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Thread: UFC - Ultimate Fighting Championship

  1. #13501
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    Jones did so much, so young that he probably has the toughest career to assess. Like if he was 5 years older, we'd no doubt consider it a hugely successful career. But it feels like he's left a lot on the table because of how much he got done in his 20's. I guess COVID didn't help as you need a Jones HW title fight in front of a full crowd, but we're 18 months past that now. And Ngannou's contract expires at the end of the year supposedly. So, given the events just mentioned, it's a real possibility that the vacant heavyweight title will be decided in a fight between a guy who's been out 2 years and a guy who's been out 3. Then, turnarounds being turnarounds, the winner facing the stripped champion who'll be coming off a near 2 year absence himself. Heavyweight has been ridiculous for going on a decade, Stipe's first reign not withstanding:

    - Cain's streak of rematches (JDS 2, Bigfoot 2, JDS 3) followed by injury and an interim title for Werdum.

    - Werdum unifies, sits out for 11 months, Miocic knocks him out in a round.

    - Miocic has a normal reign, defending not overly regularly mind you but gets 3 in a row.

    - Cormier knocks him out. Defends on 3 weeks notice against Black Beast. Loses rematch to Miocic. Both shelved for a year (again, partly COVID) before completing trilogy.

    - Ngannou knocks out Miocic. For some reason (given it would be a super quick turnaround for heavyweight standards), they install an interim title 5 months after, which Gane wins.

    - Ngannou unifies, then declares he'll sit out until given a new contract.

    Crazy when you consider that time period encompasses the entirety of the history of the women's 135lb title - no champions stripped, no interim titles, and long breaks between fights only due to TUF and the champion winning and defending another title.

  2. #13502
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    Any thoughts on the card next week? Pretty fucking deep all being told.

    Do Bronx vs. Makhachev is, I think, the biggest combined UFC win streak matchup in history. Charles with 11, Islam with 10. 15 finishes out of 21 there too. Just a great fight. Charles is more tested at the top level but Islam has been running through fringe top 15 guys. Truth be told though his win streak is surely the lowest level long streak we've seen - hardly RDA, prime Barboza, Pettis etc is it. Hoping Charles wins but Islam does look imperious and likely pulls off the Khabib game plan to earn a sub in the championship rounds.

    Sterling vs. Dillashaw is the TJ legacy fight. Goes from great to an all time great with a win here. Would have to put him near that Aldo level to be honest. 13-2 in his last 15 at bantamweight, only losing by disputed split decisions, one avenged clearly. The Barao and Gardbrandt destructions have lost their luster due to the form of both men since, but that's largely due to TJ kicking their shit in. It's also massive for Sterling, who's reign has been underwhelming with how he won it and the tight (and somewhat dull) rematch with Yan. So he can really get rolling with a win here. I think Sterling does enough in the scrambles to win a tight one again, but I think it'll be a barnburner.

    Yan vs. O'Malley. MASSIVE risk/reward on this one. If Yan and Sterling win you pretty much freeze the contenders out while damaging one of your fast growing stars. O'Malley wins and you strap the rocket strip to him. Common sense, retrospectively, would have been to do Sugar vs. Aldo and Yan vs. Merab. Risk/reward for the former fight would have been far more favourable. I'm not their accountant though. I don't rate O'Malley that highly so think Yan puts a beating on him, but who knows? He has had time to improve. But Yan by stoppage for me.

    Gamrot vs. Dariush is a banger. Winner really should be getting a title shot. Particularly Beneil. Been one of my favourites for years, but inactivity has hurt him. Gamrot has been active and picked up some quality wins while looking great himself. It's a pick em but I think Gamrot will be the faster fighter and pulls away late for the points win. It'll be close though, Beneil is the harder hitter so likely has Gamrot in more trouble, but scores less.

    Fiorot vs. Chookagian I have no problem with. Chook is boring but is good. Fiorot has an exciting style but is untested. Winner will be on a 5 fight win streak and deserve a title shot, but one of these girls needs to beat Chook or Andrade to seem a threat to Valentina. I think Chook controls the distance and wins a split decision.

    Brady vs. Belal, winner goes top 5 you'd say. Usman, Covington, Chimaev, Burns then the winner of this one. Possibly above Burns even on merit. So logic says Edwards vs. Burns 3, Chimaev vs. Covington for the title shot, winner of this one against Burns for next one up. Fair I think. Negative is both are pretty dull and don't have the attributes to be a contender I don't think. But they have to be given a shot if they keep winning, look at guys like Jon Fitch. I think Belal takes it, more tested at the higher level, come through adversity a great deal, and likely better cardio in a high pace fight. Clear enough points win, taking the last 2 rounds.

    Krylov vs. Oezdemir another highlight. Volkan I find pretty underrated. Should beat Krylov, but it'll be a bit of a war.

  3. #13503
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I will say this...if O'Malley does the job to Yan it's not going to hurt him if you're a real fan and not one of those that bail as soon as someone loses. O'Malley loses to Yan it's a huge name that he lost to. It probably hurts Yan more if he loses.

  4. #13504
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    MMA is wild so you never know what could happen, O'Malley/Yan could end up like Aldo/McGregor or some insane shit like that. In reality though, O'Malley has only fought two good fighters in the UFC and he didn't look all that good against either of them. On paper Petr Yan is quite a bit better than both Chito Vera and Pedro Munhoz. Barring something crazy happening I could see Yan using his grappling to win this. A positive for O'Malley is that Yan is usually a slow starter, so maybe he could catch him with something wild before Yan gets going.

  5. #13505
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    Well, Yan did use his grappling to win the fight, but two judges disagreed. I don't think it was a robbery per se, as it wasn't like he won two rounds DECISIVELY, but I disagree with the result. Either way, I don't think you can give O'Malley a title shot off of it, but it definitely improved his stock a great deal as he fought well. For me you do Sterling vs. Cejudo next, with O'Malley vs. Chito Vera 2 for the next shot. I don't like Cejudo but that would be a fun one, and Sugar vs. Chito would be a super hyped rematch.

    Islam was impressive. Beat Oliviera everywhere and got the finish. It's kind of a shame they're diving straight into him and Volk rather than letting it marinate for a bit, but it's a great fight. It's just that Josh Emmett and Beneil Dariush have earned title shots and I'd do a double headliner with those fights THEN square them off if they both won.

    Belal looked great. Him and Burns makes sense next.

  6. #13506
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    Well, Yan did use his grappling to win the fight, but two judges disagreed. I don't think it was a robbery per se, as it wasn't like he won two rounds DECISIVELY, but I disagree with the result. Either way, I don't think you can give O'Malley a title shot off of it, but it definitely improved his stock a great deal as he fought well. For me you do Sterling vs. Cejudo next, with O'Malley vs. Chito Vera 2 for the next shot. I don't like Cejudo but that would be a fun one, and Sugar vs. Chito would be a super hyped rematch.

    Islam was impressive. Beat Oliviera everywhere and got the finish. It's kind of a shame they're diving straight into him and Volk rather than letting it marinate for a bit, but it's a great fight. It's just that Josh Emmett and Beneil Dariush have earned title shots and I'd do a double headliner with those fights THEN square them off if they both won.

    Belal looked great. Him and Burns makes sense next.
    When you see the stats I think O'Malley won based on damage and striking. Yan did ok with the grappling but O'Malley really wasn't in any danger. I'll say this, split decision was the right call. The first round was probably a toss up, the 2nd was Yan, and O'Malley won the 3rd. I guess it depends on how you view that first round.

    I definitely think if you beat Yan you deserve a title shot. He was the #1 contender. It wasn't a fluke, O'Malley wasn't outclassed.

    Islam looked great. Charles I think hit that Robbie Lawler phase of his career where he had the resurgence after being a 50/50 fighter for years, got some big wins against legit guys and now he's going to slide back down. I don't want to slight Islam too much here but looking at his record, he really hasn't beat anyone other than Charles who is very much a journeyman. Like, who the fuck is Thiago Moises? But he put together a big win streak ala Jon Fitch and sometimes you can't be denied.

    I want to see Islam against the names like Chandler, Poirier, Gaethje. Not sure how I feel about him v. Volk. Feels like Izzy v. Jan.

  7. #13507
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    So there's talk of Ngannou vs. Jones and Covington vs. Chimaev in Vegas in March, with the latter having more traction. Would be a monster card.

    Going forward, they should be able to get timelines to match up with most divisions to set things up for the second half of the year.

    Fig vs. Moreno, with Pantoja fighting Kara France or Askarov around the same time.

    Bantamweight nobody's booked - title is either Cejudo or O'Malley. If it's Cejudo, O'Malley vs. Vera for next shot. If it's O'Malley, Vera vs. Yan.

    Emmett vs. Allen If he wins Saturday for next shot. If Kattar wins, Josh vs. Yair.

    Islam vs. Volk with Dariush vs. either Charles or Dustin/Chandler winner for next shot.

    Usman vs. Edwards, Chimaev vs. Covington, easy booking. I guess unless Usman and Colby win but it'd still be big.

    Middleweight the only real question mark. Either Adesanya gets his rematch, or he defends against Strickland, Brunson or Hermansson, dependent on who looks best in their fights in December? He's pretty much lapped the division.

    Light heavyweight, winners from 282 match-up, easy.

    Blaydes vs. Gane to set up the title fight after Ngannou vs. Jones, unless Stipe would take on Gane which I doubt.

    Women's strawweight I'm sure Rodriguez gets next if she wins her main event next month. Timeline matches. Rose vs. Andrade 3 for next after that.

    Flyweight, any combination of Valentina, Grasso, Santos and Fiorot with the winners matching off.

    Bantamweight, Nunes vs. Viera, Aldana or Holm vs. Pena, match the winners.

  8. #13508
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Jon Jones is saying something about fighting Stipe in December at UFC 282. If that's true, I imagine we'll get an announcement sooner than later. I dig it. The winner has every bit of a claim to get a fight with Ngannou. The trilogy v. Stipe or v. the GOAT LHW sells itself. Either way Jones is doing a fuckin cannonball into the deep end and it's very dangerous.

  9. #13509
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Throwing in the towel. I know it wasn't MMA, but Anderson Silva losing to Jake Paul has completely killed any desire to watch MMA going forward. The tombstone reads 1993-2022. In that almost 30 year window and anything prior I will continue to watch and live in the past.

    Now I know what my friend Matt felt like when he said that he stopped watching WWE when they announced Orton v. Cena in an Iron Man match lol. I can only take so much. Pitiful.

  10. #13510
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    Well, from what I've seen Anderson looked pretty good for a 47-year old, I applaud him for that. But yeah, I do know the feeling, I nearly quit watching MMA after Gonzaga KO'd Cro Cop. I had this queasy feeling for days after that..

    That's why CC caving in Gonzaga's face with elbows is one of my favorite MMA moments ever..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmEh...annel=RayRoman
    Last edited by OD50; October 30th, 2022 at 7:06 AM.

  11. #13511
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    Well, from what I've seen Anderson looked pretty good for a 47-year old, I applaud him for that. But yeah, I do know the feeling, I nearly quit watching MMA after Gonzaga KO'd Cro Cop. I had this queasy feeling for days after that..

    That's why CC caving in Gonzaga's face with elbows is one of my favorite MMA moments ever..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmEh...annel=RayRoman
    It's one thing if a skilled MMA fighter loses to another skilled MMA fighter. It's something else when one of your idols takes a dive.

    Think about it. Every MMA fighter Paul has fought there was this "If you win I'll fight you in MMA" side bet and all 3 of them lost. Are they really getting a big paycheck for this? I could smell the corruption the moment the fight was signed.

  12. #13512
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    I don't think he took a dive, I think it was a 47 year old mixed martial artist against a young athlete who has been afforded the chance to get to a reasonable standard of boxing with time and money. I think Paul probably saw Anderson's last exhibition and thought it was time he could take him. Still wasn't emphatic. It's a shame it didn't happen last year where Anderson wasn't as old and Logan hadn't improved. This isn't a new thing in combat sports though, the young star catching a legend on the wane.

  13. #13513
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    I don't think he took a dive, I think it was a 47 year old mixed martial artist against a young athlete who has been afforded the chance to get to a reasonable standard of boxing with time and money. I think Paul probably saw Anderson's last exhibition and thought it was time he could take him. Still wasn't emphatic. It's a shame it didn't happen last year where Anderson wasn't as old and Logan hadn't improved. This isn't a new thing in combat sports though, the young star catching a legend on the wane.
    I hate to be so negative when I say this but save the excuses. This whole "justification" that Paul beat Anderson due to age is ridiculous. Boxing is just as much sports entertainment as WWE especially when you start having these goofball type of fights.

    Maybe if we could take this serious I'd believe that last part you mentioned but again, it's just bullshit excuses that don't add up.

  14. #13514
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    I only watched some highlights of the fight so I'm not really qualified to judge the "fixed or not" theories, but I would be surprised if that was the case. I guess we should remember that Andy is 47 and only has one lone win in his actual sport over the past 9 years. As great as he was, the clock struck midnight a long time ago for the Spider. From the little I saw of the fight Anderson actually looked pretty good for his age.

    Oh well, I guess it's on to Jake Paul/Nate Diaz next eh?

  15. #13515
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    I just can't handle the excuses. Askren wasn't a striker, Woodley wasn't a striker, Anderson is too old. When will it end? People couldn't use the "he's a grappler!" excuse despite T-Wood having dynamite for hands and please refrain from the "it's not MMA it's boxing" This kid isn't some savant that is taking to boxing like Kurt Angle did to pro wrestling. If people are going to say his level of boxing is good enough to beat these people so be it, I can't change that obscure opinion.

    Trust me, this kid will beat Nate Diaz and it'll be the same thing. It's not MMA, he's almost 40, he's stoned, the excuses will pile up when Nate gets knocked out.

    I believed the ending of Halloween Havoc 1995 more than I believe this dude legit beat any of these fighters.

  16. #13516
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    There just isn't any reason to think there's an incentive for a guy like Anderson Silva to purposefully lose to Jake Paul. Sure, there's money, but if ever it got leaked that he took a dive, or a contract supported him losing being more lucrative than winning, he would literally go to jail. I could understand if it was like Ken Shamrock or somebody, a guy on his arse, but Anderson's a millionaire. He just isn't equipped to beat Jake Paul at boxing at this point, as sad as that is.

  17. #13517
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    There just isn't any reason to think there's an incentive for a guy like Anderson Silva to purposefully lose to Jake Paul. Sure, there's money, but if ever it got leaked that he took a dive, or a contract supported him losing being more lucrative than winning, he would literally go to jail. I could understand if it was like Ken Shamrock or somebody, a guy on his arse, but Anderson's a millionaire. He just isn't equipped to beat Jake Paul at boxing at this point, as sad as that is.
    You would have to have it documented that he was supposed to take a dive. Heresy isn't going to put someone in jail. An under the counter agreement between two parties won't put anyone in jail....If Anderson Silva came out today and said "I took a dive" he would have to prove that there was an agreement whether that's providing audio or written/typed documentation.

    3 MMA fighters, 3 bets that if he lost he'd fight MMA, he won all 3.

    Money doesn't last forever. We don't know what kind of post-fight future Anderson has. His net worth is about 8 million, but Rocky 5 and MC Hammer taught us that doesn't mean shit if you make bad investments.

  18. #13518
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    Did Jake Paul really do any "If I lose we do MMA" bets with Askren or T-Wood? I honestly can't remember that. I do know that there was a "bet" (not sure how serious though) between him and Silva that if Andy won they'd rematch in kickboxing (not MMA) and if Paul won they would join forces to try and improve fighter pay, or something along those lines.

    -> https://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/...ckboxing-fight

  19. #13519
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    OK I didn't hear about the kickboxing part I only heard the part about MMA.

    I think Paul's "crusade" to improve fighter pay for MMA is odd when he's not even fighting MMA. It's like someone playing football saying he's trying to improve the pay baseball players get.

    How about this...How about you come to the UFC ala CM Punk and show us what you got? How about Bellator? How about OneFC? PFL?

    See, he won't go to the UFC, not because Dana won't allow it but because there's minimal shot at rigging a UFC fight. He's going to stay in boxing doing his freakshow fights. This kid was supposedly a decent high school wrestler I believe, or maybe that's Logan? Either way...Sick of hearing this fake crusade when you're not even participating in the fucking sport you're pretending to care about.

  20. #13520
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    I agree with that. It's wolf ticket stuff. Unspectacular boxing between a YouTube person and an MMA fighter. Why not just watch high level boxing or MMA? I understand 'heels' in sports, but why do people get invested in this kid? Logan seems quite bright and charismatic, but Jake is a dullard. It's content to guarantee annoyance. Surely there's better emotions to seek?

  21. #13521
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    Bob Sapp vs. Akebono is the most watched MMA fight in history with 54 million viewers, Kimbo vs. James Thompson is probably the most watched MMA fight in US history with 7.2 million viewers The casuals just have this bizarre fascination with shitshows.

  22. #13522
    What the fucks up Dennys! Nash Diesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    Bob Sapp vs. Akebono is the most watched MMA fight in history with 54 million viewers, Kimbo vs. James Thompson is probably the most watched MMA fight in US history with 7.2 million viewers The casuals just have this bizarre fascination with shitshows.
    Oh yeah I'm sure if you put Kim Kardashian v. Britney Spears on free tv in any kind of fight it's getting astronomical views. But least Akebono and Bob Sapp were legit fighters and not youtube guys calling out Fedor or Big Nog in a boxing match. Bob Sapp beat Ernesto Hoost in K-1, that guy earned my respect despite his blatant dives he's taken the last 10+years.

    The problem with Jake Paul is he's trying to pretend he's a legit fighter. He's talking about what MMA should be doing, specifically Dana White-while not even participating in MMA at any level.

    Don't get me wrong I loves me some freakshow fights. Giant Silva v. Heath Herring type shit.

  23. #13523
    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    sweden
    I'm honestly not too invested in Jake Paul one way or the other but some people are pointing out that fighting someone of Andy's skill and experience (47 or not) when you are just five fights in is pretty exceptional in boxing where up and comers usually fight complete cans for their first 10, 15, 20 fights padding their records.

  24. #13524
    GO ON LAD Fanny Batter's Avatar
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    Records are always relative in boxing too. There will be guys that are, say, 4-12, with most if not all losses to world title prospects, fighting guys that are 15-0 that haven't fought anybody with a winning record. Always great when a 'prospect' gets beaten by one of those 'cans', but in actuality it was an even fight and the records deceived going in.

    UFC 281 next weekend then. Massive card. 2 title fights, including Adesanya's most intriguing challenge, Frankie Edgar's retirement fight, and DUSTIN POIRIER VS. MICHAEL CHANDLER. And so completes the Diamond, Mike, Gaethje, Alvarez Round Robin of absolute fucking awesomeness. Dustin looking for the clean sweep, no contest with Alvarez in their first fight aside. Should be a banger. Deeper card than 280 too, prelims are pretty great. More importantly, the actual matchups are great. Hooker vs. Puelles, Riddle vs. Moicano and Reyes vs. Spann sounds like a good time in the Garden.

  25. #13525
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    sweden
    I have this feeling that Izzy/Pereira could end up being a quite dull affair, depending on how willing Pereira is to go through fire to make it his kind of fight. I've been checking out some of Pereira's training footage and noticed that his kicks are not very good at all and some, like his "spinning" back kick was honestly pretty bad and the technique was way off. His knees, and obviously his boxing from mid/close range is extremely good on the other hand. So, I'm thinking that Israel will try to keep this fight at best at his front kick/low kick range, and at worst at his jab range, when Pereira gets too close; clinch, push to the fence, disengage, rinse and repeat. Nothing is certain in MMA of course so it could end up being a Gastelum style banger. I doubt Izzy will be be willing to trade with Pereria like he did with Kelvin though.

    Chandler/Poirier can pretty much only end up being a war.

  26. #13526
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    Izzy absolutely won't be willing to trade with Alex, but I don't think that makes the fight less interesting. Like Bobby Knuckles, Alex can compete on the feet without having just the 'punchers chance'. But unlike Whittaker, Pereira hits like a truck and sits down on his punches. I've got Adesanya winning, but I do think he gets buzzed at some point and has to dig deep. Could be one of those that a draws on the table on the scorecards.

    I think Zhang dismantles Esparza insides two rounds. Carla will struggle to get the takedowns and just get physically overwhelmed. Good for her for grafting and earning the title back, but she caught Rose on an off night.

    I've actually got Chandler over Poirier. Psychological edge. I think DP is ready for his 'fun fights' stage and doesn't see another title shot in his future, so won't quite have that belief when it starts getting messy, and it will. It'll be a war, but Chandler pulls ahead and maybe gets the RNC on a tiring Diamond in the third.

    Hope Frankie goes out with a win, but it's got head kick KO written all over it. Gutierez has great leg kicks so I'm feeling after early success he fakes low, goes high and gets the highlight reel KO.

    Hooker vs. Puelles is an interesting style matchup. Puelles is a leglock master which is hard as he starts fighting the top guys. Hooker is on the wane but if he keeps it standing he should put a beating on him. Might be gunshy though after his last few. Slight lean for Hooker by decision.

    Got Moicano, Reyes, Blanchfield and Petroski in the main prelims. All good, well matched fights with high finisher ratios so should be a fun time.

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    I've got Izzy over Pereira via fairly ho hum decision, I also have Weili ravaging Carla Esparza. Chandler/Poirier is a tough one, on paper it will be complete chaos just like Chandler/Alvarez, Chandler/Gaethje and Poirier/Alvarez. Will definitely have to ponder that one a bit more..

    Would love to see Frankie go out on a win here but I honestly don't even know who the guy he's fighting is so hard to predict. Edgar's recent 1-4 run getting stopped violently three times doesn't bode well for the fairy tale ending though.

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    His opponent is no world beater and struggles with takedown defence so there's an avenue for Frankie to go out with a win, but he's there to be hit on the feet without diminishing durability.

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    I'm going against the grain because that's what I do and it probably won't pan out the way I want but I'm saying new champ and Carla retains. Deep down I'm sure the results will be the opposite. I think I'm one of the few people I talk to about MMA that thought Carla would beat Thug Rose and I'm definitely one of the few thinking she'll beat Zhang. Carla getting rinsed just doesn't happen and the last time it did was when she lost to Joanna many years ago. Not enough respect on her name because of her style. She completely shut down Thug Rose mentally and physically, who can say that? Zhang is going to come in thinking Rose wasn't active enough I'll be active....it'll backfire

    Chandler/Poirier is one of those fights I can't pick a winner. I like both too much and think either winning is a good thing. You have two guys have who have never fought Islam, 2 guys still in their prime to where Islam won't be looked at in shame.

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    Granted about Carla. There was also the Suarez mauling too though. She's tough and she's game but Zhang should be the stronger athlete and that makes it an uphill struggle. Hopefully at least be a good scrap, and somebody else gets a shot at it next - it's been 6 years since the title fight hasn't involved 2 of Joanna, Rose, Zhang, Carla and Andrade. This is the 16th strawweight title fight and only 4 had somebody different in them. Respect the dominance but jeez.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    Granted about Carla. There was also the Suarez mauling too though. She's tough and she's game but Zhang should be the stronger athlete and that makes it an uphill struggle. Hopefully at least be a good scrap, and somebody else gets a shot at it next - it's been 6 years since the title fight hasn't involved 2 of Joanna, Rose, Zhang, Carla and Andrade. This is the 16th strawweight title fight and only 4 had somebody different in them. Respect the dominance but jeez.
    Yeah I forgot about the Suarez fight. Damn I miss her, over 3 years now without a fight and she was imo on her way to be champ. Back to Carla.

    I think people were shocked she beat Yan. Yan was kind of pegged as the #2 Chinese female fighter and Carla shocked many of us. Carla's losses in the UFC are against the cream of the crop. Honestly when I'm looking at her record, the 2 losses outside the UFC were against Megumi Fuji who was considered the best female fighter in the world, and Jessica Aguilar who beat Fuji twice. If she does lose to Zhang I see no shame there. This doesn't happen here but on other sites I just get a little tired of how little respect Carla gets. She completely shut down one of the best in the division, maybe p4p female fighters. Carla's kind of like a Jon Fitch, sometimes it's just not very pretty but a win is a win.

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    I do respect Carla, she's gritty and seems like a lovely person. However, I see Weili's superior strength and athleticism nullifying Carla's wrestling and from there it will be a rough night at the office for the Cookie Monster. I watched some of Weili's training and she's an absolute tank.

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    Same. Her fight back to the title was an interesting one too. The Markos fight was a bit of a robbery, and the Gadelha fight was close. If she gets the nod in those bouts she's probably not getting battered by Suarez, and likely fights Rose at that point rather than Andrade. Had to take the long way round.

    That's a big what if in the women's landscape, Suarez. She was a beast. 2 weight champion good. Shame injuries derailed her.

    Really hope Frankie Edgar's goes out with a win tonight. One of my all time favourites. The more I think about it the more chance I give him - Marlon Vera is a beast and Frankie was well in that fight until the KO. Chris Gutierez isn't Marlon Vera. I think if Frankie gets a takedown he might stop him, should be a huge skill gap on the ground.
    Last edited by Fanny Batter; November 12th, 2022 at 6:02 AM.

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    I've been looking a bit at Chandler and Poirier and I'm starting to think that calf kicks from Poirier could be a very deciding factor in this fight just like it was against Conor. Chandler stands very low and heavy on his lead leg and has shown issues in the past dealing with low kicks. Of course, he could just as well blast Poirier with his atomic right hand when Poirier tries to kick him. The fact that Poirier is a southpaw and Chandler orthodox might make it more difficult for him to do damage with calf kicks though, both Poirier and Conor are southpaws so the calf kick is more available in that pairing. Chandler can most likely take Poirier down but can he control him down there? Poirier isn't a great wrestler but a very good grappler. Very interesting fight either way.

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    I like both guys, but if someone forced me to make a prediction I’d go DP via decision in a fight fairly similar to Cowboy Cerrone/Eddie Alvarez.

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    It's a tough one. Chandler has been hurt in his last 3 fights, and it's been a while since Poirier has taken much damage in fights, so maybe that's the edge. Going to be a great fight. Would like to see the winner fight Dariush - either a name EARNS a title shot with a win streak over top 5 guys, or Dariush builds his name off the back of a win. Timeline adds up, and it would be another banger.

  37. #13537
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    What a fucking sport eh! Nothing like a card like that, nothing. Ending on 8 consecutive stoppages! In big fights with ranked fighters and champions too. Some star making shit throughout too.

    Meatball Molly got absolutely steamrolled. It does feel like she's latched onto the Paddy bandwagon, there's something in him as a star (not necessarily a contender), but I don't see it in Molly. Blanchfield looked every bit a future champion. 125 is in good shape now after being piss weak for its first couple of years - Blanchfield, Cortez and O'Neill can all be brought along smartly now, against the Murphy's, Lee's and Chookagian's, while the title picture plays out.

    Dominick Reyes is toast. Vicious knockout. Ryan Spann is a bit of a glass cannon but he's fun to watch. Makes you wonder if Jones is toast though - his last 2 wins were life or death decisions against guys who can't buy a win at the minute. Maybe they've regressed, sure, but it doesn't look good for Jon's prospects against Ngannou or Stipe. For Spann, he can win and lose against anybody I think, that talented but with holes.

    Moicano is Money. Fucking class all round performance. Very much an underappreciated fighter, brings it on the feet and a bad motherfucker on the ground. Give me Moicano vs. Jalin Turner over five rounds please. Would be wild.

    Hooker vs. Puelles was a bit of a throwback to a PRIDE style fight! You can just imagine Puelles in a gi, picking up a yellow card for flopping around before getting soccer kicked and stomped out. Hooker wasn't great but didn't have to be, just careful. I don't see him as a top 15 guy anymore and if he defends his spot against a Moicano, Kutelaedze or McKinney, he won't have it for long. The fight to make though - Drew Dober. Banger.

    Poor Frankie Edgar. As DC said though, that's how the greats go out 90% of the time. For as long as he's been a fighter he's been troubled by straight, upward shots, be it uppercut, knees or kicks, and age has taken away the durability and reflexes. What a legend though. Will never forget the Maynard trilogy, the title win, the Mendes KO. All time great. As for Gutierez, bit of a statement for him and seems like a great dude. Bantamweight 11-20 is full of fun fights for him - Adrian Yanez would be a spectacular fight.

    Dustin Poirier! Michael Chandler! Delivered. Wasn't quite on the level of their fights with Gaethje, but wasn't far off and full of drama. The stand up ebb and flow in the first with both badly hurt, Chandler coming back to dominate the second on the ground and nearly finishing, then Poirier hitting the reversal and finishing it on the mat himself in the third. Superb. I know the championship level isn't quite there, but the Poirier, Gaethje, Alvarez, Chandler quartet has to be the 'Four Kings' of MMA right? Where every combination combines for a hugely memorable fight, like Hearns, Hagler, Duran and Leonard did. Can't think of another group like it. Any takers?

    Zhang went through Carla, but it wasn't without adversity. Carla had her moments in the grappling but Zhang was just so many streets ahead as an athlete that the speed and power trumped any technique edge Esparza may have had. Pretty fun fight though. Strawweight is kind of a mess with all the 2-0's around the place, I guess Lemos is next? Maybe rush it onto that January Brazil card?

    That main event was great. So tense. So tactical. The adjustments by Izzy to navigate the danger while winning the fight, marginally, on the feet, in the clinch and on the ground were masterful. But he had to be masterful for 25 minutes against Poatan. He wasn't, and that was all she wrote. I think the checked leg kick changed the game, fluid movement became backward, and Alex caught him in the straight line. Finish may have been slightly early but it was becoming uncomfortable with a man that dangerous swinging. The parallels to the kickboxing fight aren't lost on me too, if this was a movie series you'd tell them it was too ridiculous. The rematch is going to be major.

    So, next year's main events - first ever 1-1-1 quadrilogy with Figgy Smalls and Moreno, P4P fight with Makhachev vs. Volkanovski, Edwards vs. Usman 3, Pereira vs. Adesanya 2, Sterling vs. O'Malley, and whatever the heavyweight title fight is dominating the first half of the year, with a Chimaev title shot (if he beats Covington), the featherweight unification bout if Volk drops back down, lightweight champ against Poirier or Dariush, the McGregor return (think that will be International Fight Week in July against Masvidal) and another heavyweight title fight in the second half. It's going to get hype.

  38. #13538
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    First off, RIP to Anthony Rumble Johnson. Only 38 years old. I'm reading that he'd been dealing with health issues for some time, I kind of remember hearing him having some issues not too long ago. Just sad. The guy was every bit of what you'd want as a fighter and rep for the sport.

    Second...What an incredible fight card. DP/Chandler was great. I thought the main event delivered, the 115 title fight was what it was. It's just hard to pick a favorite moment. Probably the main event finish. Dude came from behind and put in the work. Within 8 fights he's a champion in a very tough division.

  39. #13539
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    So Conor has said he's re-entering the USADA pool in February... not at all suspicious.

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    Michael Chandler has called out Conor to a fight (presumably at 170) at international fight week which happens in July, so pretty much exactly six months from CMG re-entering the testing pool in that case. That's honestly a fight I wouldn't mind seeing.

    /Duh, Feb/July is more like five months, but I'm sure the UFC could get USADA to work with them on that, just like they did at UFC 200 with Brock.

  41. #13541
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    It just doesn't make sense delaying entering the pool, unless he's on the gear. Just seems to me who's used this time to bulk as much as he can, with as much help as he can get. I guess at least it means he won't be using while competing, but that's not really the point. To me, USADA should still be able to spot test if they believe a fighter is using out of competition - doesn't necessarily mean a ban would be in order, but the whole point of USADA is to stop steroid cycling. Guy is intimating that he's fighting soon, fucking test him.

  42. #13542
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    Well, all of this is suspect to say the least. According to UFC/USADA guidelines a fighter is only to be removed from the testing pool if they;
    a) retires
    b) are no longer employed by the UFC.

    I think a third point has been added recently saying something really vague, like "for other reasons..", not specifying at all what those "reasons" would be. I guess it could just as well be the "PPV draw clause", i.e Brock Lesnar/Conor McGregor.

    I think Conor is doing growth hormone (and probably some other stuff as well) to help his leg heal while at the same time pushing those heavy weights to add weight for a probable WW fight when he returns, and also bulking up to look the part for his role in Road House.

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    It won't matter anyway. Cocaine and whiskey won't improve that skillset. Gaethje and Chandler aren't bad matchups, and I'd certainly favour 2016 Conor, but I can't see him beating them. He absolutely comes nowhere close to beating anybody in the top 15 at 170 besides maybe Masvidal. Imagine him against Khamzat, come on.

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    Yes, Masvidal or maybe someone like Wonderboy could be exciting fights vs Conor at WW. Masvidal isn't the star he used to be, but him vs. Conor would still draw massive PPV buys I reckon and the trash talk would be through the roof. Conor/Khamzat would get really ugly, really fast.

    I do think the plan is to have Conor/Chandler at 170 during international fight week though.

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    I still think Masvidal is one of their top draws even if the numbers have slipped a little. I also disagree that McGregor couldn't beat anyone in the top 15 at 170. Yeah I mean if we look at a guy like Khamzat who can't even make 170 without killing himself sure. Then again we also saw Rumble Johnson look sweet at 170/185 and eventually he didn't look that sweet having to cut so much weight. And then guys smaller than McGregor were getting W's on him. IF the idea is to go after the 170 title, he could do it. His losses in the UFC are few and against top shelf talent. Especially Khabib and Poirier. 170 he hasn't really tested himself but if he can't make 155 he has no choice. Very interesting.

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    I just don't rate McGregor that highly. To me, it's like rating Renan Barao or Frankie Edgar. Certainly elite fighters, but with a window, with nothing in the last 6 years to show that hasn't passed. He was great, but he probably isn't now, and a guy like Sean Brady probably drains him in the clinch and stops him on the ground.

    I think the likeliest result is Nate fighting Jake Paul in February, building his brand, Conor gets involved and sets up the trilogy. Those guys can make a ruck of money fighting each other. If Nate beats Jake, particularly if they exploit the lack of December-February big fights in the UFC as usual, that's a 2 million buy for a low risk high reward for both of them - both make 20 million, UFC and their partners make more, clear path. Winner fights a fading Masvidal, then title shot if they beat him. Sounds about right.

    Goof fight card this weekend. Classic December 'fuck we have to pay these guys if we don't book them' fare. About 12 bangers on the thing.

  47. #13547
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    I just don't rate McGregor that highly. To me, it's like rating Renan Barao or Frankie Edgar. Certainly elite fighters, but with a window, with nothing in the last 6 years to show that hasn't passed. He was great, but he probably isn't now, and a guy like Sean Brady probably drains him in the clinch and stops him on the ground.

    I think the likeliest result is Nate fighting Jake Paul in February, building his brand, Conor gets involved and sets up the trilogy. Those guys can make a ruck of money fighting each other. If Nate beats Jake, particularly if they exploit the lack of December-February big fights in the UFC as usual, that's a 2 million buy for a low risk high reward for both of them - both make 20 million, UFC and their partners make more, clear path. Winner fights a fading Masvidal, then title shot if they beat him. Sounds about right.

    Goof fight card this weekend. Classic December 'fuck we have to pay these guys if we don't book them' fare. About 12 bangers on the thing.
    What if's are great, I'm sure a #27 ranked WW could maybe possibly take GSP. But when your only losses are to Khabib, Poirier, and Nate in the UFC, that's pretty hard to discredit. I can kind of see what you're saying about Renan and Edgar but show me the Luke Sanders of the world beating McGregor.

    I'm ready for Wonderboy to get a win. I don't see him getting a title shot anytime soon but I hope he makes his last few fights memorable.

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    Thinking of the #27 welterweight, would it be somebody like Muslim Salikhov? If so, I wouldn't be quick to pick Conor over them. Slight lean for Conor, but I'd have fancied Barao over Sanders. I don't think 155's easier either. Bobby Green? Moicano? Even a Marc Diakese? Hypothetical of course until he gets back in there, but a huge leg injury, a coke habit, alcoholism, fighting above your natural weight class, age and inactivity doesn't generally lead to success. His peaks shouldn't be underrated, but his falls shouldn't be overstated. I fancy a fall.

    The sand is falling on the Wonderboy clock but there's no reason why he can't earn a big fight with a good win. Masvidal is right there. Wins over him, Neal and Luque deserve respect. Hugely logical fight for Jorge if they don't go the Conor route, winnable and interesting. I favour it too. Holland is a guy I like to watch but if he isn't clocked in Wonderboy runs away with it and makes it look easy. Dude retired 3 months ago. It's a paycheck.

    Would like to see RDA get a win. In the 'fun fights' part of his career. If Masvidal doesn't fancy it, an RDA vs. Wonderboy 5 rounder, if both win, sounds fun to me. But he's in the McGregor sweepstakes if he wins no doubt. Conor could certainly beat a faded RDA, and he'd have beaten him prime for prime too. And I love RDA, but he's a step too slow and always has been for the elite.

  49. #13549
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    Thinking of the #27 welterweight, would it be somebody like Muslim Salikhov? If so, I wouldn't be quick to pick Conor over them. Slight lean for Conor, but I'd have fancied Barao over Sanders. I don't think 155's easier either. Bobby Green? Moicano? Even a Marc Diakese? Hypothetical of course until he gets back in there, but a huge leg injury, a coke habit, alcoholism, fighting above your natural weight class, age and inactivity doesn't generally lead to success. His peaks shouldn't be underrated, but his falls shouldn't be overstated. I fancy a fall.

    The sand is falling on the Wonderboy clock but there's no reason why he can't earn a big fight with a good win. Masvidal is right there. Wins over him, Neal and Luque deserve respect. Hugely logical fight for Jorge if they don't go the Conor route, winnable and interesting. I favour it too. Holland is a guy I like to watch but if he isn't clocked in Wonderboy runs away with it and makes it look easy. Dude retired 3 months ago. It's a paycheck.

    Would like to see RDA get a win. In the 'fun fights' part of his career. If Masvidal doesn't fancy it, an RDA vs. Wonderboy 5 rounder, if both win, sounds fun to me. But he's in the McGregor sweepstakes if he wins no doubt. Conor could certainly beat a faded RDA, and he'd have beaten him prime for prime too. And I love RDA, but he's a step too slow and always has been for the elite.
    McGregor's losses in the UFC are treated like he was beat by 2018 BJ Penn in a round lol. Being polarizing has a bigger price than people realize.

    I would like to see Masvidal v. RDA. We saw Masvidal do the redemption story, he didn't get the belt after 2 tries against a beast in Usman, lost the #1 cont fight to Colby. Won in the street. I think now it's time to give us some more money fights. He said it after beating Cerrone, he only wants the belt if it makes the most money and he's made more money than most of the champions in the history of the UFC. Let's see him v. RDA or another Wonderboy fight, how about Nick Diaz if Nick can make 170? Masvidal v. McGregor would be gigantic. I think the casuals and a lot of hardcore fans are missing the antics. Guys like Khamzat don't really do it for people. But imagine Masvidal and McGregor, better now than never.

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    He's only lost to great fighters, but those tangibles I mentioned put him more on the Barao and Penn trajectory than a Robbie Lawler. It's very difficult to reclaim past glory after the life he's lived the last 6 years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    He's only lost to great fighters, but those tangibles I mentioned put him more on the Barao and Penn trajectory than a Robbie Lawler. It's very difficult to reclaim past glory after the life he's lived the last 6 years.
    I agree to extent but until we see him in a situation like Barao or Penn getting rinsed by #240 ranked fighters or dudes at a bar sleeping him, I can't speak on it. He's only lost to great fighters.

    I'm not the big McGregor fan, I think the guy is a buffoon and I also think that's why so many fans these days try to write him off despite his resume. I get the time off, the life he's living, we've seen how that can affect people. I just don't know if I can agree that McGregor is anything but an elite fighter. The other issue is that he's such a big name you'll never see him fight some dude ranked #29 at 155/170. Unless it's a draw and rankings don't matter like if GSP came back tomorrow and they signed a fight obviously McGregor would be there.

    This dude will be retired before he gives us a chance to compare him to a Frankie Edgar, BJ Penn type. And I mean, in Edgar's defense look who he lost to. Aside from his last fight all those guys since Aldo were top 5 ranked fighters. Sad part is he just didn't look like a top 5 fighter himself lol

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    We'll see won't we. 2 guys that would make for a great test at 170 for him fought superbly last night, Wonderboy and RDA. The logical fights for both are either McGregor or each other. To me, I'd do a little Wonderboy, RDA, Masvidal, McGregor tournament - winner of that gets a big name into a winning streak, a top 5 ranking and thus a title shot. No brainer if you ask me. In fact, that would be the front runner for the UFC 300 main event. They are winnable fights for Conor if he returns to form, and he'd deserve a title shot if he beats 2 of those guys back to back. RDA and Wonderboy are definitely two 'deserve the paycheck' guys too, both class acts.

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    Overall a really really good fight night. The vets getting some much needed wins. That HW fight though holy shit. But no doubt, Wonderboy v. Holland=one of the best fights I've ever seen in my life. It was incredible.

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    How about that Sergei Pavlovich? Felt like I was watching Sergei Kharitonov of 15-20 years ago. Ironically Pavlovich's only loss is to the Reem who had some memorable fights with Kharitonov.

    Main event was crazy fun even though Holland's gameplan was questionable to say the least. Even at almost 40 Wonderboy will still beat up most WW's in a pure striking contest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    How about that Sergei Pavlovich? Felt like I was watching Sergei Kharitonov of 15-20 years ago. Ironically Pavlovich's only loss is to the Reem who had some memorable fights with Kharitonov.

    Main event was crazy fun even though Holland's gameplan was questionable to say the least. Even at almost 40 Wonderboy will still beat up most WW's in a pure striking contest.
    I said the same thing to my son that he reminded me a lot of Kharitonov especially the early years. I forgot he fought Overeem because I remember the fight wondering who the hell was this guy fighting Overeem? Some no name guy, 1st UFC fight he has to scrap with Overeem. Scary dude.

    I think Holland's gameplan if it included grappling would've made for a lackluster fight on his end and probably the same result if not worse. He broke his hand on Wonderboy's forehead in the first round and he couldn't get shit going for takedowns. He's not a wrestler and if you can't get the takedown your BJJ doesn't mean shit against a guy like Wonderboy. Zero submission losses.

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    Yeah, Wonderboy would have probably won either way, was mostly thinking that Holland actually ended up on top twice but decided to just stand up in the Bushido way. Respectable for sure, but maybe not the smartest against a superior striker. Would it have made any difference? Probably not, but who knows. Even Wonderboy went for some ground and pound when he ended up on top in round four or five.

    Watched Thompson on the MMA Hour and he said he wanted Conor McGregor, Jorge Masvidal or Michel Pereira next. He clearly has no interest in being held down for entire fights anymore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    Yeah, Wonderboy would have probably won either way, was mostly thinking that Holland actually ended up on top twice but decided to just stand up in the Bushido way. Respectable for sure, but maybe not the smartest against a superior striker. Would it have made any difference? Probably not, but who knows. Even Wonderboy went for some ground and pound when he ended up on top in round four or five.

    Watched Thompson on the MMA Hour and he said he wanted Conor McGregor, Jorge Masvidal or Michel Pereira next. He clearly has no interest in being held down for entire fights anymore.
    McGregor and Jon Jones are two fighters that just need to fight. I don't see Wonderboy getting the McGregor fight. Jorge rematch would be cool and Pereira is a young stud on a 5 fight winning streak so that would be a good fight in terms of climbing the rankings AND entertainment.

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    There's this thing with Wonderboy calling himself the "NMF champion" as opposed to Jorge being the BMF champion, "N" standing for "Nicest". I actually think he even has a NMF belt. For McGregor's return I want him to fight Chandler at WW, I think that could be great all around stuff.

    If anyone missed it, TJ Dillashaw just "retired". Personally I wouldn't be surprised if he just wants to get out of the USADA testing pool long enough so he can do some similar medication that Connor is doing to rehab his injuries. If you don't have the Connor/Brock special exemption privilege you have to retire or quit the UFC to be removed from USADA testing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    There's this thing with Wonderboy calling himself the "NMF champion" as opposed to Jorge being the BMF champion, "N" standing for "Nicest". I actually think he even has a NMF belt. For McGregor's return I want him to fight Chandler at WW, I think that could be great all around stuff.

    If anyone missed it, TJ Dillashaw just "retired". Personally I wouldn't be surprised if he just wants to get out of the USADA testing pool long enough so he can do some similar medication that Connor is doing to rehab his injuries. If you don't have the Connor/Brock special exemption privilege you have to retire or quit the UFC to be removed from USADA testing.
    If you bring a certain amount of money/status to the company they'll even move an entire event for you to get cleared (i.e. Jon Jones).

    I did think that same thing but then I thought maybe TJ's shoulder is fucked and the doctor's told him he needed to retire. But we know how retirement in MMA works it's just like pro wrestling. Only now they just go to bare knuckle.

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    Wouldn't shock me if TJ un-retires, signs with the PFL and tries to cash in that million dollar prize once his cycle, ahem, rehab is done..

    His shoulder is probably pretty damn fucked up at this point (3 surgeries?), but with shit like stem-cells, HGH and more gear he can probably get it in good enough shape to try and run through a PFL season.

  61. #13561
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    Uno vs. Penn 2 vibes with the main event! Draw in a vacant title fight. There was such little attempts to finish the fight by both men that Dana's being Dana and booking 2 different fighters for the vacant belt now . Jamahal Hill absolutely hasn't earned a title shot, but if he can stuff a takedown he'll be walking away with the belt next month. Happy Glover gets his chance at redemption though, what a career. Felt all 3 of the cards were realistic to be honest - round 1 was tough to score, and round 5 was borderline 10-8.

    Paddy lost for me, and anybody who has followed his career pre-UFC knows there's no championship trajectory there. But he's charismatic and entertaining. Honestly, with the depth of the division, they absolutely should not be rushing him to the top of it because he'll be ran through. Jim Miller, Clay Guida, Joe Lauzon - those three guys deserve the opportunity to win against a hyped fighter, but Paddy can beat all three due to the miles on the clock.

    Ponz kept scrapping and got his man out of there. Great come from behind win. Felt for Moreno, who fought superbly for short notice, but that's MMA.

    I don't know what Darren Till trains with Khamzat, but it isn't wrestling. Absolutely embarrassing ground game still. Giving up takedowns to gassed kickboxers now. Du Plessis likely gets exposed as he's not great. Very likeable guy though.

    Topuria is a beast. Potential champion there. Vicious. That top 10 at featherweight is full of monster fights for him.

    Prelims, all finishes. Rosas was excellent for 18. Rozenstruick blasted Daukaus from relevance. Edmen won a must win. Chris Curtis showed he's a top 15 scrapper.

    Good card.

  62. #13562
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    Absolutely awful news about Stephan Bonnar.

    His fight with Forrest gets batted around a lot as the most important fight in the sports' young history, and that's a lot,
    but really taking all things into account its probably not an exaggeration. They went balls out on tv when the sport needed it the most and props to them both.

    Dude was a warrior and seemed like a pretty cool mf'er all around.

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    RIP to Stephan Bonnar. Did the guy ever have a boring fight? The finale fight against Griffin was tremendous and did so much to elevate the sport in the eyes of the masses. A warrior no doubt about it.

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    I don't think there's ever been a bigger home run than that first TUF in the history of the sport, and it was obviously punctuated by that fight. Forrest became a big star, Bonnar went on to have a journeyman career, so even though the result was controversial it probably worked out for the best. Bonnar could never get over the hump and beat a top fighter, whereas Forrest probably had a more well rounded skillset and grew a lot more thanks to Xtreme Couture when they were at their peak. Gutting how he didn't get the help he needed towards the end, but not surprising. Dana White is an arsehole. Even Vince McMahon would have sorted Stephan out if he was in that position. Not saying he wouldn't have died, but you know, a guy that you proclaim helped build your company to what it is should probably have some stock options and an office job or something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    I don't think there's ever been a bigger home run than that first TUF in the history of the sport, and it was obviously punctuated by that fight. Forrest became a big star, Bonnar went on to have a journeyman career, so even though the result was controversial it probably worked out for the best. Bonnar could never get over the hump and beat a top fighter, whereas Forrest probably had a more well rounded skillset and grew a lot more thanks to Xtreme Couture when they were at their peak. Gutting how he didn't get the help he needed towards the end, but not surprising. Dana White is an arsehole. Even Vince McMahon would have sorted Stephan out if he was in that position. Not saying he wouldn't have died, but you know, a guy that you proclaim helped build your company to what it is should probably have some stock options and an office job or something.
    Vince McMahon wasn't some miracle worker. We don't know what kind of relationship Bonnar had with Dana White or the UFC or the company that owns the UFC, whoever you want to add to the list other than the person responsible for his own actions. Again, do we know if the UFC reached out to him, did Dana reach out? I wasn't there and to be honest, despite Bonnar being one of my personal favorites, the guy was a loose cannon fighting police and shit not that long ago.

    This isn't the time to go all Sean Strickland but that's the nature of the beast. Blame Dana White for something he had nothing to do with because why not.

    Maybe Bonnar didn't get the help he needed because he didn't want it or whatever help you assume he needed wasn't going to do anything anyway. It's sad when a fighter or athlete in general dies and the weird negatives come out from educated fans.

  66. #13566
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    I think considering how much we know about CTE, boxing and MMA promoters should be made to have some form of pension fund or post-fight care allowance for their fighters. Yes, the platform gives well minded athletes an opportunity to build a brand and set themselves for life, but brain injuries don't always make that so easy. But that's a Don King and Bob Arum thing too, making money off of brain trauma and then not making sure those guys are sustainable. Bonnar, for example, had a gofundme page for losing his house - surely if you're in Dana's shoes you write the cheque as soon as you find that out?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    I think considering how much we know about CTE, boxing and MMA promoters should be made to have some form of pension fund or post-fight care allowance for their fighters. Yes, the platform gives well minded athletes an opportunity to build a brand and set themselves for life, but brain injuries don't always make that so easy. But that's a Don King and Bob Arum thing too, making money off of brain trauma and then not making sure those guys are sustainable. Bonnar, for example, had a gofundme page for losing his house - surely if you're in Dana's shoes you write the cheque as soon as you find that out?
    Again, we don't know the kind of help he may or may not have received. I'm not going to speak on CTE when it comes to this situation because his death was heart related. Maybe CTE effects the heart as well, that'd be news to me.

    This was a guy who was a drug addict, abused alcohol, I don't know if MMA is to blame. I didn't see this guy fight until he was 30 years old.

    You sound like that lawyer who tried to get a ton of wrestlers a quick payday with that concussion lawsuit against Vince and the WWE. Look how that turned out. Again, did Dana and the UFC and whoever else step up and help him? I don't know. Did he accept their help when offered?

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    I guess none of us know, but there's enough out there to show that Dana's a bit of an arsehole and a lot of fighters are significantly underpaid given the revenue to pay scale comparison to other major sports being so astronomical. Also, you're smart enough to know the domino effect from injuries - taking Eddie Guerrero for an example - a heart attack wouldn't necessarily be relative to brain injuries suffered in wrestling, but the cognitive impact of concussive blows can lead down you a bad track in terms of medication, alcohol, abuse etc. It's not 1 + 1 = 2, stuff like this is complex and we'll never really know if a guy like Bonnar winds up dead at 45 without the sport, but we know enough about concussions and their impacts on health to gather that it's a factor, large or otherwise. That is, admittedly, relative to every job.

    Shavkat vs. Geoff Neal in a fortnight. Stupidly a three rounder underneath Imanov vs. the ghost of Kelvin Gastelum, but still a banger. You'd think they'll be pushing Shavkat to the top 5 if he finishes Neal, and likewise Neal gets a push if he ends the hype. Great fight.

  69. #13569
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    So, how about the Dana White situation? A superstitious man would say it's karma for him promoting that shitty "Power Slap League". Oh, the irony..

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    So, how about the Dana White situation? A superstitious man would say it's karma for him promoting that shitty "Power Slap League". Oh, the irony..
    The situation where him and his wife were drunk, she slapped and he slapped her back? It is what it is.

    I mean is power slap any shittier than arm wrestling? Or bodybuilding?

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    Yes, getting hit in the head and not being allowed to dodge/block seems pretty whack to me. I've actually seen clips of those slap competitions on Youtube and some of those slaps are honestly pretty damn gnarly.

    Not saying bodybuilding or arm wrestling are that great. Arm wrestling will probably fuck up your arm and shoulder pretty bad for life while body building will destroy your heart and liver among other things.

    Last edited by OD50; January 5th, 2023 at 3:27 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    Yes, getting hit in the head and not being allowed to dodge/block seems pretty whack to me. I've actually seen clips of those slap competitions on Youtube and some of those slaps are honestly pretty damn gnarly.

    Not saying bodybuilding or arm wrestling are that great. Arm wrestling will probably fuck up your arm and shoulder pretty bad for life while body building will destroy your heart and liver among other things.

    lol you said whack.

    Oh yeah man I've watched a lot of these videos. The ones where the poor guy barely hits his opponent and then gets a violent one in return is unnerving.

    This isn't even the worst, have you seen the videos where they bareknuckle each other like they do arm wrestling? Just punching the fuck out of each others face...Now THAT is fucked up.

  73. #13573
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    Yup, seen that and it's even more whack.



    I'm not going to say the first two guys deserves it, but the first two guys definitely deserves it..


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    Lol, Zuluzinho..

  75. #13575
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    So, Gane vs. Bones for the HW title and Ngannou released from the UFC, this sport is as wild as always.
    Last edited by OD50; January 15th, 2023 at 8:59 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    So, Gane vs. Bones for the HW title and Ngannou released from the UFC, this sport is as wild as always.
    The day this was announced I had been explaining to my son about the whole Couture/Lesnar/Mir/Big Nog mini HW tournament due to Couture dipping out. I told him even at one point Randy was going to fight Fedor I THINK in Affliction but I could be wrong.

    Ngannou v. Jones would've been huge and I hope we do get to see it one day. Gane v. Bones is a crazy fight too it's just that Gane doesn't have the name value.

    Jones at HW, the mystery is what is going to tell any fight he has going into that division. It could've been Blaydes, Stipe (who is claiming he gets the winner in June/July of this year, another guy who doesn't ever fight but can't figure out why bigger names make more money).

    I'm just glad it wasn't Sergei Pavlovich. Let's get Jon a win or two before we see that king of the monsters fight lol.

    See, I want to see Stipe v. Pavlovich with the winner fighting Gane/Jones winner. Stipe just sitting on his hands knowing the HW division is thin has always pissed me off. Dude hasn't fought in 2 years, hasn't won in 3 and is going to be gifted a title shot off a loss.

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    Here's my question.....Can a guy like Ngannou move the needle enough to justify not staying with the UFC? Dana said this guy was set to make more money than Lesnar so what kind of offers were others throwing at him??

    And does him not being with the UFC carry the same weight if he was to try his hand at boxing? I guess it depends right? I'm hearing Tyson Fury could be a possible opponent and we know that Fury is very very skilled. IDK. It's weird, I felt like I would feel SOMETHING but Ngannou barely fights so it's just like...oh well. Thanks for the memories. Didn't realize dude was 36 time flies.

  78. #13578
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    I actually really like the idea of Stipe/Pavlovich vs. Jones/Gane. If I know Stipe right he will shout from every rooftop about getting an immediate title fight and how unfair it is that Jones gets the shot in his HW debut. However, Stipe got absolutely wrecked by Francis last time out and also wont have fought for two years by the time Gane/Jones goes down, and by the time he would fight the Gane/Jones winner it would probably be two and half or even three years since he fought, meanwhile Pavlovich has built up his resume and destroyed three legit HW's all in the first round in 2022.

    Remember that GSP had to beat Josh Koscheck and Matt Hughes before getting the rematch with Matt Serra.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    I actually really like the idea of Stipe/Pavlovich vs. Jones/Gane. If I know Stipe right he will shout from every rooftop about getting an immediate title fight and how unfair it is that Jones gets the shot in his HW debut. However, Stipe got absolutely wrecked by Francis last time out and also wont have fought for two years by the time Gane/Jones goes down, and by the time he would fight the Gane/Jones winner it would probably be two and half or even three years since he fought, meanwhile Pavlovich has built up his resume and destroyed three legit HW's all in the first round in 2022.

    Remember that GSP had to beat Josh Koscheck and Matt Hughes before getting the rematch with Matt Serra.
    Stipe has the benefit of HW not being as deep as other divisions, but he also takes a spot from someone else by being able to sit around for 2-3 years and get an automatic title shot. It worked for him in the past but now it's ridiculous. You haven't fought in 2 years, you're not a draw, and while you have the most title defenses at HW (3) that shouldn't be a golden ticket.

  80. #13580
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    I guess a counter argument could be that Jon Jones will have been inactive for 3+ years when he fights Gane while also being 0-0 at HW.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    I guess a counter argument could be that Jon Jones will have been inactive for 3+ years when he fights Gane while also being 0-0 at HW.
    But he was also the sitting LHW champion, undefeated (fuck the Hamil fight lol). Stipe, not so much. Personally I would've rather seen Jones get a "warm up" but at HW there really aren't any safe fights lol. Still mindblowing Jones hasn't fought since Feb 2020. His prime years have been completely wasted.

    It's a shame that him and McGregor spent more time fucking around than fighting. At least McGregor has a real excuse, he was making millions doing nothing but making fun of Mayweather and tweeting. Jones....just a shame. Cain V might be another name you could throw in who despite having a legendary resume never got to cement that status.

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    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    We've seen champions like BJ Penn, Connor and now Volkanovski moving up to challenge for the next title despite not being the actual #1 contender, so yeah, I have no real issue with Jones getting the title shot in his HW debut. Stipe/Pavlovich would be a great title eliminator in the meantime. Stipe is getting up in age, hasn't fought for two years and looked like shit against Francis so it would be good to see where he's at in 2023.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    We've seen champions like BJ Penn, Connor and now Volkanovski moving up to challenge for the next title despite not being the actual #1 contender, so yeah, I have no real issue with Jones getting the title shot in his HW debut. Stipe/Pavlovich would be a great title eliminator in the meantime. Stipe is getting up in age, hasn't fought for two years and looked like shit against Francis so it would be good to see where he's at in 2023.
    Pavlovich has done a good job making us forget he lost to Overeem in his debut. I think that Stipe has realized his time in the cage was getting shorter when he first fought Cormier. He's played the game well but honestly I would rather see him v. Pav but we'll see.

    What's everyones thoughts on Ngannou now that we have heard his side of the story? I don't know what to believe. If Dana comes out and says yeah he asked for that stuff and we said no, I'll believe it. To me it seems like someone told Frances to go on Ariel's show and say that's why he turned down all that loot.

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    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    I have a feeling that Francis knew that there was no way in hell the UFC would meet his demands. I believe he demanded health insurance for all UFC fighters for him to re-sign, that's pretty much a guarantee there being 0% of any deal happening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    I have a feeling that Francis knew that there was no way in hell the UFC would meet his demands. I believe he demanded health insurance for all UFC fighters for him to re-sign, that's pretty much a guarantee there being 0% of any deal happening.
    Yeah everything he requested seemed like either he's a dumbass or he wanted to get out of the UFC. He's not getting any younger, he has never in his life made anywhere near the amount of money he's made in the UFC and his story is incredible. A lot of these cats think they're Conor McGregor because they won the title or they get a little fame, so they want to jump into boxing which is what it sounds like Ngannou is wanting to do. Nobody is going to realistically match the UFC's offer financially. I can't see PFL, Bareknuckle, Bellator, One, etc. offering 3-4 million a fight. Could a fight with Ngannou against Fury, Wilder, or Joshua be huge? Maybe. He might get a big payday but then what?

    Honestly, Ngannou really has nothing to prove in MMA and if it's not about the money he should retire. He's beat Overeem, Cain, Stipe, those are 3 of the best HW fighters of all time. I mean unless he wants to avenge that Derrick Lewis loss....Is there any realistic appeal for him in a non-UFC promotion? No. Bellator's HW division is whack, PFL has no depth, OneFC....meh. I like One but their HW division has always sucked balls that's why Brandon Vera was champ for like 8 years and defended it once. Kickboxing?

    And if he was asking for those 3 things, what other promotion in MMA offers that? It would be weird if he signed with Bellator and they didn't offer any of that stuff to their fighters. To my knowledge they don't as there is no union in MMA at all regardless of the promotion, there's no healthcare provided, nothing.

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    2 legends supposedly retired last night. Shogun and Glover. Shogun, easily top 10 of all top out of Pride, I'd throw him in the mix of top 10 LHW fighters of all time as well. Glover, another great LHW who captured gold when he had no business doing so.

    I was happy with Hill and Moreno winning. Shout out to the Brazilian crowd but you don't have shit on Mexico City. Burns with a huge win over Magny couldn't believe how easy he made it look. Walker with a good win.

    Someone check on Terence McKinney.

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    Multiversal Champion OD50's Avatar
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    Shogun was the last man standing from PRIDE in the UFC, so that's definitely the end of an era there. I guess Lil Nog was the second to last. Not very many are still competing from the PRIDE days, Fedor will have his (supposed) retirement fight against Ryan Bader on February 4 on CBS as well. Bader is probably slightly past his prime now, but it would still be a solid W for Fedor to go out on, especially after getting stopped in 35 seconds in the first fight.

    Other than that Shinya Aoki is still around fighting in ONE, Sergei Kharitonov and Aleks Emeliananko are fairly active in MMA, Overeem will probably have a couple of more kickboxing fights in GLORY, Anderson Silva will probably have a couple of more boxing bouts and Vitor Belfort will maybe box once or twice more.

    Gomi isn't officially retired I believe, but he hasn't fought since 2018. Robbie Lawler and Nick Diaz will probably have a few more fights before they're all done but I can't really call them PRIDE fighters since they both only fought once and also in the US under unified rules. PRIDE 32-33 were awesome (I watched both live) but not really proper PRIDE events.

    As for Francis, my personal choice would be him vs. Overeem 2 in GLORY at a soccer stadium in Holland. Kickboxing rules. The more likely scenario is probably Francis getting outpointed by Tyson Fury, either in boxing or those "hybrid" rules (4oz gloves/cage) Fury was calling for.

    /Shit, I completely forgot about Gegard Mousasi, who is still active and pretty relevant in Bellator. He just lost the MW title last June.
    Last edited by OD50; January 23rd, 2023 at 8:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OD50 View Post
    Shogun was the last man standing from PRIDE in the UFC, so that's definitely the end of an era there. I guess Lil Nog was the second to last. Not very many are still competing from the PRIDE days, Fedor will have his (supposed) retirement fight against Ryan Bader on February 4 on CBS as well. Bader is probably slightly past his prime now, but it would still be a solid W for Fedor to go out on, especially after getting stopped in 35 seconds in the first fight.

    Other than that Shinya Aoki is still around fighting in ONE, Sergei Kharitonov and Aleks Emeliananko are fairly active in MMA, Overeem will probably have a couple of more kickboxing fights in GLORY, Anderson Silva will probably have a couple of more boxing bouts and Vitor Belfort will maybe box once or twice more.

    Gomi isn't officially retired I believe, but he hasn't fought since 2018. Robbie Lawler and Nick Diaz will probably have a few more fights before they're all done but I can't really call them PRIDE fighters since they both only fought once and also in the US under unified rules. PRIDE 32-33 were awesome (I watched both live) but not really proper PRIDE events.

    As for Francis, my personal choice would be him vs. Overeem 2 in GLORY at a soccer stadium in Holland. Kickboxing rules. The more likely scenario is probably Francis getting outpointed by Tyson Fury, either in boxing or those "hybrid" rules (4oz gloves/cage) Fury was calling for.

    /Shit, I completely forgot about Gegard Mousasi, who is still active and pretty relevant in Bellator. He just lost the MW title last June.
    I definitely would say with Shogun retiring that is the official end of the Pride guys. Yeah there's still a couple names loosely associated with Pride but he became a pillar. Like I barely associate Gegard with Pride as he only fought there maybe twice I think. It's weird still associating fighters with Pride but it's like associating RVD with ECW. Even though RVD's spent more time outside of ECW, he's still mainly associated with them (depending on the fan).

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    So just caught up to the first episode of the Powerslap league thing. Well damn.

    It's fucking comical, and I assume that's lowkey what Dana's going for.

    I can't believe anyone thinks this thing is a long term prospect, if they honestly do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Percussion View Post
    So just caught up to the first episode of the Powerslap league thing. Well damn.

    It's fucking comical, and I assume that's lowkey what Dana's going for.

    I can't believe anyone thinks this thing is a long term prospect, if they honestly do.
    My boss and I have been watching this kind of stuff on Youtube for at least 2-3 years now. This and arm wrestling somehow leaked into the office more and more during the first 4-5 months of the pandemic.

    It's just one of those ridiculous sports that won't go anywhere in the mainstream. If this is the last post about slap fights in the UFC thread I'm down.

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    Interesting fight night this weekend. I say interesting because there is a very strong Korean presence on the card, really a very heavy Asian card and I thought ok it must be in one of the Asian countries, nope Vegas lol.

    How have I never heard of this Fire Fist fighter? Terrible UFC record it's like 1-6 and on a 4 fight losing streak but she has a badass name. Almost as cool as the Fireball Kid.

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