It's not even 100% about the fact Shawn did a lot of jobs to Bret....It's the fact that the 1 time Shawn did beat him he took his shit and left and then had the nerve to tell Shawn he was glad he was putting over. And? Imagine your worst enemy coming up to you at work and saying "You know, I've had all these promotions at work but I'm glad I'm getting passed up on this one for you....because I'm quitting the company" That's just bullshit to say to someone.
Ultimate Table for 3 on the Network. Vince, Shawn and Bret. The whole world would get the Network just forthat!
The Ultimate Warrior didn't bitch about laying down? Warrior barely had to lay down. Let's talk about when he did lose the title to Sarge it took interference from Adnan, Sherri and The Macho King (Ohhhh Yeah!!!!)! Savage literally blindsided Warrior with a shot to the neck and then crashes a big spotlight into Warrior's ribs. Warrior survives that, gets put in Bear Hugs and The Camel Clutch after that rib shot and survives that. Eventually Warrior gets blasted in the skull with the sceptor and get pinned. That motherfucker Warrior doesn't sell any of that shit and kicks out right after 3. No doubt match was structured this way because Warrior had to be Warrior.Originally Posted by Nash Diesel
That Sherri bump at the end when Warrior launches her into Savage was fucking awesome.
I think comparing Warrior's track record to Bret's is a bit of a stretch.
The Ultimate Warrior. The bastion of professionalism.
Last edited by Jarrod1983; May 22nd, 2020 at 2:06 PM.
The Bret vs. Shawn Blu Ray with JR at the helm was pretty good.
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Jarrod1983 again.The Ultimate Warrior didn't bitch about laying down? Warrior barely had to lay down. Let's talk about when he did lose the title to Sarge it took interference from Adnan, Sherri and The Macho King (Ohhhh Yeah!!!!)! Savage literally blindsided Warrior with a shot to the neck and then crashes a big spotlight into Warrior's ribs. Warrior survives that, gets put in Bear Hugs and The Camel Clutch after that rib shot and survives that. Eventually Warrior gets blasted in the skull with the sceptor and get pins. That motherfucker Warrior doesn't sell any of that shit and kicks out right after 3. No doubt match was structured this way because Warrior had to be Warrior.
That Sherri bump at the end when Warrior launches her into Savage was fucking awesome.
I think comparing Warrior's track record to Bret's is a bit of a stretch.
The Ultimate Warrior. The bastion of professionalism.
Having a protected finish=bitching? That's news to me. I mean, Bret couldn't even take the L from Shawn within 60 minutes it had to be this over the top sudden death bullshit.The Ultimate Warrior didn't bitch about laying down? Warrior barely had to lay down. Let's talk about when he did lose the title to Sarge it took interference from Adnan, Sherri and The Macho King (Ohhhh Yeah!!!!)! Savage literally blindsided Warrior with a shot to the neck and then crashes a big spotlight into Warrior's ribs. Warrior survives that, gets put in Bear Hugs and The Camel Clutch after that rib shot and survives that. Eventually Warrior gets blasted in the skull with the sceptor and get pinned. That motherfucker Warrior doesn't sell any of that shit and kicks out right after 3. No doubt match was structured this way because Warrior had to be Warrior.
That Sherri bump at the end when Warrior launches her into Savage was fucking awesome.
I think comparing Warrior's track record to Bret's is a bit of a stretch.
The Ultimate Warrior. The bastion of professionalism.
Did Warrior ever do an interview bitching about that loss to Slaughter or the loss to Rick Rude? Again, everything you posted would be great if I said "Warrior never had a protected finish!"
Bret bitches about EVERYTHING, it's kind of his thing. Dude, even after Sid powerbombed his ass at WM 13 he called Bret a crybaby it was fucking hilarious. That was almost his real life turning into a gimmick because if you remember when he came back and fought Austin, pretty much after that it was nothing but him complaining and throwing a fit on tv every chance he could get.
It was life imitating art or whatever the fuck that saying is lol.
Why? Like I said just said, nothing my man Jarrod said meant the Warrior bitched about losing to Slaughter. Most babyfaces during that time didn't lose the title clean. BRET HART for fuck's sake lost his title at Mania 9 via Fuji throwing "salt" in his eyes...which is why Hogan came out and defended the honor of Hitman.
So yeah, how about you spread some rep my way??
Hardly think Sid has much credibility when he aaks for a re-take in an interview and he has to be reminded it's live.
Bret is no angel we've already established that, but he has taken his fair share of losses and did his best to put over his opponents in the ring as much as he possibly can. He has bitched yes but I think you're overplaying how much he has done so and to what degree he has used his stroke.
I always liked the OT finish. I didn't see it coming. I figured there'd be a Sharpshooter and Sweet Chin Music finish. Then Shawn getting the win 2-1.
Those are the only 2 pinfalls Warrior took I can recall. My point was Warrior didn't do jobs and when he did it took a fuck ton of interference. Bret did his fair share whether it was to Shawn or not (apparently not). Even when Warrior came back, no jobs just squashing every talent he could before taking off again.
Bret does complain a lot. They did play that up. Bret was still better than ever in 97 playing that character. Probably because Bret's great at griping. Bret backed it up in the ring though.
Last edited by Jarrod1983; May 22nd, 2020 at 2:41 PM.
Also Warrior took not one, two, three, four but five Savage elbows and still kicked out. Silver platter doesn't even begin to cover it.
My rep can always use a bump sir.
Wasn't it a leg drop that actually beat Bret? Salt just got Yoko out of The Sharpshooter. I get your point though, just trying to remember the finish.
The SummerSlam 92 match is even worse. Savage just killing his finish and his hip for Warrior, who won by DQ that night, not returning the favor to Savage in any way, shape or form.
Speaking of Warrior, my mail just arrived. I got Maverick a Warrior and n.W.o. one piece. Guy just turned one, he is huge! Wife saw that new The Mom Becky tee and got me on the Shop Zone website. I don't like going on because I spend way too much. Got myself a Macho King shirt too. Excited for the baby's first WWE merch though!
Your point is totally different than mine because I was talking about Bret bitching and you're talking about protected finishes from 1991.
Completely irrelevant. We're not talking about Warrior kicking out after 5 elbows to send Savage off into the sunset.
Right, he took the leg after getting salt in the eyes.....He was about to tap that fat son of a bitch, which btw looked completely fucking ridiculous seeing Bret trying to put that on Yoko. Then boom, salt, leg. Not a clean win by any stretch.
Ah the mythical "I lost to you so you owe me" How did that work out at Halloween Havoc 1998? Just curious if doing favors=best for business. So it was ok for that kind of a finish for Montreal that Bret wanted but not ok for the ppv he main evented over the World title in London wrestling a cracked out Bulldog? Right on
I tried so hard to get my ex to let me buy this Wolfpac nWo one piece for my youngest daughter. I think they were selling them at Spencer's.
And yeah I was on the shop the other day for my oldest son who turns 19 in a month. We have had this tradition where he gets at least something Ultimate Warrior related, been going on for like 15 years. So I ordered him a sweet Warrior shirt that apparently is a special order and then a Velveteen Dream shirt. They had a ton of wrestlers shit 40% off, can't pass that up. I got the Dream shirt for like $9.
Bret about to tap Yoko then Fuji pulls a heel move to stop the heroism? Chickenshit heel move oh dear, bet was that Bret bad politicking. Called being heelish. How about Hogan getting blasted in the face with fucking fire from a camera at King of the Ring to be protected? Bret's hardly the worst.
Also my point of bringing Warrior up was how much he was protected and how much Bret paled in comparison. Bret took a lot of losses but was not as heavily protected as some.
"Oh but Hogan and Warrior never bitched or pulled strings like Bret lol"
Last edited by Badger; May 22nd, 2020 at 3:53 PM.
I brought up Warrior because you brought him in the conversation.Your point is totally different than mine because I was talking about Bret bitching and you're talking about protected finishes from 1991.
Completely irrelevant. We're not talking about Warrior kicking out after 5 elbows to send Savage off into the sunset.
Right, he took the leg after getting salt in the eyes.....He was about to tap that fat son of a bitch, which btw looked completely fucking ridiculous seeing Bret trying to put that on Yoko. Then boom, salt, leg. Not a clean win by any stretch.
Ah the mythical "I lost to you so you owe me" How did that work out at Halloween Havoc 1998? Just curious if doing favors=best for business. So it was ok for that kind of a finish for Montreal that Bret wanted but not ok for the ppv he main evented over the World title in London wrestling a cracked out Bulldog? Right on
I tried so hard to get my ex to let me buy this Wolfpac nWo one piece for my youngest daughter. I think they were selling them at Spencer's.
And yeah I was on the shop the other day for my oldest son who turns 19 in a month. We have had this tradition where he gets at least something Ultimate Warrior related, been going on for like 15 years. So I ordered him a sweet Warrior shirt that apparently is a special order and then a Velveteen Dream shirt. They had a ton of wrestlers shit 40% off, can't pass that up. I got the Dream shirt for like $9.
The Sharpshooter didn't look great on Yoko. Good for Bret for trying though.
My point on Warrior/Savage was it was a opportunity for the Champion to look good by Warrior giving back. Especially if Savage was losing the gold three days later to Slick Ric.
If you look back I've never said Bret should have went over in Montreal. Bret should have done the job. I'm just saying I see why he was being a stubborn ole dinosaur (Bret's term for old timers in his book).
Bret carrying a cracked out, forgetful Bulldog to that match in Wembley just proved how cool, calm and bad ass Bret was. Shawn had a match with Bulldog too under stressful situations (weather). Shawn didn't handle things well then.
I'm glad my wife tolerates it. She sports some wear too at the ppv parties we hold. She has a old Stinger 92 shirt she picked out she looks pretty dam good in! I let her pick one (Warrior) and I picked the n.W.o. Showed them to the baby and he grabbed Warrior's right away! Guy tears up my livingroom like Warrior running down on HTM at SummerSlam 88. Just total devastation in no time flat. So it's appropriate he likes Warrior.
Shop does have some nifty deals going. Got my son a Rey Mysterio shirt for his B-day coming up, I got a Dad 3:16 shirt and a wall hanger for my fake I-C title too today. Gonna rib the wife and hang that belt right in the middle of our livingroom and see what she says.
Up to you but would love a pic of Maverick in the Warrior outfit.
I'm a old dinosaur because I can't figure out how to post pics on here. Always just gives me some gibberish bullshit after I post stuff like that. You click on my Twitter you should be able to see some pics but not in the Warrior outfit yet. He's napping. Will probably dress him in it tomorrow.
You have a follow from me now and he is a cutie.
Awesome. Thank you, I love him to pieces. He's a happy guy!
Going to watch some Owen later today. Haven't decided what yet though.
Is Julie Hart related to anyone in the Hart family?
Julia Hart in AEW?
no.
Probably her mother and father
Yeah, that's who I meant.
23 years later. Never forget.
I remember the next day in school, even people who hated wrestling were talking about it. Surreal. Wish he was still with us.
Fuck can't believe its that long. I'll never forget JR and King at that event - I had never seen King so sad before.
I was thinking last night about how it's been 23 years and what those 23 years would've looked like with Owen still here. He had talked about winding down but you know how that goes.
What if Owen had left the WWE in the early 2000's and went to TNA?
In all honesty if he were alive at that time, I don’t think Owen was ever the type to have ever jumped ship anywhere despite what happened. Despite possible creative differences, he was always a family man first and foremost and probably thought of the money first to put food on the table as far as TNA was concerned anyway. Even if he did, he probably would’ve circled his way back when he realised he likely wasn’t going to be used right.
Truest Vince phrase about Bret when he left which I think probably would’ve applied to Owen. Don’t know how to use him.
Well, we do know for a fact that Owen was supposed to win the IC title from the Godfather right? Maybe he defends it as the Blue Blazer for a while. Maybe he loses it, and blames his loss in that he's a comedy character. So he ditches the gimmick and becomes a serious wrestler again. And maybe he chases for the IC title again, or maybe he moves on to the main title. Have him take the Big Show's reign at the end of 99.
He tried to get out of his contract and go to WCW after Montreal.
I wonder if maybe there would've been a point where he knew WWE weren't about pushing talent in their 40's and with his career winding down TNA might've looked appealing to him like it did many others (Booker T, Goldust, Nash, etc.). Or even guys like Christian and Angle. We have to remember Owen Hart was what, 34 when he died? TNA comes along in 2002. If he did leave I definitely think he would've made his way back but you never know. He might've hit up RF Video and did a shoot burying the WWE lol.
The one glaring issue in Owen's career that a lot of us fans don't really think about is that he fucked his knee back in I think 1990-1991. I remember reading it was pretty bad as time went on and that's why you saw him slow it down and not be as flashy in his 30's. He might not have been able to work much longer.
I missed this. Definitely agree about Bret. Bret came at the wrong time. WCW was so top heavy but Bischoff wanted to tap into that Canadian and to an extent Worldwide audience due to how beloved Bret was globally. Bret fucked up because he had questionable relationships with Hogan, Outsiders, I'm sure a couple others lol.
Owen going to WCW would've been the same thing. He wasn't exactly a top tier midcarder/main event guy after Bret left WWF. I fear he might've wound up like Bulldog and Anvil because not only was WCW's main event scene top heavy, the entire roster was bloated.
TNA....That's a tough call. He was loved enough to where bookers he worked with would've used him at the top and he probably would've been back in WWE before Dixie started touching the product.
I think the World title was out of sight out of mind for Owen Hart. Definitely would've been a mainstay in the IC/Tag/Euro stuff. Probably would've won the Hardcore title as Blue Blazer at some point lol.
Had a bigger response typed out but stupid phone/forums timed me out when trying to post it so boiling it down to this.
TNA is indeed a very tough call but this was the same company that had Hogan/Bischoff at the helm eventually along with the Main Event Mafia.I know that example is maybe stretching a bit given their position but trying to say that even before that went down and he joined them. I’m doubtful his star would have risen much higher given that environment plus the injuries point is a valid one. Essentially I think maybe short-term push if he arrived in TNA but once the post-WWE leaving buzz wore off, not sure how sustainable it would have been and then he finds his way back home to WWE.
Eh, I don't think Owen would be paying for the sins of Bret. It seemed like Owen was one of the most well liked people.
I think it just depends on WHEN he goes to TNA. Some of the people you're talking about didn't show up until 2009. But again I still see him coming back to the WWE at some point even if it's just random appearances that they would typically use legends for.
If he had saved his money wisely, like I heard, I'd imagine he would have retired from in ring action before age 40. I could see him being a pre show analyst these days.
I also wonder if Owen would've tried his hand with helping developmental talent. Since his death WWE had OVW, DSW, FCW, NXT...Owen's assistance in those farm leagues would've been amazing. He just seemed like the guy who was young enough to still connect with up and comers like Edge, but came up the old old school way to still have the respect of his peers/elders.
Owen would have been not just a good but a phenomenal choice to the backstage talent. Obvious experience in and out of the ring plus could have taught a young talent a thing or two about backstage ribs while pulling one on the protege himself.
Owen having a prank protege would've been awesome.
Indeed.
Remembering Owen!
A great talent gone too soon. I had been watching a youtube channel that uploaded a bunch of Shotgun Saturday Night shows and one of was a week prior to Over the Edge. It was wild. I had just finished the Bret Hart RF Video shoot the night before.
Hart vs. Hart is the best WrestleMania match of all time.
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