Yeah I didn't like his program with Page. I like Cole. Don't get me wrong but that was meh. And then yeah injury makes him lose momentum. So lets see what happens when he comes back. So yeah I can agree at this point and time a bust.
Yeah I didn't like his program with Page. I like Cole. Don't get me wrong but that was meh. And then yeah injury makes him lose momentum. So lets see what happens when he comes back. So yeah I can agree at this point and time a bust.
He's teetering. He's young enough to hopefully be able to bounce back. AEW not doing monthly ppvs helps give title opps to people who might not be in line for a ppv build. Think MJF v. Ricky Starks. Cole could find himself in that position.
I would be okay with that while he is getting back in the groove.
Cole is massively over and he's coming back from a serious injury which can only add to that. He'll be more than fine.
Cole/MJF sounds like a painfully boring main event program
Well that was fun
Insert anyone's name there in the AEW bubble. Of course he'll be fine. The one thing you have to embrace a true AEW fan is that no matter, everything in AEW will be fine.Originally Posted by Defrost
i love the colored ropes. hope they stick with them.
probably won't happen, but mox fucking up ibushi next week at bloodsport would be excellent.
Hijo del Vikingo... off the chart talent, holy frickin cow.
They announced Vikingo vs Komander at the ROH PPV
5 busts...interesting question.
Miro and Andrade are the top two.
1. Miro
2. Andrade
I can't include Eddie, because I think he got higher than I ever thought he would have. Never believed in sustained run Eddie, and there's probably an argument that he went higher in AEW than he should have or could have in other places.
Jeff Hardy. Particularly given the way AEW fans shit on WWE on his exit, and their little bits when he came in. And it really is a tragedy for that guy. But it was built, and then demons took him out. I think he's in there
Athena. I really thought she could do something in the women's division when she came in. I know ROH, etc. But given the opportunity on the main roster, how she came in with Jade....I thought that was a missed opportunity.
I'm honestly wondering whether Saraya could be a bust eventually.
Wardlow too.
Two spicy takes for busts....only because of the highest level of expectations. CM Punk and Cody Rhodes.
I didn't even think of Hardy. That is a good one.
I was thinking Athena and on the fence. Seemed like they kind of did her like Ruby and just put over Jade but yeah at least there was a pivot to ROH where she got the belt.
The weird part is, Athena was the catalyst for my question but then I started seeing other people's suggestions and the list just kept growing in my head lol. Putting the women on this list is almost a disservice to them because let's face it, AEW's womens division is terrible. Good talent here and there no doubt, but the way it's presented is pretty bad. Even WWE's lowest point in the last 20 years is still better than AEW. They just fumble the women so easily. Look at Saraya, nothing about this storyline makes sense to me. Nobody was getting booed, the trolls on Twitter weren't AEW, WWE fans they were just douchebags that everyone deals with.
Jeff AND Matt Hardy were on my mind. But then I removed them because it's not like their current status is anything different than WWE or TNA/Impact. As it was said, the way a lot of AEW fans and even Matt played the whole WWE release thing like it was WWE being douchebags....and then we see what came of the relaxed AEW environment, which is a totally different conversation in itself.
CM Punk....Yes and no. A bust for the inactivity and injuries, but when he was there it was some of the best stuff in wrestling. Not just for today but imo of all time. It's a shame because right now AEW could have a fire storyline if Punk was still there imo. But he was almost a bust at the start wrestling all these fuckin jabronis.
Last edited by Nash Diesel; March 24th, 2023 at 10:23 AM.
I am with Nash on the yes and no for Punk for basically the same reasons.
As far as Cody goes. I mean I don't think I would say a bust but he wasn't on the level he wanted to be at I think.
It's all relative and individual takes, but here was where I was going back and forth for punk.
The return was, and always will be, memorable. And it was immediately "I'm here full-time. I'll be here until the wheels fall off, etc".
And the beginning was somewhere between good and fine, as the lower level matches stretched on. And then it picked up. MJF, etc. We go to championship. Good bits. But also an unfortunate injury.
And then, the end.
Pretty much every wrestling fan wanted CM Punk back. Wanted the moments, etc. And then there was realistic hope we could see it for an extended period.
At the end, he became "possibly more trouble than he's worth", came off to many (certainly not all) as just tiresome to even hear about, and had turned off a lot of the fanbase that clamored for him.
Maybe it's fair, maybe it isn't. But definitely at least an argument for high unfulfilled potential.
Hopefully guy can just chill out now, and watch a Rocky movie or two.
Certainly not a take I feel strongly about.
But there's an argument that he was going to be a pillar. He was a founder. Independent show organizer. And in many ways, he should have been embraced by the AEW community. And he was like one of two guys, with an audience that accepts basically any push, that they couldn't push right. They gave him his own reality show, made him one of the faces of the brand....and he ended up back at WWE.
And now he's absolutely over, and is one of the faces of the industry.
Sometimes, I love the wrestling industry.
The thing is with Punk unless you've been living under a rock, every negative was to be expected. He's always been difficult, he's always had a chip on his shoulder, and the fucked up part is he kind of earned the right. He's no different than Hogan, Austin, the guys who were a pain in the ass but were still the top draw. Personally I thought the whole brawl was corny it made me mad that I was kind of siding with the Elite camp because they had balls to actually step up to Punk when he called people out.
Punk in AEW, best for business, judging by guys like FTR and others who kind of went against the Jericho's saying naw, Punk was/is actually really cool and a benefit to the lockerroom. But again, you listen to people who have worked with Punk whether that's Rene Dupree, Booker T, Paul London, RVD, even Roman Reigns if we need to speak on a top relevant name, I'm not sure if Rollins rant on Punk was real or just working....So weird how Punk is why we had The Shield and by all accounts it sounds like they all 3 don't like him lol.
Rainn Wilson as Lex Luthor is weird.
As far as Cody goes....He was always a WWE guy in that circle. I don't think the club he befriended truly accepted him. Cody needed a Vince, a Triple H to guide him. Some wrestlers like Rob Van Dam thrive in a "go out and do whatever you want" environment, others need the controlled chaos approach.
IMHO Cody shouldn't have boxed his character in with the "I'll never challenge for the title" gimmick match. He did things that felt like he wanted people to know he wasn't going to be a Jeff Jarrett. He wasn't going to be a Hulk Hogan. These guys who take advantage of a mark i.e. Bischoff, Dixie Carter, Vince Russo. I can't say he's a bust in AEW because he's the reason we even have an AEW. He did what was needed of him. He flexed his status, he used his teachings under the WWE umbrella which includes Vince McMahon, Dusty Rhodes, the list goes on.
the first like, two years of cody was pretty great. i hated indie and new japan cody. by the end of his match with dustin at the first double or nothing, i was coming around. once dynamite debuted, he was a highlight during those first handful of months, especially his program with jericho and mjf and his first tnt title reign. people were very much in his corner and he really did feel almost like the 'heart' of the brand despite not letting himself get positioned as one of the top tier main eventers. his stuff with brodie was great and he had a lot of good will with the fans around the time of brodie's passing thanks to how he treated and was there for the family.
it wasn't until the nightmare family break-up and feud with qt marshall that opinions started to actively swing the other way with any kind of sustained momentum. the stuff with qt was whatever, but the ogogo feud was terrible and didn't even end with ogogo being put over or elevated, which made it even worse. the cody-verse bubble really became an issue during all this. the malakai debut and squash was great and felt like it was a return to form, but then he did the weird 'leave the boots in the ring' fake retirement thing that put people off. from the qt feud up until he left, there seemed to be a constant give and take when it came to cody, where he would do or be involved in cool shit that almost everyone was into and up for, followed up by some weird character moment or decision that would be two steps back.
stuff like the malakai squash and losing the big follow up match at grand slam people loved. him moonsaulting through burning tables and setting himself on fire for an episode of dynamite had people appreciating how nutty and dedicated he was. curing racism? doing a us vs uk angle for a smarky fanbase in 2021? unbelievable melodrama to try and force sympathy? not so much. he had some promos at the end of 2021 and beginning of 2022 during his feud with sammy and third tnt title reign that were nice and addressed the inconsistency with the fan reception, and he had that amazing ladder match with sammy to cap it all off. but then he left.
as someone who hated cody and eventually came around on him, i didn't want him to leave AEW. i just wanted more of what made him a compelling figure, naturally, instead of forcing things. oddly enough, he's been pretty flawless during his WWE return, though it's easy to snipe at him for some cody-isms, which i get more of a kick out of than find them egregious in any way. i think having to filter his ideas through different channels has helped to alleviate some of the bloat and cut down significantly on a bunch of the annoying character flares he found himself running into in AEW.
He went from filtering his ideas through Tony Khan, QT, and his wife to Vince, Triple H, Bruce Prichard, and I would even bet Seth Rollins.
If Cody stayed he needed to turn heel, win the World title from Hangman or Moxley. Have that heel run for however long and then he'd be able to turn back full blown babyface when it's all said and done. You wanted to boo the neck tat, his wife, the WWE-esque persona when it wasn't shitting on the WWE. The reality show. As dude said, curing racism lol.
He has a great story. Did he come across as someone who came across as a little naive post-WWE? Yes. He was a money mark himself. American Nightmare shirts in the Hot Topic will do that to you when your Stardust shirt never sold.
OK.
This was a fun line
I know this is a hardly a HOT TAKE, but it's been a fascinating journey.
I took my kids to Smackdown last Friday. None of them watch wrestling, but they enjoy going to live events with me. But when we were driving home, they were asking about Cody Rhodes. I start telling his story, they're all finding it interesting . it really is a compelling wrestling life story.
Headed to the show on Wednesday. Not the same type main even that Mazer got this last week but excited to see Omega live for the first time.
IDGAF who you are including my 21 year old son who is not a fan of Omega, he's someone I believe everyone should see live at least once. Generational talent?
I think you can argue that.
He was hurt last year when they came to town. I did get to see Sting who I had never seen live even though he didn't wrestle. I think Tanahishi was there as well to promote his match with Moxley.
Shibata vs Wheeler for the ROH Pure title at Super Card of Honor on Friday.
100 agree. All the most memorable guys, even if I'm not a big personal fan, I like to try to see live at least once.
Crossed off Sting last week too. Which is obviously not peak Sting. But still. Saw him in the ring live.
I was trying to think of wrestlers who I haven't seen that I had a realistic chance of seeing. Obviously seeing Kenta Kobashi was not very realistic. I've been going to shows since 1987 when I was 5-6 so I've seen many. But when I think about the modern era there are some names that stand out. I don't think I've ever seen The Usos live. Nakamura is someone who I should've seen by now. Even my son met him after an NXT show when Nak was champ.
That's why I want an AEW show to come closer. Minneapolis isn't a bad drive but there are still some wrestlers I didn't see at the ppv.
The NWO run in WWE may not have been particularly memorable, but it did give me the chance to see some all-time guys live that i wouldn't have seen otherwise. It was always bug me a bit that I never saw Hulk in the ring.
I don't think I ever saw Hulk wrestle. I saw him live at least once though. A Raw in St. Louis after he won the title but he didn't wrestle. The WWF house shows I went to as a kid were not in a big enough town for him to be on the card. However I did get to see Andre wrestle live at one of those house shows against Hillbilly Jim and saw a very excellent match between Hitman and Mr. Perfect.
I saw Hogan a couple times in the 80's and once or twice in the 90's. I know for a fact I saw him live on Nitro against The Giant after the first Souled Out. I will always regret missing the Bossman/Hogan cage match they aired on SNME that was taped here back in 1989.
I saw Hogan wrestle live, but as "Irish Terry Hogan", accompanied by Fred Blassie, against I think Jose Estrada or maybe it was Johnny Rodz in a squash match - winning with a bear hug, that heel Hogan held onto well after the ref stopped the bout, and they ended up ringing the bell three more times until Blassie finally okayed that Hogan stop. This was on a card that also featured Andre the Giant winning the main event battle royal of 19 jobbers that were all well less than 1/3 his size. Andre was "only" billed at "over 400 lbs then", but the others looked like school kids around a teacher next to Andre. A lot of us were joking that the midgets we saw earlier in the night - one who pantsed the ref - had returned for the battle royal, but Andre was that huge.
Andre was huge. By the time I saw him he was not in the best of shape. This was right before him and Haku started teaming up. They were both part of the Heenan family and Haku got involved in the match and so did Hacksaw because he was feuding with Haku over the "king" title.
I may be in for a long night tonight. ROH of tv show for tomorrow is being taped tonight on top of Rampage.
I wonder if I will be lucky enough to see Shibata tonight since he is challenging Yuta on Friday.
Hopefully because they gotta be paying him an extreme amount of $$$ to put over Yuta.
Speaking of the Yuta Experiment....Anyone listen to Mox on his wife's podcast? I only read the "news" about it. Two things that stood out that everyone seems to be talking about. #1-He was not under contract while he was champion in 2022 during the Punk/New Japan stuff. He jokingly said he could've walked into Summerslam after the main event with the AEW title. #2-He said that in all of the places he's worked-including WWE-he's never dealt with as much drama as he has in AEW. I think he meant as a whole, not just with talent but the behind the scenes, the fans, everything. Some thought he meant the Punk situation but further reviews show he was making somewhat of a general statement.
And you know when a guy who wrote a book where half the thing is shitting on WWE, it's gotta be pretty bad in AEW. Not shocked. For as bad as the WWF lockerroom was made out to be in the 90's, most people who were in WWF and WCW said WCW was much worse. Probably because you had Bischoff wanting to kick it and chill with the boys and be a mark, whereas Vince only gave a fuck about the bottomline. Bischoff didn't have to worry about that. Same with Tony. Same with Dixie. There's a theme with the money marks.
Moxley is probably the one guy that will keep tuned in to AEW even if I don't care what he's doing. I know eventually he will do something I like or I'll hear a great promo. He's kind of like Tommy Dreamer in ECW. One of those guys that might not always deliver but you would hate to see him go. I think if Mox left AEW I would have less interest in the product because he's a main reason why I've stuck it out in the first place.
I have not listened to it. Read some snippets on various sites. Yeah got to be bad in AEW for him to say that. Interesting about the contract situation. I hadn't heard that part.
I don't think any of us knew he was working without a contract. That just shows the faith he and Tony Khan have in each other. Mox was loyal and probably didn't even bother talking to the WWE about coming back.
Jungle Boy shouldn't need any kind of interference to beat Matt Hardy. But he held his own w/ MJF on the mic.
BCC has lost so much oomf, and Yuta being there just makes it so mid.
Omega is still annoying, awkward and weird.
Bryan Danielson is heel now?
ehh.
Brian Danielson has shown he can be equally good as a heel or face. His last heel run in WWE, he managed to overcome the love the crowd had for him, as he took the vegan gimmick to obnoxious levels, and called out the crowd fickle. I think he looks at this as a challenge.
lol fucking WHAT.Jungle Boy shouldn't need any kind of interference to beat Matt Hardy. But he held his own w/ MJF on the mic.
BCC has lost so much oomf, and Yuta being there just makes it so mid.
Omega is still annoying, awkward and weird.
this period of BCC just being fuckin menaces is great. and your take on kenny has always been so fucking dumb, i legit don't even know how to even respond to it.
oh noooooes, the guy who is a billion times more entertaining as a character when he's a heel turned heel!
You just did respond to it though.
you do know the difference between 'acknowledge' and 'respond,' yes?You just did respond to it though.
Heel BCC could be a real blast. I've been hoping for it and I'm ready.
from a character standpoint, these past few weeks from the BCC has been their best work, in my opinion. mox always kicks on all cylinders, but there's this vicious, unhinged streak right now, that is being matched by this vicious, calculating streak from claudio, that has the group FEELING truly menacing instead of just talking about how they like to fight and be violent. just mugging people and being dicks. it's been great.
Anybody else catch AEW All Access? They dragged Thunder Rosa in the mud to start things off and it really made Britt Baker come off as an entitled and bitter brat. All she's done is complain. I've never heard Thunder Rosa fire back or say woe is me.
Low class on Britt's end.
He never really stopped working heel even when they started BCC. He even continued to come out the "heel" tunnel. He just ended up being cheered. The man can go back and forth so easy just slightly changing the wording and stuff he uses in his promos.
That show was fucking great live and despite how long of a night it made the ROH taping was good as well. Got to see Vinkgo wrestle live and was not expecting that.
Only thing that sucked last night was the main event for Rampage. I hope they clean that shit up before tomorrow.
I wouldn't mind heel BCC if it made sense and wasn't forced. The live crowd felt very indifferent. Watching it on tv I honestly felt like they were piping in boos but @MTR you were there did it sound like the crowd was reacting accordingly? Like I can boo the shit out of Yuta no problem, the other 3....And for them to be all "YOU'RE WHAT'S WRONG WITH PRO WRESTLING!!" and I'm thinking.....That's odd all things considered lol. Why is that the main theme in AEW? You can always count on at least 2 feuds to be based around the other person being the wrong fit for the business.
What I will say is that despite me not having any real joy seeing Hangman or Yuta, I have no qualms about Omega/Bucks v. Mox/Dragon/Claudio. If we could just have those 6 and not all this other nonsense, see who the best of the best are....That would be dope. Turning your top babyface heel i.e. Mox is some ignorant I don't learn from history booking.
When Danielson first game out lots of cheers and YES! chants and even when he turned on Omega still a lot of cheers because honestly BCC is still getting a fair amount of cheers despite what they are doing. It was mixed when he turned on Omega though. But probably leaning still cheering. I need to watch the show tonight after work so I can see and hear the reactions from that side of things.
It's just an odd direction to take. I assume Tony didn't want Hangman and the others as heels, especially when Omega/Bucks have turned 3x now since the company started from babyface to heel to babyface again-at least it feels like The Elite are the babyfaces here right? Big Show must be on creative now.
I'm all about Kenny Omega v. Bryan Danielson. They had the draw, I don't think they've had a singles match since but I could be wrong. There's a story there that didn't need to go this route but whatever, stable wars are AEWS bread and butter.
Don Callis, legit fucked up last night after getting attacked lol. For fuck's sake AEW. I get it, they don't like anything the WWE does. How about you at the very least take into consideration the well being of your fellow man? Keep in mind, this is the same company who's talent and some fans went to die on the Jeff Hardy isn't a danger to the industry hill and look what happened? Shit look what happened to his brother prior to that?
When Lacey Evans forgets to tag Xia Li we laugh. Those are the botches we can handle.
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