadors working in the states.

  67. #8967
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazer View Post
    You're thinking of Weinstein (as we all were). And not Feinstein.
    Oh I'm well aware of who is who. I thought maybe I was confusing Rob Black from XPW with Rob Feinstein (Founder of Ring of Honor/RF Video for those who don't know) but I just googled the Feinstein situation. He got Chris Hanson'd trying to meet a 14 year old boy.

    The thing with Tony is I don't really see him being about this life forever. He'll dip from AEW before Vince dies.

  68. #8968
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    I was not aware of that Feinstein situation.

    Psycho has taken us to a dark place today.

  69. #8969
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    He's aight. I know you don't really watch Sammy's vlog but I think you'll like this.
    So, I try to keep up with Dynamite and Rampage but why is Cody wrestling as a luchador in the Impact Zone..? Is it Arn forcing him to work his way back up from the bottom?

    /I don't watch any vlogs or whatever you kids call it.
    Last edited by OD50; Today at 4:52 AM.

  70. #8970
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    So, I try to keep up with Dynamite and Rampage but why is Cody wrestling as a luchador in the Impact Zone..? Is it Arn forcing him to work his way back up from the bottom?

    /I don't watch any vlogs or whatever you kids call it.
    They were doing this thing on Sammy Guevara's vlog where Fuego Del Sol was Dustin Rhodes' son and then one day Cody just shows up in luchador gear and they censor his neck tattoo on the youtube show and call him Fuego 2 - Son of Fuego, saying this is Fuego Del Sol's son. It doesn't have anything to do with the Cody Rhodes storyline. Everyone will no sell him being Cody most likely.

  71. #8971
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    In case it wasn't clear, I don't actually think Tony is gonna wind up like Feinstein. But there is a part of me that wonders if he's really as great of a guy as everyone professes or if he has a cult-like psychological ownership over all of his employees like a modern-day Paul Heyman.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    So is Khan going to get a #metoo moment? Or am I thinking of someone else?

    Psycho, how can you have such incredible taste in rap music (Going to see my favorite rapper GZA) yet act like such a jabroni? I guess I should ask myself that same question........

    From now on I will no longer shit on you.
    Unlike some people here, I actually think you're chill. I might give you shit for opinions I think are weird and you'll do the same, but it's just message board shenanigans.

  72. #8972
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Psych shamefully walking back his assault on Kahn here.

    Honestly, I kinda feel the same. Like right now, he's building, he's given multiple people outlets, they're really still in the honeymoon phase.

    Right now, he's the first viable alternative to McMahon/WWE in a while. Read some reports that WWE internally thinks that AEW will have a WCW like spending/budget arc (who knows if that's true).



    I'm rooting for AEW. I like having alternatives, and I very much enjoy a lot of aspects of the show, so I'm hopeful they continue to grow and adapt.

    But in a lot of ways, the next few years are more interesting to me than the start-up phase.

  73. #8973
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    They're pretty much in the "Put up or shut up" phase right now. They've earned the goodwill, built up the foundation, established stars and brought in some heavy hitters. The next few years will show if they really do have long-term planning that's sustainable and whether they can adapt well on the fly when things change up. As positive as I am about the product, there are lingering things like Punk not really shaking the world right now and some people not carrying forward momentum from big moments, so there's enough doubt that it's exciting to see how it plays out.

    In general, I feel like they've had a strong enough great:shit ratio that I think they have proven they're here for at least another 5 years barring a drastic implosion or scandal. But if enough of the effort is hollow or poorly thought out, that'll show by the end of that 5 years.

  74. #8974
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    I might be making a mountain of a molehill (and that's usually my thing) but I was wondering about Danielson and Punk and how they're utilized. I'm wondering if there's actually a difference in their perceived value in the pecking order within the company. I just think it's interesting how Punk is mainly "working" the Friday show and working with younger talents, while Bryan is pushing for the top championship in the company. I guess part of it might be the working ability/learning curve as Punk was out of the game for years and Danielson was just out for a few months.

    Since there's a few days before the next show, just thought what other people thought.

  75. #8975
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Its interesting for sure. I do kind of agree. A build makes more sense for Punk. Daniel was fighting for a championship, just a few months before AEW. Him starting in the middle would have felt more off.

    I'm skeptical that CM Punk wrestling midcard is going to move the audience needle (it never did previously). Eventually people are going to want a pay-off, and I would guess you'll drive some engagement with the story.

  76. #8976
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    I think Bryan has more priority as sort of a current top draw. Punk I think is in a weird part-timer void where, like you said, he needs to shake off ring rust, and knowing his personality, he probably wanted to sort of ease into it instead of going whole hog into big programs and being the main spotlight. And while I can see the argument that it's a misuse of Punk and the momentum his signing brought, I think it's probably for the best considering the landscape in AEW right now. There's a handful of people that are on the cusp on breaking through to the top in AEW, and you throw in people like Bryan and Punk into the mix, it's a lot more crowded. Bryan can carry on wrestling, so as long as you advertise his matches and give some occasional mic time or face-to-face build, he doesn't have to facing FOR the title, but should be adjacent in the ultimate hierarchy of things. Punk can kind of live in his void until he feels comfortable moving on to bigger things or really sinking his teeth into a big program.

    That said, I think there's still a way of doing that without underutilizing Punk. He can still be the unspoken Rampage draw squaring up against the low-to-midcard, but I really think they'll get more mileage out of having segments setting up those matches other than, "Hey guys, happy to be here, catch me on Friday!" Makes the matches more intriguing, takes more advantage of Punk, and more chance to give some shine to whoever he's facing.


    There's also the part of me wondering if they're purposely milking the smiling Punk thing as long as they can until the crowd starts turning on him to flip that into a heel turn. I don't really think that's smart if that's what they're doing, but it crossed my mind.

  77. #8977
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BGMaverick View Post
    I might be making a mountain of a molehill (and that's usually my thing) but I was wondering about Danielson and Punk and how they're utilized. I'm wondering if there's actually a difference in their perceived value in the pecking order within the company. I just think it's interesting how Punk is mainly "working" the Friday show and working with younger talents, while Bryan is pushing for the top championship in the company. I guess part of it might be the working ability/learning curve as Punk was out of the game for years and Danielson was just out for a few months.

    Since there's a few days before the next show, just thought what other people thought.
    I think Punk is doing what he wants to do, which is (mostly) work with the younger talent and help build them up and show off what they can do.

    Bryan just wants to wrestle the already established wrestlers that are already considered good or the best, like Kenny.

    I could see them trading off eventually and we get the Daniel Garcia vs Bryan Danielson match I want. Maybe Punk turns heel and starts feuding with top baby faces.

  78. #8978
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    It is rather smart on their part to make Punk the draw to Rampage. I'll give them that. It really does seem apparent that this happy-go-lucky Punk is definitely planting some seeds for when he turns but it's just a matter of when that will happen. I'm sure there could be a retread story of Punk/Hardy if he turns and tussles with Page. It would be wild if that eventually became a feud for the gold but that would likely require a very lengthy reign for Page because I doubt Punk is all the sudden going to jump to the front, though his record is indicating he's headed that way.

    Another thing that I mentioned a while back that was alluded is we've got to see what comes of the Punk dust that he's sprinkled on the likes of Hobbs and Garcia. Allin was fine and was going to be fine before battling Punk but the other two are ones to monitor. The tricky thing is determining when those dividends are supposed to pay out.

  79. #8979
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    Both were good showings for his opponents for sure. Only issue is Hobbs will probably be sidelined for whatever Ricky's doing for a while, though I think Garcia could benefit from just consistently getting ring time on TV until they're ready to put him in a proper program.

    But that's why I definitely would like to see Punk get in even the most basic of angles with these dudes. If you're going to put them in there on Punk's time and not able to fit them somewhere else, why not make these more memorable before the bell rings?

  80. #8980
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I want to know what Rampage's ratings would be like if CM Punk wasn't used as the draw. I honestly don't think it would change. I honestly don't think that outside of the "AEW can do no wrong" crowd that people are not enjoying Punk's run right now like we should be.

    Don't get it twisted-I respect Punk for wanting to do whatever he wants to do in his own life. But as a fan I have every right to look at what he wants to do and go yeah, no thanks. I'm not excited for CM Punk at all in AEW I'm just not. I'm not saying I just want to see him fight for the World title and all the established WWE guys + Kenny Omega. But right now he is literally fighting the bottom of the barrel.

    Where the fuck did those other 4-500,000 fans go that tuned in to see him do a Disney remake of the pipebomb promo?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho666Soldier View Post
    Both were good showings for his opponents for sure. Only issue is Hobbs will probably be sidelined for whatever Ricky's doing for a while, though I think Garcia could benefit from just consistently getting ring time on TV until they're ready to put him in a proper program.

    But that's why I definitely would like to see Punk get in even the most basic of angles with these dudes. If you're going to put them in there on Punk's time and not able to fit them somewhere else, why not make these more memorable before the bell rings?
    Yeah, it's getting a 1-2 week build (at best) for these or next to nothing with Sydal. Like you said, you'd like to see more to make it worth the while so its kind of wonky how they're navigating it. That doesn't necessarily help when you're trying to help build them to amount to more via association.

  82. #8982
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    They were doing this thing on Sammy Guevara's vlog where Fuego Del Sol was Dustin Rhodes' son and then one day Cody just shows up in luchador gear and they censor his neck tattoo on the youtube show and call him Fuego 2 - Son of Fuego, saying this is Fuego Del Sol's son. It doesn't have anything to do with the Cody Rhodes storyline. Everyone will no sell him being Cody most likely.
    How odd.

    Thanks.

  83. #8983
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post

    Where the fuck did those other 4-500,000 fans go that tuned in to see him do a Disney remake of the pipebomb promo?
    I think some of them are still there. They're just not watching live.

    I give Kahn credit for making it a "see it live" moment.



    I do agree though. This is CM Punk. One of my favorite wrestlers. Its almost November. He should absolutely be in a compelling angle soon.

  84. #8984
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazer View Post
    I think some of them are still there. They're just not watching live.

    I give Kahn credit for making it a "see it live" moment.



    I do agree though. This is CM Punk. One of my favorite wrestlers. Its almost November. He should absolutely be in a compelling angle soon.
    Naw, if we're not giving Vince all the credit we're not giving any other promoter credit lol. CM Punk made that a "see it live" moment. It's too bad WWE stuck to their guns because if they had just sold out like CM Punk was going to, Raw/Smackdown would be thriving. He'd be in probably the biggest feud since Cena v. The Rock with Roman Reigns on Fox. Instead he's on TNT....Friday nights at 10pm/EST.....wrestling Ice Train and Evan Bourne......

    You know he had a compelling storyline with Darby Allin. I'm not negative that AEW pivoted from MJF feuding with Pillman Jr to Darby, but we could've seen Darby v. Punk transition to include MJF, possibly set up Darby turning on heel with him feuding with Sting. Punk goes full on with MJF tearing the mics up every week.

    It'll all be excused when he does wrestle another Darby or higher level talent as a slow burn. Like this guy was Jinder Mahal when he had his "slow burn" to WWE championship.

    Also-I do agree to an extent about how a lot of those viewers aren't going out of their way for the reasons we keep mentioning. It's just such a huge fucking drop. It's not like Wednesday nights are some awesome slot. Wednesday has and always will be the worst night for anything. That's why they put hockey on Wednesdays lol. Fuck hockey.

  85. #8985
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    Tony on Busted Open
    "For Eric Bischoff, of all people, the guy who got lowered down on a motorcycle from the ceiling, the guy who challenged Vince McMahon to fight him, to say that somebody should stay quiet is laughable.

    Eric is doing an act. I respect it, but let's be serious, Eric used to be a wrestling company executive and now he is a commentator and as a commentator, he's trying to stir up controversy, but I think it would be pretty naive of anybody to look at this and not examine that the person talking is Eric Bischoff, who is the most out-spoken wrestling executive of all-time and somebody who got a lot of heat, but somebody also who, look, if we're going to be honest, the things I'm trying to do in terms of balancing these great stars we have like CM Punk, Chris Jericho, and Bryan Danielson and people who come in with years of experience and they've got lots of time on television as big TV wrestling stars and then we have the people who have emerged hear and become TV wrestling stars in AEW like Kenny Omega and Hangman Page and the Young Bucks and we also have a whole crew of people who are the young stars and a lot of them are becoming young and established stars on TV too, whether it's MJF, Britt Baker, Sammy Guevara, Jungle Boy, and so many others, Darby Allin, in particular, just stars I'm committed to to keeping in AEW and not losing and building around.

    When Eric says 'focus on the wrestling,' I am focused on the wrestling and pushing these people and not running them out of the company like Chris Jericho couldn't get out of WCW fast enough and Eddie Guerrero was put in his place and the wrestlers were told by their boss that there is only three guys in the company, when Eric said that [Hulk] Hogan, [Randy] Savage, and [Roddy] Piper were the only three guys that had ever drawn money. Of course, a slap in the face to a few other people in the room, but what does that say to the morale of the young wrestlers who are busting their asses every week. It just doesn't make sense. I am happy and grateful to not go off like that every week and really only when there's a call for it and when there's competition brought to our doorstep and we have to respond. I'm just really grateful for the fans for their support and there's nothing to talk about now because we did what we had to do last weekend and now we can enjoy it and also look forward to great cards this weekend."
    Damn, shots fired.

  86. #8986
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    If Tony Kahn spends a lot of time on Eric, Eric has already won.

  87. #8987
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Eric Bischoff is the reason why guys like Chris Jericho and Eddie Guerrero and Chris Benoit and countless others that the WWE wanted ZERO to do with were even able to reach that level of greatness. Without the WCW platform, where were they going to get over? ECW? lol. Japan? I'm sure Vince would've had Jericho unify the WCW and WWF world titles after a JHW run in New Japan......

    Tony Khan, get some new material.

    Bischoff was a fucking goon but he lead a team that did some magical shit. When you guys watch AEW, that style, that's because of WCW. Shit, if you weren't smart, you'd think you were watching Nitro lol.

  88. #8988
    Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Double-edged sword really. Very true that WCW gave them their start and got their name out there but at the same time they had no idea/couldn’t be arsed to sustain them.

  89. #8989
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    WCW had some great moments and great runs. They also showed that its harder to sustain than create initial buzz.


    People get mad every time WWE cuts people. There's downside to backlog of talent as well.

  90. #8990
    Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Exactly. For example Jericho, if they actually got a proper Jericho/Goldberg match and made him a proper threat, chances are Jericho could’ve stayed but instead they made him a stepping stone without that proper match. Zero self-awareness how hot that would have been.

  91. #8991
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    Tony on Busted Open

    "For Eric Bischoff, of all people, the guy who got lowered down on a motorcycle from the ceiling, the guy who challenged Vince McMahon to fight him, to say that somebody should stay quiet is laughable.

    Eric is doing an act. I respect it, but let's be serious, Eric used to be a wrestling company executive and now he is a commentator and as a commentator, he's trying to stir up controversy, but I think it would be pretty naive of anybody to look at this and not examine that the person talking is Eric Bischoff, who is the most out-spoken wrestling executive of all-time and somebody who got a lot of heat, but somebody also who, look, if we're going to be honest, the things I'm trying to do in terms of balancing these great stars we have like CM Punk, Chris Jericho, and Bryan Danielson and people who come in with years of experience and they've got lots of time on television as big TV wrestling stars and then we have the people who have emerged hear and become TV wrestling stars in AEW like Kenny Omega and Hangman Page and the Young Bucks and we also have a whole crew of people who are the young stars and a lot of them are becoming young and established stars on TV too, whether it's MJF, Britt Baker, Sammy Guevara, Jungle Boy, and so many others, Darby Allin, in particular, just stars I'm committed to to keeping in AEW and not losing and building around.

    When Eric says 'focus on the wrestling,' I am focused on the wrestling and pushing these people and not running them out of the company like Chris Jericho couldn't get out of WCW fast enough and Eddie Guerrero was put in his place and the wrestlers were told by their boss that there is only three guys in the company, when Eric said that [Hulk] Hogan, [Randy] Savage, and [Roddy] Piper were the only three guys that had ever drawn money. Of course, a slap in the face to a few other people in the room, but what does that say to the morale of the young wrestlers who are busting their asses every week. It just doesn't make sense. I am happy and grateful to not go off like that every week and really only when there's a call for it and when there's competition brought to our doorstep and we have to respond. I'm just really grateful for the fans for their support and there's nothing to talk about now because we did what we had to do last weekend and now we can enjoy it and also look forward to great cards this weekend."

    Damn, shots fired.
    Sheesh, Tony needs to learn how to stay subdued because he really comes off as the loud kid in the room. I'd be excited too if I was in his shoes now that AEW is on the biggest wave wrestling has seen in years, but there's more benefit in not being bitter about ancient history. Eric knows more than Tony. Tony should listen. He can disagree, but he should still listen.

  92. #8992
    WHERE MY HOOKERS AT?! Bert's Avatar
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    How is he bitter for calling out what happened?

    Tony's the best.

    LFG!

  93. #8993
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    Double-edged sword really. Very true that WCW gave them their start and got their name out there but at the same time they had no idea/couldn’t be arsed to sustain them.
    It's clear that at the time when WCW was killing it, those wrestlers were not over enough or ready for those top spots. And when WCW did start putting more emphasis on the likes of Guerrero, Benoit, Booker T, Jericho, say mid-late 1998 into 1999, guess what started happening? WWF were just that much better. Bischoff was barely in charge the last 2+ years that company existed and when he was in charge---why would he put Chris Jericho in say 1997 with Sting? Benoit wasn't in a position to replace Ric Flair. And again, when they did start taking those spots it wasn't working.

    Which is probably why Vince never put everything behind these guys. Jericho, Benoit, Guerrero, up and down, up and down. Guerrero won the title then asked to lose it since the ratings were going down with him as World champion. It's easy to look back and say "Well, look at this shit!" But when they were ready in WCW, the show wasn't that great. Idk if I can blame Bischoff anymore than I can blame Vince for not wanting them in the first place.

  94. #8994
    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bert View Post
    How is he bitter for calling out what happened?

    Tony's the best.

    LFG!
    Ehh, he sounds pretty bitter to me.

  95. #8995
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Of course he's bitter. He thought he paid off Bischoff.

    I'm just sad that his comebacks were the same tired, played out "insults" directed toward Bischoff that don't even make sense. I hate when people use Chris Jericho as some example of "the one that got away!" The guy had no intention on staying WCW forever. He wanted to be in WWF since day one. They just never gave a shit about him. Russo was the only one who wanted him, bcuz he was doing Attitude style shit on Nitro.

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