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Thread: All Elite Wrestling

  1. #13001
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudz Mackenzie View Post
    Ask Shane Douglas at any wrestling convention from the 90's to present day and he'll bitch out Paul E. over the $40,000 Paul still owes him.
    I'm just fascinated with the idea of wrestling conventions in the 90's because they were few and far between. Today there's one every fuckin weekend. I remember going to this thing called Fox Family Fun Fair back in the 90's and meeting Sunny and the Bodydonnas when they were tag champs. Or when the wrestling hall of fame opened up I met Verne Gagne and Lou Thesz. But actual conventions had to be rare.

    I just can't see Paul E sitting there in 1996 getting shit on in a shoot about what Dave Meltzer said about Taz's match with Tommy Dreamer.

  2. #13002
    F this & JC that mth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    Iím also gonna jump in a time machine back to when you were Donald. You are forever and will always be Donald to me. Dave Wyndorf just isnít the same.
    Best of both worlds: maybe we rename him Donaldorf?

  3. #13003
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mth View Post
    Best of both worlds: maybe we rename him Donaldorf?
    I could go for Donaldorf!

  4. #13004
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    Will always be Donald.

  5. #13005
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    Daveald

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    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    Dave Wyndorf is a fucking icon.

  7. #13007
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    Random Darby Allin vs. Matt Hardy match?

    Wasn't Matt Hardy a babyface? Did he change in an ice machine again? Is he back to being Broken?

  8. #13008
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudz Mackenzie View Post
    Random Darby Allin vs. Matt Hardy match?

    Wasn't Matt Hardy a babyface? Did he change in an ice machine again? Is he back to being Broken?
    Yeah that was super random. Matt tweeted something last week about how he can't wait for us to see the new Jeff Hardy and I was thinking maybe that's Matt next transformation. He's going to be both Matt AND Jeff Hardy. Half his face painted, he'll have the towel hanging, he'll do both hand symbols.

    Let's be honest. Jeff Hardy has no business and no reason to come back. That Darby Allin match was the match he should go out on. Put over a future Jeff Hardy in a Jeff hardy type match. Chance after chance after chance. He's literally burned every promoter he's worked for. WWE, TNA, ROH, AEW. The AEW one was pretty rough. He walks out on a match with the WWE, Matt goes to bat for him, and then months later he winds up in jail..........oh but he's clean.

  9. #13009
    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    Plus the contract tampering that AEW would later accuse WWE of

  10. #13010
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    If AEW aren't ready, willing, or able to give Darby any kind of sustained singles push, maybe they could make him a semi-permanent tag-team partner with Matt Hardy?

    Keep Sting as a manager/mentor sort of role, but Matt Hardy is more willing to make TV dates and do TV matches than old-man Stinger. So, do that.

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    I'm sad we never got a Hardy Boys/FTR feud. Imagine babyface Hardy Boys vs. heel FTR in a proper clash of the two North Carolinian teams in AEW.

  12. #13012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudz Mackenzie View Post
    If AEW aren't ready, willing, or able to give Darby any kind of sustained singles push, maybe they could make him a semi-permanent tag-team partner with Matt Hardy?

    Keep Sting as a manager/mentor sort of role, but Matt Hardy is more willing to make TV dates and do TV matches than old-man Stinger. So, do that.
    Naw, Matt needs to go. Sting is in better condition than Matt is at this point. Darby needs to be on his own. The Sting partnership has never made sense beyond the facepaint and I just think it holds him back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spudz Mackenzie View Post
    I'm sad we never got a Hardy Boys/FTR feud. Imagine babyface Hardy Boys vs. heel FTR in a proper clash of the two North Carolinian teams in AEW.
    It would be good because FTR can carry 2 wet noodles to a good match and the Hardyz, despite literally being broken, can still give enough to where the match wouldn't totally suck.

    But again, The Hardyz need to bounce. Matt behind the scenes wouldn't be too bad but Jeff is just a walking disaster. The wrestling industry is his enabler. Not his family, friends, but the industry itself. If he wasn't in one of the big 3 (WWE, TNA, AEW) he'd be wrestling at random indie spots pilled the fuck out and drunk.

    Oh wait...

  13. #13013
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    The biggest thing Darby could do right now is turn on Sting.

    My own little booking would be to bring in Raven (in a wheelchair) to talk for him, talk about how he busted up his body for years and no one paid attention. How Sting is just using Darby to keep himself relevant, etc. Finally do the turn and put Darby with House of Black, who are rudderless without their leader.

    Buddy turns on HOB, leading to a singles match where Darby goes over, solidifying a new stable of Darby as the star, Raven as the manager, Brody as the muscle and Julia as the women's contender / maybe push a Darby/Julia relationship angle.

    Sting hangs out for awhile before eventually returning to put over Darby.

  14. #13014
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    You know what would be a great gimmick/angle is someone called "Stable Killer". It can be a top guy like Jon Moxley, a future signee that's badass ala Jacob Fatu or Hammerstone, someone that can rid AEW of all these fucking stables. Start out with the smaller ones and work your way up. They can make a big deal about the rise and fall of the Dork Order, see ya later Best Friends, night night Blackpool Combat Club. There are 13 stables in AEW. Narrow it down to 4 and cut your losses Khan.

  15. #13015
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    It's an easy way to get everyone on TV each week, maybe he's worried people will be pissed off if they aren' ton Dynamite everywherke

  16. #13016
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    It's an easy way to get everyone on TV each week, maybe he's worried people will be pissed off if they aren' ton Dynamite everywherke
    Everything you just said is why it's a problem and does nothing for the majority of the roster, the fans. Quality over quantity.

    They need to weed out talent. I would imagine by now Tony Khan has started to figure this out, that he needs to really focus on the roster and make it unbelievable. You want to talk about having more money than everyone and all this Eric Bischoff 1997 shit talk just remember one of Eric's double edged sword situations was a bloated roster. He had such a top heavy main event that the up and comers were not going to be there and when we did see them mix it up it was too late. Benoit, Guerrero, Jericho, Konnan, they weren't the draws that Hogan, Nash, Sting, Goldberg, etc. were at that time even in the end of WCW.

  17. #13017
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    Oh yes, Tony needs to trim the roaster at least in half. I think he probably doesn't want to lose anyone to HHH

  18. #13018
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    Oh yes, Tony needs to trim the roaster at least in half. I think he probably doesn't want to lose anyone to HHH
    I can see that. But I don't know if there's anyone that he would want that Tony would actually release. Maybe the other 2 guys from House of Black as it seemed he was pretty high on Buddy Murphy. Plus it would be super crazy to see him back with his real life gf Rhea Ripley and if they could turn that into an on-air angle considering the history he has with the Mysterios.

    I just think there are a lot of guys he just signed to have bodies and sadly never invested in. So he just throws them in a stable, and that's the end of it. We've talked about the maybe 1 or 2 guys out of how many that have benefited from being in a stable. Have a guy come in and just "Sting" these motherfuckers. Drop down and do some vicious move that takes them out. Mongo McMichael Tombstones?

  19. #13019
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    I'd think anyone who was in nxt would be on HHHs radar.

  20. #13020
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    I'd think anyone who was in nxt would be on HHHs radar.
    Maybe. Some of the guys that were in NXT that are in AEW were not used very well to begin with.

  21. #13021
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Blaze one in support of the American Dragon. ROH, WWE, soon to be AEW. IWGP title has to be next.

  22. #13022
    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    Saraya…. Holy
    fucking
    SHIIIIIIIIIIIT

  23. #13023
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Nice to see Paige/Saraya!

    And the Acclaimed have arrived!! About time they got the belts!

  24. #13024
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Jericho winning was hilarious. That was exactly the type of "World" title run Cesaro would get by the evil WWE. Fuckin Ocho lol.

    The tag title scene is all over the place or maybe Swerve/Lee was just extremely forgettable. The Acclaimed...I'll be honest I can't remember a single tag team match they've won but they're entertaining in a Disco Inferno/Alex Wright kind of way so good on them.

    Pac v. Orange Cassidy. I'm 50/50 on OC but I love watching PAC do his thing. The one glaring issue of last night's show-way too many fuckin botches. Holy fuckin shit it was like watching my friends and I back in 1999 after a few bowls and No Mercy lol. From the very first match with 2 top tier grapplers it was botch after botch after botch.

    4-way women's match. Shout out to Britt Baker for smearing her fuckin blood on Toni Storm's face. Saraya....I'll be honest it didn't register that it was page I was actually thinking it was SARITA from TNA so when she came out I was like ok this is wild but what's her status? Is she wrestling? I'll say this...and not because she's a woman, but that image of her, breaking down like a dying cyborg is burned in my brain forever.

    Not sure why they went with Moxley other than I think many online were predicting Danielson would win. I think Mox winning and Jericho winning were pretty terrible decisions and done solely as a swerve. What, Mox is going to drop the belt in a couple weeks again to MJF? Love Moxley, deserves better.

  25. #13025
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    Is Paige debuting Tony's ace up his sleeve?

  26. #13026
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    The number of short term title runs just blows my mind. There's no flow to a lot of these title changes. Good call on Acclaimed but whoever the champs were prior to Swerve is who they should have won the titles from. This hot potato shit is like me playing WWE 2K and creating a title match every week for the sake of having a new champ.

    If it's me and you have your full roster available here's what I would have:

    MJF as top champ, just because you know it's coming sooner than later, getting into a program with Danielson to get the title. You're right, Moxley deserves better. The rate this is going he'll pass Flair in a couple years or less.
    Wardlow as TNT champ seems about right, or Allin (without Sting)
    Bucks as tag champs (and as heels) - don't think anyone gives a fuck about the Gunn club and Acclaimed as faces defeating the Bucks would've been big but things happen
    Women's champ - Baker
    TBS champ - Jade, or just don't have the title at all
    ROH title - Claudio was perfect for this. Jericho doesn't need a championship. They really fucked that up.

    I'm not counting the Transylvania 6-5000 title they recently invented to have another title. Other than that did I miss any?

  27. #13027
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    It really feels like AEW dropped the ball completely with Wardlow.

    Oh and real quick, shout out to 2002 with Trina and Fabolous. Actually might be more like 1999 but who cares lol. Even my non-hip hop listening best friend remembered Trina (high school right? yep lol)

  28. #13028
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    I haven't watched yet but read what happened. Danielson should have won in my view. Could have added some more layers to him and Garcia and Jericho. Plus Danielson gets a win over everyone that has beat him since he came to AEW. Break glass in case of emergency was done already with Moxley earlier this year. Having him in the tournament is fine but let Danielson have a run with it and let Moxley take his vacation.

    We have seen MJF and Moxley before. Granted this will be better I admit and maybe that is why the went with Moxley to continue stuff with Danielson and Garcia and Jericho and what not.

    I was not a fan of the Acclaimed at first but I have become a fan over time and glad to see them win. I mean I still would love to see FTR with all the titles but probably not going to happen. I am sure they will drop the AAA or IWGP belts in the coming months.

    Saraya in AEW. I am for it as long as she can go.

    Not happy that Claudio dropped belt to Jericho. That was not needed. ROH needs their own shows and Claudio and Joe and Lethal are good people to carry that brand. Jericho is not needed and if they get their own programming soon he won't stay there long. He bring some star power but he is an AEW guy and that is where he will be.

    Some just quick thoughts.

  29. #13029
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    I didn’t expect Danielson to win at all. It’d have been nice but thought it was obvious they were setting up MJF/Moxley so wasn’t surprised in the slightest Moxley won.

    Agreed that Jericho shouldn’t have won the ROH belt though and they were too quick on getting it off of Claudio.

    Also agree that they have dropped the ball a bit on Wardlow. He was hot but his booking ever since MJF has been cold. Needs a good competitive feud stat rather than the squashes he’s been mainly getting.

  30. #13030
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    Yeah just seems like they are cruising along with Wardlow with nothing meaningful going on since winning the title

  31. #13031
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    Gotta say I'm surprised Jericho is still going at this point. Would have thought he'd put wrestling behind him and focus on his rock career by now.

  32. #13032
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    Anyone who says it was OBVIOUS Moxley was going to win (@Badger) totally full of shit lol. There was nothing that screamed "Obvious" What, because the Dynamite after the ppv they had a little segment?

    Also, is MJF's title shot date set in stone? I always thought it was like money in the bank only without the spontaneous pop up match.

  33. #13033
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    Gotta say I'm surprised Jericho is still going at this point. Would have thought he'd put wrestling behind him and focus on his rock career by now.
    1 "hit" song in 25 years...He knew his worth lol.

  34. #13034
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    1 "hit" song in 25 years...He knew his worth lol.
    I stopped listening to them after their 3rd album. I wouldn't know if they've had any hits.

  35. #13035
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    I stopped listening to them after their 3rd album. I wouldn't know if they've had any hits.
    Oh I just assumed that Judas song everyone sings was a hit. They even played a snippet of it on Cobra Kai's newest season lol.

  36. #13036
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    Jericho winning I did predict. Not a good call, in my opinion. The dude has been in too many big matches recently. Not that the ROH title is particularly meaningful, but still.

    Nice to see Saraya. Hope she can compete ok.

  37. #13037
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    Yeah I’d say Jericho lately needs to be putting more people over at his age rather than winning and getting belts. Although if this is a slow burn to Garcia turning proper face and getting a huge win over Jericho then can somewhat understand it. I still say that Eddie should’ve got the last laugh in their feud and won that barbed wire match.

  38. #13038
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    I mean it makes you wonder, if Punk didn't get stripped would Danielson have beat Jericho anytime soon?

    The problem with Jericho is that he's not and never will be at a position to be able to get people over by beating them like Hogan or Flair. Why? The way he's been booked the majority of his career. He didn't beat Austin/Rock because he was better in every way, it was to shock us all because he was the least favored to win out of the 4. His multiple times coming back to the WWE and putting every new guy and old guy over makes a lot of this stuff meaningless.

    So Jericho going over MJF, Danielson, Cesaro, etc. it does nothing for these guys. It will do nothing for David Garcia. Just like Garcia beating Danielson wasn't that big of a deal. Why? Because prior to Mania 37 or whatever Danielson was working with Gulak and losing to everyone under the sun as it is. These guys that they move in and out of the midcard and main event, there's a reason for it.

  39. #13039
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    Yeah he shouldn’t be beating David Garcia.

    Btw Nash were you jumping out of your chair when MJF merked Wheelsy.

  40. #13040
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    Yeah he shouldn’t be beating David Garcia.

    Btw Nash were you jumping out of your chair when MJF merked Wheelsy.
    Daniel David who gives a fuck the guy can't talk wrestles a boring style fuck him. lol

    I felt bad for Wheeler in that segment. The guy has to know he fuckin sucks.

  41. #13041
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Oh I just assumed that Judas song everyone sings was a hit. They even played a snippet of it on Cobra Kai's newest season lol.
    That was a good scene

  42. #13042
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazer View Post
    That was a good scene
    I mean it was 4 seconds of the song so I don't know if I would consider that a "scene" lol

  43. #13043
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    Daniel David who gives a fuck the guy can't talk wrestles a boring style fuck him. lol

    I felt bad for Wheeler in that segment. The guy has to know he fuckin sucks.
    As soon as they advertised Wheeler Yuta cutting a promo, you were the first person I thought of!

  44. #13044
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    nah. Coming in singing "judas", and then going into his place quickly conveyed what you needed to know about Stingray at that moment in life.

  45. #13045
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Stingray is a great character. Not the God-level fantastic ness that is Chozin but a great character.

  46. #13046
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Not a fan of Stingray because all I can think about is his character in Kingdom.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    As soon as they advertised Wheeler Yuta cutting a promo, you were the first person I thought of!
    When MJF came out I about threw my head into the tv like Jennifer Caulfield. I thought, they're going to try and give Yuta the rub working a small program with MJF before MJF moves on to beat one of his boys in the Cuckclub.

  47. #13047
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Stingray’s great comic relief and this scene:

    Daniel: “I refuse to fight children!”
    Stingray: “Hold my beer!”


  48. #13048
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Does MJF win the title before Full Gear on Nov 19th?

    Who is his first post-Moxley World title feud?

  49. #13049
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Think it should be at Full Gear.

    And Wardlow for the history. In a proper match this time.

  50. #13050
    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    Is Stingray vs Shark Boy possible?

  51. #13051
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    Think it should be at Full Gear.

    And Wardlow for the history. In a proper match this time.
    I agree about the ppv.

    Wardlow would be cool. He can come in, say he squashed MJF not too long ago so what does that say about the World title compared to the TNT title?

    See I'm hoping Wardlow and Joe start feuding soon and they unify the TNT with the ROH TV title. Wardlow with a big win, gets back on track from the absolute fumble of a job AEW has done with Wardlow since winning the TNT title.

  52. #13052
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    Is Stingray vs Shark Boy possible?
    God I want to see this now!

  53. #13053
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    AEW's been acting like it's 2002 so why not grab the #1 guy in TNA 2002 but Shark Boyyyyyyy

  54. #13054
    Not Elected to Read McBain's Avatar
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    The sooner they get ROH off AEW shows the better.

  55. #13055
    Her right to choose. Tyson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nash Diesel View Post
    It really feels like AEW dropped the ball completely with Wardlow.
    What happened there? I thought he was super over and ready for big moves after the MJF thing wrapped? Then they put him back into the midcard, albeit with a title?

    Jericho going over doesn’t make sense.

    Saraya/Paige isn’t actually going to wrestle, is she?

  56. #13056
    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    I'm thinking they put the title on Jericho because he's a big name and may help to get a ROH weekly TV show. 9 out of 10 people knows who Chris Jericho is. 0.1/10 people know who Claudio Canolli is.

  57. #13057
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyson View Post
    What happened there? I thought he was super over and ready for big moves after the MJF thing wrapped? Then they put him back into the midcard, albeit with a title?

    Jericho going over doesn’t make sense.

    Saraya/Paige isn’t actually going to wrestle, is she?
    Part of me appreciates that they put him with FTR and that Lethal/MCMG match was very very good. The other part of me realizes that it's kind of hard to go from MJF to something bigger or equal. TNT title was a smart move and again I have my personal fantasy booking ideas for what's next. I definitely wouldn't mind seeing a rematch with MJF as World champ defending against Wardlow, TNT champ or not. It could be at the ppv after Full Gear, keep both guys strong and MJF can tie it up. Down the road we get the rubber match.

    I don't think Saraya Paige is wrestling-I hope not at least. Can anyone honestly shake that image of her collapsing like a sand castle? I can't. She proved she can be a top tier non-wrestler. GM as Smackdown, manager of Kabuki Warriors. The last thing I want is for her to go out there with these irresponsible wrestlers and get fuckin dumped on her head because Ember Moon is daydreaming about Harry Potter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    I'm thinking they put the title on Jericho because he's a big name and may help to get a ROH weekly TV show. 9 out of 10 people knows who Chris Jericho is. 0.1/10 people know who Claudio Canolli is.
    Honestly that's a fair statement to make about Jericho's name value but on the flipside I still feel like this is more NWA than ECW working with WWF in the Attitude Era. It's still crazy to me that Tony didn't just change one of the YouTube shows into an ROH showcase. Air the old matches with the new stuff. Introduce the history while getting your newer guys exposure.

  58. #13058
    You didn't see me, right? HHHnFoley_Rulez's Avatar
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    Good fucking god, I thought Ricky crippled Hobbs. Think Excalibur did as well. Christ.

  59. #13059
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Great Muta was a surprise!

  60. #13060
    Champ is Gone
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    I love reading into things so what do you think it means when AEW's promotional partner NJPW ran an angle where David Finlay threw a chair into Will Ospreay's face?

  61. #13061
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Jade….this may or may not be considered a hot take. Great look and marketable no doubt but tbh I am more than bored with this run. She is still average as a worker IMO and has potential in that area but it’s about time for a change. This long run is not entirely hitting with me.

  62. #13062
    Champ is Gone
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    Even if they don't air it Jade should be working with Emi Sakura on every taping they have. She'll get good really fast.

  63. #13063
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    Dave Wyndorf is a fucking icon.
    So is Donald

  64. #13064
    Former Videoland Champion Badger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazer View Post
    So is Donald
    Dave Wyndorf = Rocky Maivia
    Donald = The Rock

  65. #13065
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Defrost View Post
    I love reading into things so what do you think it means when AEW's promotional partner NJPW ran an angle where David Finlay threw a chair into Will Ospreay's face?
    That's your a dumbfuck?



    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    Jade….this may or may not be considered a hot take. Great look and marketable no doubt but tbh I am more than bored with this run. She is still average as a worker IMO and has potential in that area but it’s about time for a change. This long run is not entirely hitting with me.
    Great look and marketable, so she has all you need to make money in this business and then some. The workrate doesn't matter. If workrate mattered NOAH would be the most watched promotion on the planet.

    Her problem is the lack of quality angles and AEW struggles outside of MJF, Moxley, and Jericho to make any angle compelling. The women are an afterthought. I'm curious who they are looking at as the one to give Jade her first L. Jade needs more than just telling people to cut the shit. If I'm Tony Khan I'd just say fuck it and have her beat Toni Storm for the women's title, vacate the TBS title and get a run as World champ. If you're going to book her like Goldberg don't hold back.

  66. #13066
    FBI Warning VHS's Avatar
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    Yeah, Jade’s had zero competition since winning the thing. But I disagree it’s time to get the belt off her.

  67. #13067
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    She already beat the best they have in Thunder Rosa. I can't remember if she's fought Toni Storm yet but I'm not a big fan of hers or Britt Baker so I'd rather just see Jade keep beating ass. What's the rush? There are 10+ titles showcased on AEW tv if you include the ROH titles. Until Jade has something more than "cut the shit Tony" just keep her draped in gold, unify the other women's title and retire. Pop up in WWE and get to that next level because that's where she belongs. It's criminal that she's not in the WWE with that machine behind her.

    People talk about WWE being outdated....AEW brought in Trina. TRINA. Remember when Cardi B was going to host Summerslam then got pregnant or whatever? Levels.

  68. #13068
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    I don't get the Paige thing. Her appeal, with AJ Lee, was that she wasn't the 'fake' diva of yesteryear with the plastic tits and facial surgery. She is now that. What's her deal then? The modern women's wrestler runs rings around her, she's an unlikeable promo, her look doesn't stand out. She's over because she WAS the pale goth looking girl with the next door qualities and could wrestle better than models, once fans realise that isn't what they're getting anymore, what's the point?

  69. #13069
    hey Matthew's Avatar
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    if she even competes. she was awful last night.

  70. #13070
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Paige and Shafir are going to the same promo classes.

    I'M THE PROBLEM!!!!

    I'M THE REVOLUTION!!

    Nothing like a little shade at Vince despite that motherfucker still employing her after all the shit attached to her including having a jobber nut on the title.....

  71. #13071
    Truth teller virms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    I don't get the Paige thing. Her appeal, with AJ Lee, was that she wasn't the 'fake' diva of yesteryear with the plastic tits and facial surgery. She is now that. What's her deal then? The modern women's wrestler runs rings around her, she's an unlikeable promo, her look doesn't stand out. She's over because she WAS the pale goth looking girl with the next door qualities and could wrestle better than models, once fans realise that isn't what they're getting anymore, what's the point?
    I'd dare say Paige is the best there ever was and will be in the facial department.

    But yeah, I don't get it either. She was just in the right place at the right time where she looked like she knew what she was doing vs models who barely knew how to wrestle. If she does come back to compete she isn't going to stand out over any of the other women of the roster. She doesnt have a great promo and she was average st best in the ring. Britt Baker is still the queen over there imo.

    I will give Saraya credit for not sticking her tongue out every 5 seconds last night vs her debut. Also, she made the right move going to aew. I think it will make her career last longer as there is no way in the world she would be able to hang with Lynch, Flair, Belair, ronda and a slew of others had she stayed in the wwe and gotten cleared to wrestle.

  72. #13072
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    You're start to realize that there's a reason why WWE scripted so much stuff. Some of these wrestlers THRIVE in that WWE environment. On their own, without people who give a shit about their product and their talent backstage, they flounder hard. Whether that's a promo, putting a match together.

  73. #13073
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I will give Paige her props though. She was a very very good wrestler, she stood out during that transitional period, and she was over. I was a fan of a lot of what she did, I was a fan of her in non-wrestling roles as GM of Smackdown and that short stint as Kabuki Warriors manager. That heel turn on Paige was incredible heat.

    Anyone who discredits Paige's WWE work needs their head checked-which I'm not saying anyone here is doing. I think we're all on the same page. A guy on IG last night said "Give her time, she's not used to doing this without worrying someone in the back is going to rip her to shreds" And I'm like a lot of these cats NEED someone to call them out when they suck. You will never EVER grow as an artist if you are constantly told everything you do is the shit. Look at Lizzo. If someone would just tell her she fuckin sucks, she'd stop making Katy Perry type music and go back to what brought her to the table.

  74. #13074
    Main Eventer chatty's Avatar
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    They should have someone beat Jade now, she's not drawing money by being unbeaten at this point and she's people are getting bored of her. I actually think she'd improve if she lost and then had more feuds where you don't know she is going to win, she's athletic enough but has no psychology to her matches because they are all too predictable. The midcard title doesn't do much for her at this point and would be better on someone else.

    Let her lose the title and then she can move to feuds for the main belt. She might not be fully ready in the ring but sometimes you just gotta throw them in the mix and let them swim.

    They want to I prove the women's division but have Jade in mid card matches on the b show and Jamie Hayter being a skivy still when both are ready to get int he mix and make the division interesting. I wouldn't mind them giving Penelope Ford a push tbh, think she is alright but never had much to work with.

    I'd also like to see them give ROH a proper roster that's separate from AEW and make it more of a place for people to learn ready to step up or veterans on the way down. Pretty much their version of old NXT in a way. All the belts being on AEW really waters everything down.

  75. #13075
    World Champion Donald's Avatar
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    Not gonna brag, but I could beat Jade.

  76. #13076
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chatty View Post
    They should have someone beat Jade now, she's not drawing money by being unbeaten at this point and she's people are getting bored of her. I actually think she'd improve if she lost and then had more feuds where you don't know she is going to win, she's athletic enough but has no psychology to her matches because they are all too predictable. The midcard title doesn't do much for her at this point and would be better on someone else.

    Let her lose the title and then she can move to feuds for the main belt. She might not be fully ready in the ring but sometimes you just gotta throw them in the mix and let them swim.

    They want to I prove the women's division but have Jade in mid card matches on the b show and Jamie Hayter being a skivy still when both are ready to get int he mix and make the division interesting. I wouldn't mind them giving Penelope Ford a push tbh, think she is alright but never had much to work with.

    I'd also like to see them give ROH a proper roster that's separate from AEW and make it more of a place for people to learn ready to step up or veterans on the way down. Pretty much their version of old NXT in a way. All the belts being on AEW really waters everything down.
    You make valid points, but I don't have any confidence in the way AEW books their women's division. Even if she "moves up the card", where would I have confidence she'd have a good story?

    At this point, I wouldn't remove the streak as AEW streaks mean less (she's not wrestling every week), but it at least it gives her some uniqueness in presentation.

  77. #13077
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    The points Paige/Saraya are all valid as well.

    I'm moderately optimistic though. She stood out more in her era....absolutely true.

    But I hope that she can get the ring rust off, and go back to being a decent worker.

    Completely agree that people are often too quick to discard everything about the WWE machine, because of some of (often very real) negatives. But Paige showed during non-wrestling stints, both as a character and as a commentator that she's intelligent and quick-witted. As well as genuinely likeable. And despite not being as unique, she still has a good look.

    I hope that she's got the tools to figure it out in the AEW world. And potentially be a little bit of a boost to the AEW women.

  78. #13078
    too big to fail Tainted Eclipse's Avatar
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    That Saraya segment was one of the worst things AEW has ever out on TV, up there with the worst Codyverse stuff. Felt like I was watching WWE

  79. #13079
    Pissed Off MTR's Avatar
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    I am fine with Jade wear she is at. I wish they would maybe do more with her though. At least there was some build up and a bit of a story going on with Athena before their match but that was a bit more Statlander before her injury.

    Jade is still growing as wrestler and needs some more matches against better opponents. Her match with Thunder was good in the tournament. I haven't seen the Athena match but I am going to guess it was good as well. She had good stuff with Ruby. But there is not point and her dropping the belt just yet unless you want to try to boost someone use for a bit but if she moves up and goes after Toni or a returning Thunder and doesn't win where does that leave her though. So honestly yeah just leave her with the TBS belt for now but maybe do better with the feuds.

    So I am big fan of Saraya but that segment was not good. I am hoping for better as she gets back in the groove of things. I am hoping she can go and not be worried about being hurt again. She is a good worker. She can also be a good asset as a non-worker if things go south that way again. Glad to see her in AEW because I think WWE let a good thing go when they didn't use her after Kabuchi warriors turned on her.

  80. #13080
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tainted Eclipse View Post
    That Saraya segment was one of the worst things AEW has ever out on TV, up there with the worst Codyverse stuff. Felt like I was watching WWE
    Which is weird because a lot of people on social media are attributing her shit promo to not having to worry about someone backstage like Vince or Triple H hovering over every word. IDK. Some people benefit from having that script. A lot of talent are put on tv, not just in wrestling but in general, because of how they look.

    Quote Originally Posted by MTR View Post
    I am fine with Jade wear she is at. I wish they would maybe do more with her though. At least there was some build up and a bit of a story going on with Athena before their match but that was a bit more Statlander before her injury.

    Jade is still growing as wrestler and needs some more matches against better opponents. Her match with Thunder was good in the tournament. I haven't seen the Athena match but I am going to guess it was good as well. She had good stuff with Ruby. But there is not point and her dropping the belt just yet unless you want to try to boost someone use for a bit but if she moves up and goes after Toni or a returning Thunder and doesn't win where does that leave her though. So honestly yeah just leave her with the TBS belt for now but maybe do better with the feuds.

    So I am big fan of Saraya but that segment was not good. I am hoping for better as she gets back in the groove of things. I am hoping she can go and not be worried about being hurt again. She is a good worker. She can also be a good asset as a non-worker if things go south that way again. Glad to see her in AEW because I think WWE let a good thing go when they didn't use her after Kabuchi warriors turned on her.
    Personally I would've fired her after those videos came out especially the one where Brad Maddox nutted all over the NXT women's championship. Which by the time that vid dropped there had been like 5 women since that held that title. And when you look at the roster, she was cool for the time but as time went on she wasn't a must-have. She seems more like a liability in every aspect both in her personal and professional life. Read up on her man now. He makes ADR look like a saint.

  81. #13081
    Pissed Off MTR's Avatar
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    So they should have fired Maddox and Woods as well right? Maddox may have been gone by that time not sure. Yeah no. Dumb mistake on her part and people that continue to bring that up online all the time don't help her mental health which took a dive after those videos came out. But you can't fire one and not fire them all for those videos. Then yeah that relationship with ADR was not good either. I have no idea who she is with now because I don't try to get too caught up in personal lives and I hadn't really heard much unlike all the crap with ADR.

    She was part of the start of change for the women and I think had she not had the injury she would have continued to play a big part. She has a a big following. When she came back with Rose and Deville big pops like her AEW debut(don't even go there about pops in AEW). People loved her as the Smackdown GM and her time as a manager. Maybe a liability as far as can she work and not get seriously hurt again but not a liability in she can still bring something to the table like she did in WWE when she got hurt again.

  82. #13082
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTR View Post
    So they should have fired Maddox and Woods as well right? Maddox may have been gone by that time not sure. Yeah no. Dumb mistake on her part and people that continue to bring that up online all the time don't help her mental health which took a dive after those videos came out. But you can't fire one and not fire them all for those videos. Then yeah that relationship with ADR was not good either. I have no idea who she is with now because I don't try to get too caught up in personal lives and I hadn't really heard much unlike all the crap with ADR.

    She was part of the start of change for the women and I think had she not had the injury she would have continued to play a big part. She has a a big following. When she came back with Rose and Deville big pops like her AEW debut(don't even go there about pops in AEW). People loved her as the Smackdown GM and her time as a manager. Maybe a liability as far as can she work and not get seriously hurt again but not a liability in she can still bring something to the table like she did in WWE when she got hurt again.
    Well, are we talking about all 3 of them in this conversation or are we talking about Paige? Why would you fire Woods? He didn't nut on the belt. I would've for sure fired Maddox but he was already gone lol. Can't fire someone who they already released for being a fuckin weirdo. Paige, chance after chance after chance. The "leaked" videos were one thing, my only issue was the whole having dude nut all over your belt. Shows how little she truly gives a fuck about women's wrestling.

    Everyone who is "new" to the AEW roster even if it's a one time thing get a pretty big pop. Paige has a following there's no doubt about it. But did you watch the latest episode of Dynamite? The crowd didn't really give a shit, and it was a Philly crowd. Fucking Bandido got a great response from the crowd. Literally anyone new gets a big pop initially. Again, not taking anything away from Paige, I'm a big fan I just don't think she's the end all be all as we've seen with Toni Storm, Ruby Riot, all getting big pops and now it's...well it's whatever.

  83. #13083
    Pissed Off MTR's Avatar
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    I couldn't remember if Maddox was gone or not but either way if you are getting rid of people get rid of them all. They are all in the videos and none of it looks good for the company honestly. you can't just fire her no matter what maddox did or not. Seriously lets just get rid of the woman but not the guys. Yeah no.

    I told you to not go there with the AEW pops. lol She still got a good reaction when she came out at Dynamite. I already said the segment was not good. Yeah it killed the crowd. I acknowledge that. I said I hope she gets back into the groove. She is really still a wait to see how it goes type situation especially after that bad segment.

  84. #13084
    OBJECTION Psycho666Soldier's Avatar
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    More wrestlers should be nutting on belts tbh

    I'm pretty sure many more than have been revealed already have

  85. #13085
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    I doubt there were many title belts from the 70's through the 90s that wouldn't have driven a drug-sniffing dog crazy nor been presentable under a CSI blacklight.

  86. #13086
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Imagine what the Big Gold looked like under a blacklight after Flair had it lol.

    Quote Originally Posted by MTR View Post
    I couldn't remember if Maddox was gone or not but either way if you are getting rid of people get rid of them all. They are all in the videos and none of it looks good for the company honestly. you can't just fire her no matter what maddox did or not. Seriously lets just get rid of the woman but not the guys. Yeah no.

    I told you to not go there with the AEW pops. lol She still got a good reaction when she came out at Dynamite. I already said the segment was not good. Yeah it killed the crowd. I acknowledge that. I said I hope she gets back into the groove. She is really still a wait to see how it goes type situation especially after that bad segment.
    It's not just about the videos, I specifically mentioned the one where dude nuts on the belt. Mickie James has been in a couple porn, Sunny is in the HOF, Chyna is in the HOF. Which one took the belt and jizzed all over it? Don't move the goalposts. If Woods jacked off all over the belt I'd throw his name in there too. Maddox was gone, Paige got to keep her job for many years.

    If she's so good why do we need to wait and see? She's been in the business for almost 15 years. The fuck are we waiting on??? For her to get used to being on TV? Being on the mic?

  87. #13087
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    Not gonna brag, but I could beat Jade.
    Calm down, Mark Hammer.

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    Does Chris Jericho deserve more credit for his contributions to the Attitude Era? I always think of the big 8: Austin, Rock, Taker, Foley, Vince, Triple H, Shawn, and Bret. Those are, imo, the key players that did so much.

    I do think there's an argument to include Jericho as one of the key players but I don't know if his contributions were enough to say without him, this era isn't as memorable. I think match quality wise he was a key player in making sure WRESTLING was still solid. I do think he along with Benoit, Angle, RVD, Guerrero, a few others were key in making this era strong to preserve the wrestling. Just like Nitro had the CW division, the midcard holding it down iwth the wrestling while Flair, nWo, Sting did their stuff.

  89. #13089
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    I'm not sure about Jericho and the Attitude era, but AEW would definitely not exist without Jericho in it.

  90. #13090
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    If you added another 2 it would probably be Kane and then Angle. Jericho was better but not as relevant as Kurt up to Wrestlemania 17 which is usually classed as the end of the era. Kurt had the world title and 4 PPV main events. Carry it forward to the brand split and he displaces Kane in the top 10.

  91. #13091
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    If you added another 2 it would probably be Kane and then Angle. Jericho was better but not as relevant as Kurt up to Wrestlemania 17 which is usually classed as the end of the era. Kurt had the world title and 4 PPV main events. Carry it forward to the brand split and he displaces Kane in the top 10.
    Jericho kind of comes into his own after the whole Invasion angle kicks off.

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    I recall Jericho being a highlight of Nitro in the late 90s. I feel like people were tuning in to see his antics, moreso than the nWo in '98-'99.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wyndorf View Post
    I recall Jericho being a highlight of Nitro in the late 90s. I feel like people were tuning in to see his antics, moreso than the nWo in '98-'99.
    I definitely think Jericho was becoming a "must see" up and comer around that time for sure. I wouldn't say more than nWo, but I would definitely put him in the conversation of wrestlers people were definitely high on.

  94. #13094
    Sometimes I disagree Mazer's Avatar
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    Jericho was seen as an up and comer for sure. But I think there was question if they were ever going to do much with him. Particularly given the perceived ceiling for all but a select few at the time.

    Jericho came to WWE and immediately became a bigger star. I think that he was probably underrated in showing people that WWE would push 'stars' who were "non-wwe" guys, after having previously at least somewhat mishandling guys like Dusty.

    Jericho, I think, belongs in the tier below Rock and Austin.

  95. #13095
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazer View Post
    Jericho was seen as an up and comer for sure. But I think there was question if they were ever going to do much with him. Particularly given the perceived ceiling for all but a select few at the time.

    Jericho came to WWE and immediately became a bigger star. I think that he was probably underrated in showing people that WWE would push 'stars' who were "non-wwe" guys, after having previously at least somewhat mishandling guys like Dusty.

    Jericho, I think, belongs in the tier below Rock and Austin.
    I think Jericho became a bigger star than he was in the WWE because there was room for him and plus they were winning the ratings war pretty nicely by the time Jericho jumped ship.

    Jericho going to WWE when he did was incredibly smart. In 1998-99 he was finding himself as more than just a great cruiserweight. The personality was forming and that's why Russo was so high on him. WCW had 10-15 guys still drawing very well and personally I think Jericho was still a little too green to the uppercard, even when he came over to WWE there's a reason he was only in the big matches for a hot minute before going to the midcard. He definitely improved the midcard because it was still a little questionable. Road Dogg as IC champ one day the next it's Manson-dust or whatever the fuck.

    Yeah I would definitely put him in the top 20 only because if I'm going to include Vince, I have to include Shane, Stephanie, and even Paul Bearer in the top 20. I don't think the non-wrestlers get enough credit during certain eras. We never really see Bobby Heenan and Miss Elizabeth in a top 20 list for the 80's unless it's a managers list.

  96. #13096
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    Seems to be a lot of backstage beefs on AEW. I assume WWE also has backstage beefs but how on earth are they kept quiet while AEW can't keep them quiet?

  97. #13097
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    that's where wwe's taking more control over their wrestler's media and availability approach comes in clutch. wwe peeps likely have outside interviews set up for them or approved before they occur, they of course had the ban on twitch streaming and personal channels, etc. the more 'open air' policy that is in place over in aew let's these kinds of things happen, as the roster is given more 'freedom' in general to do and say what they want. the fact that there hasn't been any significant or consistent punishment, outside of the punk/elite debacle, just means there's no real fear of consequences to make somebody about to say or do some dumb shit think twice.

  98. #13098
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Tony Khan spends just as much time on Twitter talking shit as his employees so it's not a shocker. Vince doesn't run his own Twitter, Triple H and Stephanie aren't out there talking shit. WWE have had moments where talent started shooting on each other (Bliss/Banks for example) but it's few and far between.

  99. #13099
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    I think Andrade is trying to get fired. Probably wants to be back in WWE with his wife.

  100. #13100
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    On one hand, I can't blame Andrade for wanting to be released from WWE when he did. He wasn't being used for a long time, Zelina Vega had been released, and of course AEW was looking promising I guess. On the other hand, you sign a contract I think it should be honored-unless you're not planning on using the guy at all. It doesn't seem like Andrade has been wrestling too often. Maybe it's more than just about matches or you'd think Khan would be willing to let him work outside AEW for the time being.

    What he's doing in AEW sucks. But in WWE they weren't using him. Would Triple H go the NXT route and just pair him back up with Vega? Wouldn't be a bad idea. Vince never really knew how to book him, just kept putting him and Rey together-I wasn't negative to those matches just felt like "lazy booking". Khan likes to compare himself to everyone well he's in the Bischoff role now. Too many talented wrestlers, not even enough time to properly showcase. Same issue WWE had and why they cut about 150 people in a year.

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