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Thread: ***Official*** English Football Discussion Thread

  1. #103301
    Shit is orrrn Simon's Avatar
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    zimbabwe


    Vic Akers is Arsenal's kit man.

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    What an excellent response to the cunts in the ground. Well played Wenger. What a legend.

  3. #103303
    Shit is orrrn Simon's Avatar
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    zimbabwe
    One of the Arsene Out brigade was on Twitter complaining about fans with 'goldfish memories' getting behind the side again after tonight's win. Do you think he gets why that's funny?

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    I ate them before they ate me El Capitano Gatisto's Avatar
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    Bringing on Janssen to make it 5-0 is the best response possible to Millwall supporters hissing throughout the game.

  5. #103305
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    nicaragua
    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post


    Vic Akers is Arsenal's kit man.
    Also revolutionised ,if that's not too strong a word, Women's football with Arsenal ladies.

  6. #103306
    Rusev Day! Peter Griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Capitano Gatisto View Post
    Bringing on Janssen to make it 5-0 is the best response possible to Millwall supporters hissing throughout the game.
    I have only just tuned in, But someone said on twitter the 'fans' were giving Son abuse, figures if true.

  7. #103307
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Capitano Gatisto View Post
    Bringing on Janssen to make it 5-0 is the best response possible to Millwall supporters hissing throughout the game.
    Chanting DVD at Son as well. Charmers.

  8. #103308
    RFF WORLDWIDE WESTERN CON son_of_foley's Avatar
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    Schteve gone. Shit one. Rowett meant to be a done deal

  9. #103309
    Do you not know that JP's Avatar
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    Oh God no.

  10. #103310
    RFF WORLDWIDE WESTERN CON son_of_foley's Avatar
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    The rumours were that Norwich were keen so I think we've shit the bed. Glad we gave Chris Martin that contract for Steve

  11. #103311
    Rusev Day! Peter Griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JP View Post
    Oh God no.
    You dislike Derby?

  12. #103312
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post


    Romford?
    Haha wasn't me. Good banner though.

  13. #103313
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    zimbabwe
    Mad to think someone sat at home and made that. Probably had his kids asking him what he was dping.

  14. #103314
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    Maybe he got them to make it.

  15. #103315
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
    You dislike Derby?
    Not particularly, just seeing him elsewhere and succeeding will be like a dagger in the heart.

  16. #103316
    RFF WORLDWIDE WESTERN CON son_of_foley's Avatar
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    We'll probably sack him in 4 months like so don't worry too much

  17. #103317
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Maybe he got them to make it.
    Then maybe someone needs to call the NSPCC.

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    Now all the people who are watching for the referee to decide the game will be happy

  19. #103319
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    zimbabwe
    Spurs vs Chelsea in the youth cup is on ITV4 from 7pm tonight. Plenty of highly-rated kids on each side - for us I'm looking forward to seeing Skipp, Oakley-Boothe and Sterling in particular. Chalobah and Mount supposedly the ones to watch for Chelsea, although most of their best talents are out on loan.

  20. #103320
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    Did that actually just happen?

  21. #103321
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    I was hoping they would get smashed. I hope and think they will get smashed in the next round.

  22. #103322
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    zimbabwe
    Nasri is brain damaged.

  23. #103323
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    http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/39295524
    "Everyone knows what can happen in football but you need to respect your contract," said Koeman.
    Quite the juevos on a man who just broke a contract less than 12 months ago.

  24. #103324
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    nepal
    Wenger out

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    Wenger in

  26. #103326
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    Arsenal fans flew 'Wenger Out' and 'In Arsene we trust' banners over The Hawthorns today

  27. #103327
    RFF WORLDWIDE WESTERN CON son_of_foley's Avatar
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    Paying more attention to the big game of the day but arsenal have been dogshit.

    That's it now for wenger this was the one I think.

    It's not even been the same defensive stuff you could predict but it's yet again they are so 1 dimensional in attack. West Brom were so happy with what they've been up to

  28. #103328
    Shit is orrrn Simon's Avatar
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    zimbabwe
    I really can't imagine them sacking him no matter how bad it gets this season. There's no danger of anything worse than midtable so they'll let him go quietly in the summer surely. Confirm him leaving in the summer now, so the fans can get behind him for the next couple of months.

  29. #103329
    RFF WORLDWIDE WESTERN CON son_of_foley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    I really can't imagine them sacking him no matter how bad it gets this season. There's no danger of anything worse than midtable so they'll let him go quietly in the summer surely. Confirm him leaving in the summer now, so the fans can get behind him for the next couple of months.
    Oh yeah I just mean I think it's becoming less his choice with results like that. There will be a gentle steer for him to make the right decision

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    nepal
    Well hopefully that's another nail in his coffin. Yet another utterly appalling performance against a fairly mediocre West Brom team

  31. #103331
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    Hey lads, we have never had it so good, be careful what you wish for gajahshshahaga

  32. #103332
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    I thought Wenger looked a man at relative peace today, especially compared to the last month or so. I would assume he's decided to go and it's taken a weight off, but maybe he's just written this season off and knows he's signing a new contract.

  33. #103333
    RFF WORLDWIDE WESTERN CON son_of_foley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Hey lads, we have never had it so good, be careful what you wish for gajahshshahaga
    Haha I guess we should trust the indignant arsenal fans judgement more like that time you all blamed pat rice for the shortcomings and hounded him out of the club asahashahahagah

  34. #103334
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    Or it could be that Pat Rice was old and wanted to retire...

  35. #103335
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    That's a weird one sof. Pat Rice is beloved at Arsenal and only left because he retired. There was hope Bould being No 2 might help sure up the defence but no one hounded Rice out.

  36. #103336
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    "Hounded out" may be overly descriptive but Arsenal supporters were openly abusive about him, as they are with Wenger now, and seemed to think Steve Bould coming in would herald some defensive revolution.

  37. #103337
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    nepal
    He was just seen as a yes man, which essentially he was, and was used as an example of Wenger having too much influence at the club. And as its turned out, so is Steve Bould. But then again, what teams really have a visible assistant manager?

  38. #103338
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    Honestly Arsenal fans deserve everything they get. It'll be unfortunate for Wenger if he doesn't get top 4 in his last season in charge having always achieved it in the past, but I don't see how the Arsenal fans wouldn't think they were a large part to blame in that. There is a poisonous and self entitled atmosphere there. Must be unsettling for the players seeing how the fans have turned against such a loyal and successful manager, it's bad enough when the players staying motivated when they know the manager is going from any club, but when the manager has been such an integral part of the club for 20 years they must feel incredibly unsure about their own future. No idea how they could be expected to do particularly well in those circumstances.

  39. #103339
    I ate them before they ate me El Capitano Gatisto's Avatar
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    I think the players are happy to let the manager take the blame and they will do the same to any replacement manager.

  40. #103340
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    Well the precedent is there isn't it? That squad should be capable of winning the league. When they haven't, the manager (who has at least shown that he is capable of winning titles) has taken all the criticism from the fans.

  41. #103341
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Or it could be that Pat Rice was old and wanted to retire...
    I look forward to the revisionist history when wenger goes too

  42. #103342
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    It'll be interesting to see how we manage to finish below Arsenal considering the two sides' current states.

  43. #103343
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    At this rate Everton look solid bets to finish above them too

  44. #103344
    Echte Männer haben rosa MMH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by son_of_foley View Post
    At this rate Everton look solid bets to finish above them too
    We are deffo in the mix.

    Could have done without Schneiderlin getting injured yesterday though.

  45. #103345
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    zimbabwe
    The papers reckon Wenger is staying

  46. #103346
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Hey lads, we have never had it so good, be careful what you wish for gajahshshahaga
    What manager is actually linked to coming in?

    Because without Sanchez and Ozil this is an ordinary team - why would they stay? Then why would it get better?

  47. #103347
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    Allegri has been heavily linked. Doesnt matter who goes at this point, he has completely lost the players.

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    nepal
    I don't care if he gets another year, they're really going to be fucked next season, so if someone came in during the summer they'd be on a hiding to nothing. Sanchez and Ozil (not that he has done anything this season) probably both off, and you're left with a painfully mediocre side. So much dead wood that needs clearing out. I would fully expect next season to be worse, especially if it's managed by Wenger, who the players correctly have no faith in.

  49. #103349
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    The players are just as culpable to be fair. No proper fight in any of them.

    Tuchel been linked this morning.

  50. #103350
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    nepal
    True, but again that's a criticism that's been thrown at Arsenal for a number of seasons, and again you have to ask questions of the manager about why it hasn't been addressed. Outside of maybe Sanchez, and he acts like a fanny a lot of the time, there's not a single player you can look to in that team for inspiration.

  51. #103351
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    The fans and players and board should be ashamed. Wenger is faultless.

  52. #103352
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    Why would the board be ashamed?

  53. #103353
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    For giving Wenger 18 jobs and only paying him for 1.

  54. #103354
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    You wonder how different it would have been if they didn't turn the Suarez bid into a farce. A fucking quid. Just offer them 5 million over the release clause and there's no ambiguity and you don't make a mockery of the system to the point where Liverpool dug in and ensured it didn't happen. That surely lands at the board's feet - the money doesn't come out of Wenger's bank account after all. Sanchez is a great player, but Suarez is a winner. Look at what he did with that Liverpool team the season after. Probably would have won the league that season with him in the side, and absolutely last year.

  55. #103355
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    I doubt Suarez had any interest in joining Arsenal. I think it was always going to be Barcelona.

  56. #103356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanny Batter View Post
    You wonder how different it would have been if they didn't turn the Suarez bid into a farce. A fucking quid. Just offer them 5 million over the release clause and there's no ambiguity and you don't make a mockery of the system to the point where Liverpool dug in and ensured it didn't happen. That surely lands at the board's feet - the money doesn't come out of Wenger's bank account after all. Sanchez is a great player, but Suarez is a winner. Look at what he did with that Liverpool team the season after. Probably would have won the league that season with him in the side, and absolutely last year.
    Why would they offer £5m extra when they only had to offer £1 over (as far as they understood)? That would have been the ultimate example of the football world losing touch with itself if they were just gifting a rival £5m for the hell of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    I doubt Suarez had any interest in joining Arsenal. I think it was always going to be Barcelona.
    Arsenal only knew about the clause because Suarez's people had told them. He may have been using it to negotiate himself a better deal at Liverpool or elsewhere but they had every reason to think that he wanted to join them.

  57. #103357
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    Suarez clearly wouldn't have wanted to go to Arsenal when, at that point, any club in the world would have paid for him. And that could mean he would be cheered, rather than being booed or playing in silence every week.

  58. #103358
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    Arsenal really have overtaken Spurs as being the most hated team on this forum over the years. Quite the turnaround.

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    Not so. I don't hate particularly the Arsenal team at all, nor their manager. It's the fans that are the problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    Arsenal really have overtaken Spurs as being the most hated team on this forum over the years. Quite the turnaround.
    Nope, I have no issue with the club really beyond putting the board clearly being a bit lazy by letting Wenger do everything for them, and then putting him into a corner that no man would ever have been able to fight away from. He does more than any other manager on the planet.

    Arsenal fans have certainly taken over as being the most horrible fans in the country. Spurs fans have become actually quite reasonable now. No threads for transfer targets, no ITKs, no bollocks.

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    I do see a lot of criticism aimed at the players here also though.

    I actually feel quite sorry for Wenger at the moment. He always looks like he's in physical pain these days. I say these days, the last few years, really.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Rosk View Post
    For giving Wenger 18 jobs and only paying him for 1.
    I think that is more his decision than theirs. He is famous for not delegating.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    I think that is more his decision than theirs. He is famous for not delegating.
    No I think you may have made this up to suit your agenda.

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    Read any Wenger biography and you will see he likes to be very hands on.

    When David Dein left in 2007, he took over his role because he wanted to, the board offered to replace him.

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    Alex Ferguson famously delegated, particuarly in his latter years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Read any Wenger biography and you will see he likes to be very hands on.

    When David Dein left in 2007, he took over his role because he wanted to, the board offered to replace him.
    I find it odd that Wenger wanting to be "hands on" in a role is seen as a negative by anyone. The board can offer what they want and do what they want. Maybe they should have some more bollocks and not leave everything down to Wenger.

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    Gives him more control if he does it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    I think that is more his decision than theirs. He is famous for not delegating.
    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Read any Wenger biography and you will see he likes to be very hands on.

    When David Dein left in 2007, he took over his role because he wanted to, the board offered to replace him.
    Hahaha, what a ridiculous argument. The board are his boss. If they think it's detrimental to the club for him to take on more responsibilities, even if he wants to (and who can blame him really? It's more control isn't it?), then they should've stopped him from doing so.

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    Well they're letting him dictate if he stays or not. It should be the other way round, especially at the current rate that they seem to be going backwards.

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    So it's the board's fault. Thanks for clearing that up.

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    The boards fault for not taking the decision out of his hands, and Wenger's for not having any dignity or self-awareness with regards to knowing when to walk away.

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    So it's the board's fault. Thanks for clearing that up.

    Good to know that you cast negativity on Wenger for wanting to put his life into your club.

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    I'm anticipating the phrase "all is forgiven" trending in Islington within two months of Wenger leaving.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Rosk View Post
    Good to know that you cast negativity on Wenger for wanting to put his life into your club.
    Yeah, and so do the fans that turn up every week, but unfortunately they don't get paid 8m a year for the privilege.

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    Waddling along to a beautiful ground watching skilled sportsmen play a game for 90 minutes of their 10,080 minute week is hardly "putting their life into a club". Please try again.

    The man is doing 17 jobs at once because the board can't be arsed to tell him no when he offers to do more. That is awful management of a incomparably dedicated and hungry manager. And so it's the board's fault.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hlebsfall View Post
    Yeah, and so do the fans that turn up every week, but unfortunately they don't get paid 8m a year for the privilege.
    You wouldnt be fulfilling your contract as fans anyway even if you did.

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    You're completely moving the goalposts because your prior defence of Wenger has proven to be baseless, and pretty much every single criticism of him that any fans who want him out have made has turned out to be true. I don't care what he does behind the scenes, that's his choice, he's judged by results on the pitch. And I've been able to accurately predict how Arsenal's season will pan out before a ball has been locked for several years now.

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    It's a real shame your stunningly accurate predictions are based on a reality you childishly cannot accept.

  80. #103380
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    You also fail to accept that constant criticism over a sustained period of time only serves to exacerbate issues. Cut the head off by all means, but your board will need to spend a lot on many many good people to even come close to replacing arguably the only truly dependable manager in modern football.

  81. #103381
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Rosk View Post
    The man is doing 17 jobs at once because the board can't be arsed to tell him no when he offers to do more. That is awful management of a incomparably dedicated and hungry manager. And so it's the board's fault.
    The board's at fault first and foremost, but don't act like Wenger shouldn't take some of the blame here. If he was so dedicated and hungry, and couldn't do his 17 jobs to a good standard, any other person would raise their hands, admit they're out of the depth, and ask for help. If you don't agree it was his job to make that assessment then he's at fault to thinking his own performances were ok and worthy of the £8m a year he gets.

  82. #103382
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    Quote Originally Posted by RuneEdge View Post
    The board's at fault first and foremost, but don't act like Wenger shouldn't take some of the blame here. If he was so dedicated and hungry, and couldn't do his 17 jobs to a good standard, any other person would raise their hands, admit they're out of the depth, and ask for help. If you don't agree it was his job to make that assessment then he's at fault to thinking his own performances were ok and worthy of the £8m a year he gets.
    So the board is at fault that they've only been doing as well as expected. I think we all agree on this now.

    Quite apt to point out that when they now look like they are not doing as well as usual, it also correlates quite timely with the fans being unbelievable dickheads more than ever. Hmmmm I wonder what the difference is here. Hmmmmm.

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    I'm not gonna disagree with their fan behaviour, but where are they supposed to draw the line with their expectations? If fans come to accept where they are today, then that will eventually become the "usual" level for them.
    If Wenger's not a fault here, what is supposed to happen here? How else is anyone supposed to handle this?

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    But it is the usual level. Fourth biggest club, fourth richest club, never finish below fourth. Arsenal fans now expect to overachieve because that's what Wenger had them doing.

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    I'm not talking about fourth, I'm talking about slipping below that. Fourth wasn't their level in the past but recently it has been. Now we're looking at a team that could be struggling to cope with those expectations, and Wenger needs to take some responsibility for that.
    The top four is now a top six. They most likely can't compete with Man Utd, City and Chelsea for money, and Spurs over the last 18 months have proven that their run at the top isn't a one time thing.

  86. #103386
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    Name me a single club in the premier league that has not fallen below expectations once in the last 20 years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hlebsfall View Post
    Yeah, and so do the fans that turn up every week, but unfortunately they don't get paid 8m a year for the privilege.
    I pay my tv license every year while the BBC produce some excellent television and films that aren't quite up to the standard I have come to expect from watching HBO. Meanwhile some guys there are getting paid rather a lot more than I am paying. Time for me to go and campaign outside of the Graham Norton show and call for his head. That'll get things done.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    Name me a single club in the premier league that has not fallen below expectations once in the last 20 years.
    This isn't about it happening once. This is about it happening again and again for over 10 years, to the point where standards have to be lowered, and then seeing the club now not even being able to live up to those lowered standards.
    Besides, we're kinda drifting away from my point, which is that no matter how you assess the last 20 years, Wenger needs to take some responsibility for where they are now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RuneEdge View Post
    Besides, we're kinda drifting away from my point, which is that no matter how you assess the last 20 years, Wenger needs to take some responsibility for where they are now.
    Making a giant profit for the board this season yet again?

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    Quote Originally Posted by RuneEdge View Post
    This isn't about it happening once. This is about it happening again and again for over 10 years, to the point where standards have to be lowered, and then seeing the club now not even being able to live up to those lowered standards.
    Besides, we're kinda drifting away from my point, which is that no matter how you assess the last 20 years, Wenger needs to take some responsibility for where they are now.

    Complete revisionist fabrication. Standards weren't lowered because of Wenger, they were lowered because Manchester City and Chelsea got bought by billionaires who wanted to spaff their money on winning the league. That was why Arsenal went from battling for the title to battling for top 4.

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    Wenger himself has made a nonsense of the expectations argument. It's him who says every year that Arsenal are good enough to win the league.

    It's not that Arsenal haven't won the league in 12 years though, it's the mind numbing predictability. Hlebs got slated for being negative at the start of the season when we were doing well but guess what, he got it spot on. The league campaign has been exactly the same for over a decade. The CL campaigns are getting worse. Wenger just isn't able to do the job he used to be able to. Performances aren't as good, signings aren't as good, mentality is poor, there's no leaders. He just doesn't appear able to fix the problems.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy View Post
    Wenger himself has made a nonsense of the expectations argument. It's him who says every year that Arsenal are good enough to win the league.

    It's not that Arsenal haven't won the league in 12 years though, it's the mind numbing predictability. Hlebs got slated for being negative at the start of the season when we were doing well but guess what, he got it spot on. The league campaign has been exactly the same for over a decade. The CL campaigns are getting worse. Wenger just isn't able to do the job he used to be able to. Performances aren't as good, signings aren't as good, mentality is poor, there's no leaders. He just doesn't appear able to fix the problems.
    You lot keep coming back to that as though it means something. Yes Wenger says that he hopes to challenge for the league title every year, so what? Every year you do challenge for the title, you just don't win it. Are you saying that Arsenal fans would be more forgiving if every year Wenger said 'obviously we are unlikely to compete with the big clubs, in fact there are potentially 2 clubs pushing for the title and another 6 competing for the next 4, so as long as we finish top 4 I'll be content'?

    Every year managers of clubs say that they aren't planning on being near a relegation dogfight...but guess where they end up?

    Him being ambitious doesn't mean Arsenal should automatically overturn the huge advantages that Chelsea and Man City in particular have over you.

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    Its treating the fans like mugs saying we can win the league, just utter bullshit, everyone knows it wont happen so why say it?

    Also Mik, I think your idea of challenging for the title is different from ours. Challenging for the league is being in contention with a few games to go, something we havent done in a decade.

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    Mik's point is that every club says that. You've completely missed the argument here.

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    And the point is, every team around us at some point over the past decade has been in with a shot of the title up until the end of the season. Arsenal have never been close.

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    Exactly.

    I see the club are playing the 'transfer war chest card' now

    Never has a club treated its fans with such contempt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Never has a club treated its fans with such contempt.
    !

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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Never has a club treated its fans with such contempt.
    Blimey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Romford Pele View Post
    Never has a club treated its fans with such contempt.
    I didn't know you supported Leyton Orient.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beefy View Post
    I didn't know you supported Leyton Orient.
    Or Blackpool.

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