I'd just about rather watch Wigan/Boro than Fulham/Bolton. Both sides actually have watchable players but they're playing in dull systems. Lee played a 4-4-2 on Saturday and managed to make the side less watchable than in Allardyce's days.Originally Posted by El Capitano Gatisto
It's not a dogfight game it's a fucking shit game. Seriously, no one turns up for either team's games. The sooner they're both out of the Premier League the better.
Bolton were always entertaining under Big Sam, the whole thing about their bad football was a myth. They had skillful players who liked to get stuck in.
If you'd rather watch Wigan and Boro then you're a gigantic dickhead.
I had Mik giving an earful about Boro today as well. I don't like watching them but I'm pretty indifferent to them. Certainly prefer them to Fulham. Wigan are among the worst though, nothing interesting about them whatsoever.
What's wrong with Fulham? They have the best strike partnership in the Premiership: Brian McBride and Away in a Manger.
Excuse me, the Premier League.
Na bollocks, it was all long balls. Well-executed long balls, mainly by Campo, but long balls all the same. Either onto Davies' head or into the channels for Diouf or Anelka. Rubbish football. They were watchable in a Blackburn way for the fouling, that's about it.
How exactly is Fulham/Bolton any more exciting? Sanchez by his own admission is going out of his way to play the most boring but effective football possible, and Bolton are just a bit dull. Anelka and Diouf are capable of lighting games up but hardly on a regular basis. They're really going to struggle this season.
I don't understand your boner for McBride. He's alright but why the mad love. It strikes me as one of those ironic kind of loves people have for Pat Sharp and Timmy Mallett, except you believe it. Then again most people have an ironic love for Karl Kennedy but you seem to believe that one as well.
I don't get the Away in a Manger reference but I'm guessing you're on about Healy...what's the nickname about.
It wasn't all long balls you arsehole, they played 4-3-3 with plenty of width from the wingers and full-backs. A team that has had Youri Djorkaeff and Jay-Jay Okocha amongst its midfield has always relied on a fair helping of skill. Calling them a long ball team was nonsense. Martin O'Neill has played almost exactly the same sort of Bolton football at every club he has been to and doesn't get the same abuse. I really think your received opinions thread should be printed out, rolled up and shoved up your arse.
Chelsea and Liverpool played more long ball style football than Bolton but didn't get the same level of abuse either. Equally they both put as much into set-pieces and, in the case of Liverpool, long throws as Bolton did.
Last edited by El Capitano Gatisto; August 13th, 2007 at 6:25 PM.
Djorkaeff and Okocha weren't there last season, they were watchable when they were still playing. And O'Neill gets plenty of stick for it, maybe not as much as Big Sam but then again he's not had the same success since he's been here. Bolton were fighting it out near the top of the league for much of Allardyce's tenure and so they got compared to the top sides, and of course that was unfavourable for the most part when those sides play decent football. Even Liverpool and Chelsea might have played shit football generally but there was plenty of individual class to guarantee plenty of goals. O'Neill doesn't get the same stick because his sides in England haven't really done much damage. He might not get as much stick as Allardyce, but then he doesn't get as praise either. The higher up you go, the more you're likely to get of both. His time at Celtic doesn't count, no one cares about Scottish football.
I really am having a pop at Scotland recently, dunno why. They just keep coming to me.
I know they weren't there last season, but El-Hadji Diouf and Nicolas Anelka were, hardly Dean Holdsworth and Marcus Gayle is it? Bolton always look to flair players. There's nothing wrong with being strong and direct, but they played attacking football for the most part. Hence why they occasionally got duffed by Manchester United, because they remain relatively open.
Liverpool and Chelsea can afford to buy players with individual class, so they have even less excuse for playing the dull football they have inflicted on us all. At least Bolton went with out and out wingers. Only Arsenal and Manchester United in the Premiership can be said to play truly fluid, attacking football.
We try towe just don't have enough creativity in midfield (apart from Jenas). Our strikers make us one of the most watchable teams around though.
Some of our goals last season were crazy, I watched our end of season DVD and there was so many fantastic goals. Tainio's against West Ham might have been my favourite of them all, great build-up, sexy little backheel from Lennon and Teemu bangs it into the corner with a volley from the edge of the box, it was lovely.
"Away in a manger, no crib for a bed, the little Lord jesus laid down his sweet head, the stars in the bright sky looked down where HEALY HEALY HEALY!!!!"
Haha...surely the most obscure and contrived song ever created?!
If I hear Friday say that name one more time I might just fucking shoot him.
Boro would be royally fucked without Yakubu. Who else have they got who'll score any goals? I wouldn't expect any of Aliadiere, Tuncay or Mido to get into double figures, and their midfield doesn't look full of them. I want Southgate to do well, and Gibson is one of the less trigger happy chairmen, but I'll be surprised if he's in the job come this time next year.
Everton are building a really good side, and Yak would be another sound investment. Him and Johnson would run teams ragged. They would have the two young strikers as back-up, and the rest of the team looks strong too. I think they're more likely to break the top 4 monopoly than Spurs at the moment. Much better midfield.
Especially with Manny Fernandes seemingly coming in, I'm getting quite excited now. Not sure if we'll get Yakubu but I agree that him and AJ would be a very good strike force.
Only slightly upsetting thing is that apparently this new found cash of ours only appeared after Moyes tried to resign.
Everton's only problem at the moment is that there squad is still relatively small, particularly if they are going to be competing past the first round of the UEFA cup too. Looks like they are still trying to bring in two or three players so hopefully the get the right ones. I like what they are doing there
Tommorow's game should be very interesting
Everton have left it too late in the day to start adding to their squad. They're 5 or 6 bodies short.
An injury to any of Yobo, Lescott, Arteta or Johnson and they'd be fucked.
they are after chris brunt apparentley. I think with all the talk of jerome thomas to derby fro 3.5m a sly bid for brunt would make so much more business sense. this lad is going to be far superior to that cunt koumas ever was hence mowbray fucking him off before making a handful of bids for brunt
That will be fucking dreadful. Opening game of the season and Boro had less than 25,000 there, they are fucking shameful.
Is the Birmingham vs Sunderland game not on TV anywhere? Should be quite decent if last season was anything to go by.
Fuck off mate. The love for Karl Kennedy by virtually everyone is very real.
Brian McBride is wonderful.
He's a douchebag.
I think Brum/Sunderland is only on MOTD on Wednesday night.
You better be talking about McBride and not the FUCKING LEGEND that is Karl Kennedy.
Right lad's, I'm off to watch Cheltenham in the rain in front of 3,000 people. Ahhhhh proper football is back. I had enough of that Championship, full-house, malarky last year.
Beefy knows best.
Because you'd know all about 3,000 fans wouldn't you Melv?
I've been to two Brechin games where we took 1,000 fans...
Spurs
aadfsdfsdada
4TH PLACE
ahahahaa joke
It's OK, here comes Ricardo Rocha to save the day. ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;f
Boooo, the ball deflected off Gardner's massive face.
OH WAIT
sdfkdsnfks
asgsdhshsdfh
3-1. Nice going Spurs.
kjdhlfskjfsldf
For fucks sake. I'm not even going to bother now, It's like taking the piss out of a downs syndrome.
Cracking game.
BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
JOL OUT
35 million pounds worth of strikers out there lads.
Spurs are bollocks. Their defence is shitting itself every time a cross is on the cards because that fat cunt Robinson is all over the place (good effort at that deflected free kick too). He was in front of the near post when Arteta chipped that ball in, what the fuck for?
Berbatov doesn't look interested.
Lescott netted his header from 5 yards out. Robinson should have been out and punching that without a problem.
I've just checked the teams on the bbc website, Jenas is playing? How fucking shit is he, I didn't even realise.
Defending from Spurs is shocking.
It was a very good cross from Arteta for that goal, that's why I didn't say anything but otherwise he is a disaster waiting to happen from every wide delivery. There was no need for him to be so far across his goal for Everton's second which is why it was so easy to by-pass him and why Rocha had to come so deep to head it out. On Saturday too all Spurs' defenders were drawn in to the six yard box for a cross and that suggests a complete lack of confidence in the keeper because if the ball lands there it's his.
Ever notice the way when a goalkeeper has long hair or is foreign the commentators ALWAYS say "he's a bit dodgy at crosses" even if the keeper spends all game punching them out to the halfway line?
Oh my, oh my. OH MY...........
Not if your David James playing for Liverpool.
Everton are the most underrated team in the league. Been very impressed with them tonight. Another striker and a midfielder to replace Carsley (Fernandes?) and they'll be sorted. They also have two of the most underrated players in the league in Arteta and Osman.
Spurs, meanwhile, are just shite. No balance to the team at all.
Elgin 1-4 BrechinI've been to two Brechin games where we took 1,000 fans...
Att: 166.
blahgahaha
Credit to the fat lad, he made a couple of decent saves at the end there. Again in the second half though, no dominance of his area at all.
Agree with Oimoi on Arteta and Osman. I think Arteta is recognised by most as an excellent player but Osman is certainly under-rated. I said on here last year I think he should be given a go for England; in addition to his work rate and general enthusiasm I think he is technically a very good footballer.
Better than Lampard, at least.
Arteta and Cahill are two of the best midfielders in the league. Spurs have a shit midfield with Jenus and Lennon horribly overrated. Concidence?
4th place. MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Tottenham looked fucking knackered in that second half.
There's nothing wrong with Lee Carsley either. He's been playing good football at Premier League level for a number of seasons now.
How old is Carsley? He seems to have been around forever.
33 apparently. I actually thought he was younger, so maybe a new midfielder is a good idea. Lucho Gonzalez would have been a ridiculous signing but there appears to be nothing doing on that one.
Phil Nevilla is a very good midfielder, despite the joke player tag and I think both Man u and England ought to ask themselves what Owen Hargreaves has that P-Unit doesn't. Apart from a couple less years on his age.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Safe, just managed to find someone to go to the Arsenal/Sparta game two weeks tomorrow.That'll be two games in a week for me and more than I saw the last two seasons. Just hope we don't lose now, but even if we do there's always Spurs to laugh at.
You lucky bastard! :ma:Safe, just managed to find someone to go to the Arsenal/Sparta game two weeks tomorrow.
IN.E.R.F. anyway. Enjoy. Think of me in a pub where I can watch replays of our goals with a fresh pint froma lovely bar maid
We have broke Spurs for the season.
Worst start to the season for them since 1994. They should just thank themselves lucky they have Derby at home on Saturday. Their midfield creativity is woeful.
West Ham and Spurs occupy two of the relegation places. If only we could fast forward 9 months - there'd be street parties up and down the country.
We've got Lee Bradbury,
We've got Lee Bradbury!
Fucking hell, I love football. Pissing rain, 3,000 fans including 30 away fans, mistakes a-plenty, a shit ref, two pens, one missed in the 93rd minute, extra time and a Lee Bradbury hattrick. You can't beat this stuff.
You can. You can beta Man Utd again and knock them out a cup. That sorta stuff is fucking beautiful.
But well done
Blahahahahhahaha
3 months of hype about Spurs cracking the top 4 destroyed in 3 days.
It's just same old same old, awful start...will probably pick up soon and finish top 6.
Berbatov to be gone by the end of the month. He just didn't look arsed whatsoever for the whole game.
Well to be fair, they can still finish in the top 4. They'll just have to improve a lot. It's hardly like Arsenal haven't gone on utterly shit runs recently.
Silly arguement. Boro can still finish top 4, they'll just have to improve alot. The Spurs midfield is not anywhere near top 4 standard and the defending was diabolical tonight. It really doesn't scream out top 4 finish.
There is no way Spurs can be consistent enough to finish top 4 if they are going to have days when they defend like that and have no creativity in midfield. Keane is their most creative plaayer and often has to drop into midfield to make things happen.
£18m that they spent on Bent could've gotten them Baines to tighten up their defence, another centre back and probably at least one creative midfielder, which would make them a much, much better team. Bent was the definition of average on his home debut too.
If Spurs had won the first 2 games, nobody would be questioning their midfield so much. As much as I dislike him, Ledley King coming back will make a lot of difference.
Blahahahahhahaha
3 months of hype about Spurs cracking the top 4 destroyed in 3 days.
The perfect post
I'm not saying they're shit, I'm saying they haven't got enough quality or creativity to crack the top 4. Ledley King is a quality player and will tighten up the defence to a certain extent, but as long as fat Robbo continues to look shaky the whole back line will be shaky and nervous. Bale seems an good player, but does not have enough experience or quality in all likelihood to be the solution to Spurs' left back problem.
Spurs' midfield certainly isn't shite, but there simply isn't enough creativity there to provide for what is probably one of the the best striking selections in the Premiership. Jenas, Malbranque, Lennon, Tainio, Zokoro etc simply doesn't compare to any of the top four's midfield players, and I believe Everton, Newcastle and Aston Villa all have stronger midfields.
Everton, Newcastle and Villa might have stronger midfields, but Spurs have the better defence and attack. Lennon, Zokora and possibly Tainio and Malbranque are good enough for sides pushing for Europe.
Well I just disagree with that. Everton definitely have a better defence and midfield while Newcastle still have to prove it, but I reckon their's will be better too. Villa's defence isn't great but I expect them to be pushing for Europe this season too.
Spurs have the better keeper. Dawson, King and possibly Kaboul are as good as what any of those teams have at least. The first 2 will be pushing to get into the England team. Can't see Lescott doing that.
Dawson falls into the "looks great against shit teams, but looks lost against the good teams" type of player. Could keep a team from being relegated, but couldn't help a team crack the top 4 if he tried. Only the fans can't understand this because he looks good half the time.
In fact thats like most Spurs players.
Still, BOTTOM OF THE LEAGUE!
Bollocks. Dawson is a quality defender.
He's alright. I've yet to see him stand out with the big guns. He can head well, but not much else. No different to Upson.
As I've said, he's never stood out when there's quality, the tell tale sign that a lot of fans miss.
Simon is conspicuously absent from this thread.
And rightfully so.
Hasn't Lescott already been capped? I'm sure he's been in the squad anyway. In theory, Spurs have the better keeper but he's just been so unreliable in the last year or so. Kaboul does look a good player, but it's hard to stand out in a defence who are generally performing poorly. Newcastle seem to be building an excellent defence aswell. Rozenhal looks good, Taylor will be breaking into the England squad soon, while Cacapa and their new left back seem to also be very good signings.
Lescott is a better defender than Dawson, and I'd say he's just as good as King. It's just the fact that he's not an overhyped media darling like the other two, look at the shite with Darren Bent, all of a sudden he's almost first choice to replace the strikers in the England team coming up, he wouldn't have been at Charlton.
Spurs are very overhyped by the media, fair play to them for finishing in the top 5 the past couple of seasons, but that spot is in no way there own, and to call them the 'big 5' is ridiculous. I think anyone who buys into the Spurs nonsense is just a bit of a fickle football fan with little opinion of their own on the game.
Great team, when they want to be, no way consistent enough and their defence is shit, granted they have injuries but they are hardly solid across the back line.
Haven't seen much of Newcastle's defence, but Taylor is quality too. I just think Dawson's slightly better.
Simon Alf and Lazurus never shout their mouths off when Spurs have a really bad run. And none of them have been so loud mouthed as last
Still it was only 4 or 5 months ago when Jol wasn't good enough. The he was. Then he would beat Wenger to a top 4 spot. Then it was mostly certain becasue they spent 16 million on a 3/4th striker while having massive weaknesses and worse, Jenus as a first teamer. Now they won't.
Such consistency.
Are you surprised? It's 1:30am almost.
I genuinely believe Taylor and Lescott are both better than Dawson. In my view, Dawson is 'above average'. I do think he deserves a lot of credit for leading a poor Spurs back line for large parts of last season but he isn't anything special.
Everton conceded about 20 less goals than Spurs last year. That's a large number, and suggests that their defence is considerably better. Dawson doesn't really do anything that Stubbs doesn't do, they both lack pace. Lescott and Yobo are both pretty quick and don't lack any physical presence. Howard is a better keeper than Robinson too.
Kaboul could end up being a good signing, Bale should grow to be a very good left-back once he's learnt how to defend, and I like Chimbonda, so Spurs aren't desperately dire there once they're all fit. They need to sell Defoe and use the money to buy a good playmaker in midfield to play with Zokora, and a naturally left-sided player. Jol should see this.
Man, you turned around and ran into the hidyhole pretty quickly.
Dawson isn't anything except average. He looks good comparied with shit. That is it.
Leading a back line to almost 60 league goals conceeded isn't something to be boasting about. Wjy don't rave about Evertons defence who haven't conceeded more than 50 and conceeded far lass than Spurs with massive injuries and far less cash to spend.
Last edited by eldanielfire; August 14th, 2007 at 8:41 PM.
Dawson isn't the problem in Spurs' defence.
Almsot 60 goals says otherwise. Toure had some problems in the last two seasons with big gay Sol going cazy and Gallas not getting fit for half the season, if ever. However he never conceeded as much goals and even set a champions league record meanwhile.
However Spurs fans will fail to see this. And that is why they fail.
How many of those did Dawson ship?
Or how many did Dawson fail to prevent?
That's the real question.
Good comeback, but you have to realise he's still young and wasn't brought in to be the leader of the defence - King being injured a lot meant he took on a role he wasn't prepared for. With King back fit, Dawson will be much better off for it.
But of course, being an Arsenal fan, you won't see that.
Toure and Senderos are very young. They also had a dead Lauren, inconsistent Eboue and a 'know nothing' Hoyte. Plus no Ashley Cole or Clichy that season. Plus Flamini (a reserve central midfielder) was the 8th choice left back due to injury (7 fucking left back injured). But they still stopped 20 goals less than Spurs.
You are buying the media hype mate. Dawson is nothing more than average who is fortuant to not have been directly ripped appart so far.
Funnily enough, we don't get an awful lot of media hype about Dawson up here.
And the debate wasn't about Arsenal's defence, it was about Spurs, Newcastle, Everton and Villa's.
Got to laugh at that, well designed BBC site.
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