All Elite Wrestling

[Nash Diesel]

New Japan never gets the credit they deserve for working with other promotions and those relationships 9 times out of 10 being pretty great.

[MTR]

Why can't it be a Saturday? If it was a Saturday I could probably make it work. Can't seem me driving home that night after the show. Can't really take off work to go. I would love to but I have other things to get done around the house if I am going to take off work.

[VHS]

You know despite the bullshit Authority stuff with Orton v. Big Show and holding back Daniel Bryan, I really enjoyed a lot of the 2013-2014 era. Especially the tag scene. Not a huge number of teams but the Usos/Wyatts/Rhodes Fam/Shield combos ALWAYS delivered. Seriously go back and watch that 2/3 falls match with the Usos v. Harper/Rowan. Incredible.

Quality over quantity.

Fuuuckin' a right those were good times for the tag div.

[VHS]

Punk hinted as a special guest tonight. What's in the box, what's in the booooox?

[Defrost]

Punk hinted as a special guest tonight. What's in the box, what's in the booooox?

Probably President Obari since he's in America and we all seem to know what the big announcement is.

[Bert]

Danielson wearing something besides just a plain white tee, wow.

[VHS]

The teams are on opposite corners than the usual. Jarring.

[Bert]

Ishii vs Adam Cole on Rampage will make people happy.

I like Jay White.

[VHS]

They didn't even let him say anything? :lol:

[Tainted Eclipse]

the jay white and adam cole intrusion took away some of the luster from that announcement

[VHS]

Yeah, that announcement was caca.

Wardlow is goddamn CAPS LOCK. :yes:

[Bert]

Dax vs Cash is an Owen qualifier, whoa.

I love Danielle Kamela.

[Bert]

Sting with a Sting mask will never not pop me. :lol:

[Nash Diesel]

Bert blew himself after this show
VHS you like that?

[BGMaverick]

Great to see a wrestling-starved city like Chicago get the big crossover show lol. I have little doubt that the advertising and hype for this show will be off the charts. AEW seems to be advertising like crazy for their weekly shows but it can come off rather scattered or rushed when they do it, but this is going to be a new massive concept PPV event for AEW so I imagine they’ll really lock in and do well building this. It’ll be interesting to see how NJPW attempts to rise to the occasion with this because their brand has really suffered tremendously during the pandemic and was starting to lose its luster in America prior to the pandemic.

[VHS]

Bert blew himself after this show
@VHS (https://forums.rajah.com/member.php?u=36173) you like that?

fap fap fap fap fap fap

[Sinner]

ugh, just venting..but I despise the BCC. Awful group, awful name, fantastic members (except Idiot Yuta). Man, I do not like him or see any appeal to him, at all.

And that Adam Cole/Switchblade/Tony/Tony/Japanese Guy segment was also very poorly done.

Meh episode

[Nash Diesel]

Great to see a wrestling-starved city like Chicago get the big crossover show lol. I have little doubt that the advertising and hype for this show will be off the charts. AEW seems to be advertising like crazy for their weekly shows but it can come off rather scattered or rushed when they do it, but this is going to be a new massive concept PPV event for AEW so I imagine they’ll really lock in and do well building this. It’ll be interesting to see how NJPW attempts to rise to the occasion with this because their brand has really suffered tremendously during the pandemic and was starting to lose its luster in America prior to the pandemic.

Don't get it twisted. This is more about AEW wanting to work with New Japan than the other way around. New Japan were not happy about losing Omega and the Bucks. To the point where Uncle Dave was spreading rumors that New Japan were trying to fuck with Kenny's passport or something wild. Like I said a few posts up...New Japan does not get the credit they deserve. It's always everyone else. WWF, WCW, ROH, now AEW it's New Japan who is benefitting....Sure in a way they are but so is everyone else. WWE is beyond needing them but everyone else still wants to work with them and have a relationship because it means something.

It's like a badge of honor to say you've worked with New Japan.

[Badger]

Would it be the craziest thing in the world if Danhausen handed Hook his first loss down the road if they competed as he finally gets to curse him? Hook can always get his win back and murder him in the rematch?

Also Wardlow/MJF angle is still my favourite storyline going on right now. Nice match between Punk/Dustin too.

[Donald]

Hook should be smart enough to know that curses aren't real and just murder Danhausen

[Badger]

Hook should be smart enough to know that curses aren't real and just murder Danhausen

Well that’s sorta what they’re doing so far but figured it would be fun if Danhausen finally got to him either by beating him or costing him a big match. Give Hook a bit of character development and chink in his armour. Then Hook corrects that and murders him.

Must be going somewhere other than Hook no-selling him all the time. Give him a bump in the road.

[Nash Diesel]

IDK if Danhausen is the guy I'm wanting Hook to show some character development with lol. Danhausen is a fucking buffoon. The guy can barely wrestle. Hook is no better. Does his dad's moves and 2 minutes later he walks out. He should get out of the business.

[mth]

Can't wait for the Hook/Danhausen bloody, thumbtack-filled deathmatch...

[Badger]

IDK if Danhausen is the guy I'm wanting Hook to show some character development with lol. Danhausen is a fucking buffoon. The guy can barely wrestle. Hook is no better. Does his dad's moves and 2 minutes later he walks out. He should get out of the business.

I kinda get comedy wrestlers is maybe not entirely your thing. I still don’t your Yuta hatred unless it’s because he was with Best Friends or something but Yuta had a potential AEW career-making match against Moxley. Maybe you know more than I don’t.

Sometimes the silly shit is fun but personal opinion on these things I guess.

[Badger]

Every Nash AEW post I read in a Cornette voice which he’d probably love tbf lol.

[Bert]

I like his sarcastic posts because I read them without sarcasm and they're way more enjoyable.

[Nash Diesel]

I kinda get comedy wrestlers is maybe not entirely your thing. I still don’t your Yuta hatred unless it’s because he was with Best Friends or something but Yuta had a potential AEW career-making match against Moxley. Maybe you know more than I don’t.

Sometimes the silly shit is fun but personal opinion on these things I guess.

Sometimes the silly shit is fun. I don't know where you're getting that I don't find comedy wrestlers entertaining. Is Yuta comedy wrestler? Sure, but not in the way you would describe Danhausen or Santino (Love Santino).

Damn now that you said that I'm like shit, I think the only comedy wrestlers that I know of that I don't really like are Danhausen and Hornswoggle. Best comedy wrestler? Electrofied Goldust.


Every Nash AEW post I read in a Cornette voice which he’d probably love tbf lol.

Naw Cornette barely likes anything AEW pulls off whereas I'm front and center. It's just a shame in this thread, just this thread, we can't be critical we just have to get on our knees, open wide, and beg for that Khan stick every day.

Read my posts in the voice of Xavier Woods. Everyone says my voice sounds like Xavier Woods meets Denzel Washington.

[Nash Diesel]

What some of you kids don't realize is that when you overreact to shit like Wheeler Yuta, it makes him even worse. It's like some of you want everything AEW does to make sense and work and automatically be this "career making" moment/match....That's what waters everything down.

Remember Keith Lee? Main eventing Raw, challenging for the World title. Now look at him. Pathetic. People over there talking about Wheeler Yuta had a career making match...no shit when you're working with the top guys despite being nothing but a jobber....I will take great pride in laughing at Wheeler Yuta being gone in a year and not having any clout because he was gifted this shit. Wheeler Yuta makes wrestling faker than Bray Wyatt's fun house.

[Badger]

But who’s been really overreacting to Yuta that badly? They’ve built a good story to him where he’s lost time and again but really earned his stripes IMO in the latest Moxley match.

Can understand it with people like Hook to a degree but don’t get it with Yuta. Is it the early hype you don’t like on some guys is that it? Sometimes some like to get caught in the wave. If they’re getting over then why not? If they fall further down then hopefully they are strong enough to overcome.

Hard to predict the future so I just enjoy it for what we have at the moment.

[Bert]

Always with the gay jokes. I barely even said anything about the show. "I like Jay White and love Danielle Kamela" wow how crazy and over the top.

I thought the whole "it's still the era of the Undisputed Elite and Bullet Club" thing was convoluted and Jay should have just said Bullet Club. There's so many people included in those 2 factions they should just have a match against each other anyway.

The finish to Darby/Andrade was rushed, most likely because Britt took too much time with her promo, I feel like she hasn't learned the art of making your opponents sound credible so that if you beat them it's a big deal. She always just makes them sound like nothing but jobbers so then if you beat a jobber who really cares?

Sammy is the worst so I'm glad they're turning him heel. I expect complaints of how him and Tay are doing an Edge/Lita gimmick because everything has to be compared to something before it.

Ethan Page should be TNT champ. The North was my favorite part of Impact before he left and I feel like I was one of the few people here excited when he was the PPV surprise for AEW. I see a lot more people on Reddit are at least starting to see what I saw him in a while ago so that's good.

Wardlow is a monster and I want a spot where he breaks the handcuffs.

[MTR]

I like Yuta. Work in progress for sure. But I like him. I like the buildup. Love BCC.

Looking forward to seeing Danhausen and Hook. Not going to be classic or anything. I am sure it will be entertaining and Hook will win.

[Nash Diesel]

But who’s been really overreacting to Yuta that badly? They’ve built a good story to him where he’s lost time and again but really earned his stripes IMO in the latest Moxley match.

Can understand it with people like Hook to a degree but don’t get it with Yuta. Is it the early hype you don’t like on some guys is that it? Sometimes some like to get caught in the wave. If they’re getting over then why not? If they fall further down then hopefully they are strong enough to overcome.

Hard to predict the future so I just enjoy it for what we have at the moment.

Do you want specific names? Do you watch the show? I'm being serious do you actually watch AEW?

Getting over in AEW is not something you can really gauge properly. Wheeler Yuta comes out to the same pop CM Punk comes out to and he comes out and it's the same pop that Toni Storm gets or the same pop Matt Hardy gets now. It's impossible. Go to an AEW show. It's very cultish. If you're not going along with the over the top reaction to someone they start looking at you like what the fuck man why aren't you going apeshit for Orange Cassidy? Why aren't you blowing up for Adam Page's title win bro!?!

Thank God most of the people are like Bert's dad who was in the front row last week holding up his lib signs lol. Bert why was your dad there and what the fuck is up with his haircut??

[Donald]

I've been reading Nash Diesel's posts in a Morgan Freeman voice all this time. Badger in a Jeremy Irons voice. Bert in a JBL voice.

[Badger]

I think Sammi was actually a very good face til Tay got more involved and they made heelish snarky jokes towards Lambert. Plus getting the TNT title shots/wins over and over again hasn’t done him any favours. The Bob Dylan thing with the cards (though I get it’s a tribute) has probably run it’s course too.

If he was more outspoken and helped fight more against heel Jericho like Eddie’s boys after Jericho told him to shut up, that would’ve helped his face heat too. Face Sammi vs Heel Jericho they’ve missed the boat on a bit here

[Bert]

Keith Lee and Swerve vs Starks and Hobbs is a feud that a lot of people are into. You don't have to be in the world title picture to be important. Not everyone can be the top guy at the same time. Dark Order was huge a year ago and now they've fallen down the card, which I'm sure you're thrilled about, but my point is there's a rotation. It's not like the same thing doesn't happen in WWE when they're not just doing 50/50 booking.

There was 0% chance Keith Lee was going to win the world title randomly on RAW so I don't know why you even bring it up. That was just as likely as Dante Martin beating Adam Page for the world title on Dynamite.

[Badger]

Do you want specific names? Do you watch the show? I'm being serious do you actually watch AEW?

Getting over in AEW is not something you can really gauge properly. Wheeler Yuta comes out to the same pop CM Punk comes out to and he comes out and it's the same pop that Toni Storm gets or the same pop Matt Hardy gets now. It's impossible. Go to an AEW show. It's very cultish. If you're not going along with the over the top reaction to someone they start looking at you like what the fuck man why aren't you going apeshit for Orange Cassidy? Why aren't you blowing up for Adam Page's title win bro!?!

Thank God most of the people are like Bert's dad who was in the front row last week holding up his lib signs lol. Bert why was your dad there and what the fuck is up with his haircut??

Watch Rampage and Dynamite every week bro. We just have differing opinions it seems like but doesn’t make any one of us less passionate or more correct than the other. I just don’t force my opinions the way you seem to. That’s what’s lovely about forum discourse. If everyone was the same, it’d be boring. All our own opinions.

[Badger]

I've been reading Nash Diesel's posts in a Morgan Freeman voice all this time. Badger in a Jeremy Irons voice. Bert in a JBL voice.

:lol:

[MTR]

I am over Sammi right now. Nothing against him still a fan but want him to move to something else away from the TNT title. Want some different people in the mix.

[Badger]

I am over Sammi right now. Nothing against him still a fan but want him to move to something else away from the TNT title. Want some different people in the mix.

Definitely needs some time away from the title. Him vs Jericho would’ve been hot and great right now.

[Nash Diesel]

Keith Lee and Swerve vs Starks and Hobbs is a feud that a lot of people are into. You don't have to be in the world title picture to be important. Not everyone can be the top guy at the same time. Dark Order was huge a year ago and now they've fallen down the card, which I'm sure you're thrilled about, but my point is there's a rotation. It's not like the same thing doesn't happen in WWE when they're not just doing 50/50 booking.

There was 0% chance Keith Lee was going to win the world title randomly on RAW so I don't know why you even bring it up. That was just as likely as Dante Martin beating Adam Page for the world title on Dynamite.

The fact you're comparing Keith Lee to a Dante Martin says it all. Of course I wouldn't expect Dante Martin to beat Adam Page.

Did I expect Keith Lee to beat Drew? Of course not. The fact he was in the mix from the jump spoke volumes. IDK it's kind of hard to respond to your comment when I'm going to be stuck on you thinking Keith Lee=Dante Martin. Dark Order? How many more terrible examples are you going to use to compare how Keith Lee is being used in AEW compared to how he was being used in WWE.

[Nash Diesel]

Watch Rampage and Dynamite every week bro. We just have differing opinions it seems like but doesn’t make any one of us less passionate or more correct than the other. I just don’t force my opinions the way you seem to. That’s what’s lovely about forum discourse. If everyone was the same, it’d be boring. All our own opinions.

100000% correct. All our own opinions. Nobody is forcing anything. You can choose to respond or you can wait for the next topic. You in general not necessarily you BADGER.

I'm simply asking if you actually watch because the questions and the assumptions directed toward my comments makes me wonder if you're following along. If you are great, it confuses me even more but like you said, it's the lovely upside to a forum.

[VHS]

I've been reading Nash Diesel's posts in a Morgan Freeman voice all this time. Badger in a Jeremy Irons voice. Bert in a JBL voice.

I've always read his posts in Microsoft Sam's voice.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMiETyY_7xA

Zavier :lol:

[Donald]

I feel like AEW's roster has to be bigger than WWE's by now. They should make Dynamite 3 hours and Rampage 2 hours, and get rid of one of the Dark shows.

[Badger]

100000% correct. All our own opinions. Nobody is forcing anything. You can choose to respond or you can wait for the next topic. You in general not necessarily you BADGER.

I'm simply asking if you actually watch because the questions and the assumptions directed toward my comments makes me wonder if you're following along. If you are great, it confuses me even more but like you said, it's the lovely upside to a forum.

I follow and understand plenty what you have said, I just don’t always agree with it. I just don’t always agree with it or make ridiculous superlative statements like “Oh making the fans having a coming to Jesus moment” or “I’m doing the wrestling Gods a favour….”

[Ringo]

Dustin/Punk was terrific. Expect the early going may have been a bit slow for some but I liked the way it gradually built to the finish. Dustin's starting to creek but he's still a master. Punk seemed to be absolutely made up that he got to wrestle Dustin. Post-match was great, what a treat. Nice stare down with Hangman.

BCC stuff continues to deliver. Loving Yuta's new gear, it was needed. Moriarty's the obvious choice for the next BCC inductee so it was neat to see him in there (but I like the idea that they're keeping you guessing, as both Dante Martin and Brock Anderson could be candidates) but I'd like to see a more gradual build with him as he eventually proves himself worthy.

Adam Cole interrupting the announcement was weird. Man ruins everything. Should really have just slotted that in as a taped promo later in the show. All Ishii on Friday. Jay White needs to be more a creepy loner than just one of the Bullet Club/Elite lads. Still, what they've announced is cool. Trying to fantasy book this PPV in my head but it's tricky. Do you do Okada/Danielson here? Punk/KENTA? Ibushi and Omega will be back healthy by then. Do you do something with those two together? So many possibilities!

Dax vs. Cash. Ho. Ly. Shit.

[MTR]

I would like to see Okada vs. Punk and not a bad place to do it since Chicago. However I think I want to see KENTA/Punk here and Okada/Danielson or Okada/Moxley. Maybe do Okada/Moxley and let Danielson go to G1 and there is a chance we get that match there. Lots of matches that can be done here. I wish I had an idea of ticket cost. That will make me make up my mind on going or not.

[Defrost]

I am thinking Okada vs Mox is the main event. Mox vs Tanahashi happens in a few weeks at a show Okada will be on.

[Bert]

I've always read his posts in Microsoft Sam's voice.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMiETyY_7xA

Zavier :lol:

Make him say soi soi soi.

https://youtube.com/shorts/S_vNhLYW_e4

[Nash Diesel]

I follow and understand plenty what you have said, I just don’t always agree with it. I just don’t always agree with it or make ridiculous superlative statements like “Oh making the fans having a coming to Jesus moment” or “I’m doing the wrestling Gods a favour….”

Well it sounds better than "Hey guys let's just let everything I like play out to how I hope it will and if it doesn't oh well gee wiz"

[Nash Diesel]

I've always read his posts in Microsoft Sam's voice.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMiETyY_7xA

Zavier :lol:

The last person I saw this obsessed with someone they locked them in Arkham.

No I will not make out with you.

[Badger]

Well it sounds better than "Hey guys let's just let everything I like play out to how I hope it will and if it doesn't oh well gee wiz"

Well positivity mate gee whiz! Haven’t you also said in other threads that people jump on shit too negatively too quickly? ;)

[MTR]

I am thinking Okada vs Mox is the main event. Mox vs Tanahashi happens in a few weeks at a show Okada will be on.

Yeah i wouldn't be surprised they go this way with Mox taking on Tanahashi in DC

[Nash Diesel]

Well positivity mate gee whiz! Haven’t you also said in other threads that people jump on shit too negatively too quickly? ;)

I guess it depends on what we're talking about. Right now we're talking about Wheeler Yuta. If you want to talk about what I've said in other threads direct me to those comments and we can go from there. Sadly I don't really keep track of everything I say but shout out to those of you who do I appreciate you taking care of this old man.

Maybe don't jump on something so quickly and champion it is as great before it has time to actually cultivate and matter. Maybe we don't just assume someone was made because they bled in a match. Wow. Captivating.

[VHS]

The last person I saw this obsessed with someone they locked them in Arkham.

No I will not make out with you.

Hot sauce is the best.

[Nash Diesel]

If this is going to be NJPW v. AEW why not have Okada v. Page? Isn't Okada the World champion now? Or would they each defend? Or do they plan on Page dropping the title BEFORE the ppv to CM Punk or Wheeler Yuta and then we get something actually worth ordering?

[Defrost]

If this is going to be NJPW v. AEW why not have Okada v. Page? Isn't Okada the World champion now? Or would they each defend? Or do they plan on Page dropping the title BEFORE the ppv to CM Punk or Wheeler Yuta and then we get something actually worth ordering?

They are not going to do champion vs champion because someone would have to lose

[MTR]

Yeah I don't seem them doing any champion vs champion matches.

[MTR]

Might even get some big tag matches to get more people on the card.

[Badger]

I guess it depends on what we're talking about. Right now we're talking about Wheeler Yuta. If you want to talk about what I've said in other threads direct me to those comments and we can go from there. Sadly I don't really keep track of everything I say but shout out to those of you who do I appreciate you taking care of this old man.

Maybe don't jump on something so quickly and champion it is as great before it has time to actually cultivate and matter. Maybe we don't just assume someone was made because they bled in a match. Wow. Captivating.

Again I’ve previously said I don’t have great history about Yuta but seems like at this time, they’ve not done a bad job at booking him as far as this goes. I’m not too bothered about other threads but what they’re doing with him here and now at the moment is good to me.

You haven’t done much to prove your point other than say “fans be crazy” without much evidence. If you can provide more concrete evidence as to why we shouldn’t jump on the current Yuta wagon then by all means go ahead but not gonna look up stuff just because you say he’s shit.

[Badger]

Even if a comedy character in the past which I don’t know, the fact they’re giving him this much exposure, spilling blood and seals of approval from the likes of Regal now must mean he’s doing something right. Not everyone gets that type of push for nothing.

[BGMaverick]

They are not going to do champion vs champion because someone would have to lose

They can but it doesn't have to be THE WORLDS BIGGEST UNIFICATION match. You can have a match between champions just to see who is better. They don't have to but doesn't mean they won't go down that road.

[Defrost]

They can but it doesn't have to be THE WORLDS BIGGEST UNIFICATION match. You can have a match between champions just to see who is better. They don't have to but doesn't mean they won't go down that road.

This show is gonna be very political, Neither champion is losing.

[BGMaverick]

This show is gonna be very political, Neither champion is losing.

Even so, NJPW doesn't really seem like they're in a position of strength here.

[Nash Diesel]

New Japan are no doubt the ones holding all the cards. Once again someone treating New Japan as the redheaded step child when it's everyone else dying to work with them.
Defrost I think you're right.

[Nash Diesel]

Even if a comedy character in the past which I don’t know, the fact they’re giving him this much exposure, spilling blood and seals of approval from the likes of Regal now must mean he’s doing something right. Not everyone gets that type of push for nothing.

I mean I hate to be the asshole here but last I checked wrestling was scripted.

What I truly believe is happening here and this could just be me but they're taking a guy who was 1 notch above Marko Stunt and trying to prove they can make anyone into a "star". I'll be honest....I have no idea if Yuta is a comedy wrestler like Santino. He's comedy in the sense that anyone in their right fucking mind would buy into this.

But again...wrestling is scripted. Rey Mysterio Jr beat Mark Henry why can't Wheeler Yuta beat Billy Gunn?

[Badger]

I mean I hate to be the asshole here but last I checked wrestling was scripted.

What I truly believe is happening here and this could just be me but they're taking a guy who was 1 notch above Marko Stunt and trying to prove they can make anyone into a "star". I'll be honest....I have no idea if Yuta is a comedy wrestler like Santino. He's comedy in the sense that anyone in their right fucking mind would buy into this.

But again...wrestling is scripted. Rey Mysterio Jr beat Mark Henry why can't Wheeler Yuta beat Billy Gunn?

Marko Stunt comparison I think is a bit harsh. He’s not THAT small where it’s unbelievable where he takes the fight to another guy. Marko’s in a league of his own there.

Fair play I haven’t seen that Yuta/Gunn match. I can only guess if Yuta lost, might have been a “pay your dues” kinda deal. Rey is a legend and fairly beefed up unlike Marko so that’s more believable IMO that he can beat big giants like Henry. Suspension of disbelief is required in these things and can give it more to Rey than someone like Marko.

What I’ve seen on Dynamite/Rampage though is that they seem to be impressed with what he’s done which is why they had him go through all that shit/blood with Mox and had him join the Combat club so that’s why me personally I’m hyped and hope this leads to bigger things for him rather than look back on past results.

[Bert]

Yuta had to tap into his aggressive side in order to have a competitive match against Moxley. That was the story over 3 matches.

[Nash Diesel]

Marko Stunt comparison I think is a bit harsh. He’s not THAT small where it’s unbelievable where he takes the fight to another guy. Marko’s in a league of his own there.

Fair play I haven’t seen that Yuta/Gunn match. I can only guess if Yuta lost, might have been a “pay your dues” kinda deal. Rey is a legend and fairly beefed up unlike Marko so that’s more believable IMO that he can beat big giants like Henry. Suspension of disbelief is required in these things and can give it more to Rey than someone like Marko.

What I’ve seen on Dynamite/Rampage though is that they seem to be impressed with what he’s done which is why they had him go through all that shit/blood with Mox and had him join the Combat club so that’s why me personally I’m hyped and hope this leads to bigger things for him rather than look back on past results.

I wasn't meaning size I was meaning in terms of credible people, jobbers, Wheeler was pretty much Best Friends' Marko Stunt. I didn't realize someone could look and suck more than Chuck Taylor but Wheeler filled in for "Trent" and here we are.

You watch Dynamite/Rampage every week but you missed that match? Maybe that's the disconnect. You're only speaking on what you've supposedly seen whereas I'm going off what I have actually seen and what has actually happened, not just assumptions.

I think people should take into consideration where someone comes from. How are you going to talk about being impressed with how they're booking him and yet you don't watch his matches, you don't pay attention to what he's done-which is important in selling his evolution as a bum fuck to a supposed killer because he bled.

It's funny the guy got squashed by Moxley when he didn't matter but now they're pushing him and he can go 10-20 with Danielson and Moxley all the sudden lol. But hey it's a suspension of disbelief. If I can believe homegirl from Pitch Perfect can ride with Hawkeye, I can maybe buy into Wheeler Yuta being guys like Moxley and Danielson who have already done jobs for world beaters like Elias and Drew Gulak.

[Badger]

Yuta had to tap into his aggressive side in order to have a competitive match against Moxley. That was the story over 3 matches.

And a story they’ve built very well. :yes:

A little bit like Del Fuego/Miro in a way IMO but much better and Yuta is clearly going places. He got the winning pin in the Trios match against the Gunn club. He’s gone through the wringer and doing something right.

[Badger]

I wasn't meaning size I was meaning in terms of credible people, jobbers, Wheeler was pretty much Best Friends' Marko Stunt. I didn't realize someone could look and suck more than Chuck Taylor but Wheeler filled in for "Trent" and here we are.

You watch Dynamite/Rampage every week but you missed that match? Maybe that's the disconnect. You're only speaking on what you've supposedly seen whereas I'm going off what I have actually seen and what has actually happened, not just assumptions.

I think people should take into consideration where someone comes from. How are you going to talk about being impressed with how they're booking him and yet you don't watch his matches, you don't pay attention to what he's done-which is important in selling his evolution as a bum fuck to a supposed killer because he bled.

It's funny the guy got squashed by Moxley when he didn't matter but now they're pushing him and he can go 10-20 with Danielson and Moxley all the sudden lol. But hey it's a suspension of disbelief. If I can believe homegirl from Pitch Perfect can ride with Hawkeye, I can maybe buy into Wheeler Yuta being guys like Moxley and Danielson who have already done jobs for world beaters like Elias and Drew Gulak.

Yeah I can’t remember that Gunn match so fair play to you there. Maybe had more impact on you but they seem to have moved on so not hung up on it. Possibly a “paying your dues” deal.

I’ll just leave this as maybe don’t watch as much/analyse as much of the AEW product as much as you maybe do but still watch it regularly as far as Yuta goes anyway, I like what I see and maybe give him a chance to breathe rather than squash other fans preconceptions right away and enjoying the wave. I don’t think he was ever portrayed as unbelievable as Marko Stunt but if you feel differently then fair enough.

Just gonna agree to disagree here.

[Bert]

https://www.cagematch.net/?id=2&nr=19733&page=4

Where's this Billy Gunn match? The only match with Billy Gunn I see is the one with BCC vs Gunn Club.

[Morrison]

Even so, NJPW doesn't really seem like they're in a position of strength here.

which is exactly why they wouldn't be willing to put their champions in losing positions on this high profile show. there's no benefit for either company to do champion vs champion matches just for the fuck of it.

[Bert]

Kenta has said he wants Punk.

[Badger]

https://www.cagematch.net/?id=2&nr=19733&page=4

Where's this Billy Gunn match? The only match with Billy Gunn I see is the one with BCC vs Gunn Club.

Which Yuta got the winning pinfall for.

Shock horror Nash looking to be speaking shite unless there’s Youtube/other video evidence of Gunn beating him. Even if it does exist…so what? Hardcore Holly beat Punk once and look who is more relevant now? Seemingly one-off odd results don’t define a career path. Things can change and people can get over.

[Bert]

Cagematch has all of the matches from Dark and Dark Elevation, which I don't think Nash even watches.

They definitely have every match from Dynamite and Rampage listed.

Nash makes shit up in shocker of the year.

[Badger]

Probably should refresh my memory over FTR comedy wrestling as well because I’m getting old.

[Bert]

The only thing close to comedy FTR have done in AEW was the beer stuff with Hangman/Omega where they tried to get Omega to drink and poured the beer on him. I also wouldn't really count that, it was part of the story.

[Badger]

The only thing close to comedy FTR have done in AEW was the beer stuff with Hangman/Omega where they tried to get Omega to drink and poured the beer on him. I also wouldn't really count that, it was part of the story.

I swear it was the two teams ching-chinging and holding up Marko Stunt and Yuta but hey…I don’t watch as much as he does could be wrong there.

[Nash Diesel]

I don't mean to break up your little back and forth here but I am talking about the 6-man tag. I apologize I didn't specify that but Wheeler pinned Billy Gunn. It was horrifying. Had it been a comedy match I would've wrote it off like I did when James Ellsworth beat AJ Styles. This....Props to Billy Gunn still willing to put over a young guy.

[Badger]

You literally said this though Nash that why Yuta couldn’t beat Gunn when the singles match did not exist and in that six-man tag, guess what….YUTA got the pin!

You are the Rajah version of Cartman and not meaning that in a complimentary way. Whenever someone disagrees or disproves you in any way sort of form on anything, any opinion, you do these mental gymnastics to convince yourself and others you are right even if everyone else knows you are talking shit.

You cannot back down on anything or say “Okay maybe a good point there!” That’s why you catch so much heat but not like you give a shit right?

[Nash Diesel]

You literally said this though Nash that why Yuta couldn’t beat Gunn when the singles match did not exist and in that six-man tag, guess what….YUTA got the pin!

You are the Rajah version of Cartman and not meaning that in a complimentary way. Whenever someone disagrees or disproves you in any way sort of form on anything, any opinion, you do these mental gymnastics to convince yourself and others you are right even if everyone else knows you are talking shit.

You cannot back down on anything or say “Okay maybe a good point there!” That’s why you catch so much heat but not like you give a shit right?

Nowhere in there did I say that Wheeler Yuta and Billy Gunn had a singles match. It was a bad comparison but I was using size this time. Since wrestling is scripted, someone as tiny and frail as Yuta beating Gunn in that 6 man tag was no different than Rey Mysterio beating Mark Henry (although IDK if Rey ever PINNED Mark).

I think you need to sign off, it's what 3am. I can already hear Tonic playing in the background.

[Nash Diesel]

You say I don't sit back and see someone else's side yet there I was saying that you know what, wrestling is scripted so it's not that big of a deal that Yuta beat Billy Gunn. I even praised Billy Gunn for being the one to job and not one of his sons. If it had been one of the sons, WAYYY more believable for Yuta to get that pin. The guy did I think 3 moves to Gunn and that was it lol.

So please, calm yourself, put down the iphone and get some rest Badger. You're not good at this and pairing up with the resident Proud Boy for moral support is a really bad look for you lad.

[Badger]

Nowhere in there did I say that Wheeler Yuta and Billy Gunn had a singles match. It was a bad comparison but I was using size this time. Since wrestling is scripted, someone as tiny and frail as Yuta beating Gunn in that 6 man tag was no different than Rey Mysterio beating Mark Henry (although IDK if Rey ever PINNED Mark).

I think you need to sign off, it's what 3am. I can already hear Tonic playing in the background.

Pedantics and Cartman mental gymnastics. You tried to cite an example and said horseshit about why Yuta can’t beat Gunn yet in that 6-man tag the Gunn Club lost!

You can’t just admit to wrongdoing on anything.

[BGMaverick]

which is exactly why they wouldn't be willing to put their champions in losing positions on this high profile show. there's no benefit for either company to do champion vs champion matches just for the fuck of it.

That’s fair. I just don’t think it’s out of the realm of possibilities, is all. The other route is having champions against high profile guys from the other company in competitive matches that you know will see the champ win. There’s nothing wrong with that if the match is great (and there’s notable talent that can easily take the fall and be fine regardless), but you do have the chance to have some unpredictability there that’s agreed upon by both sides with the champion vs champion matches.

[Ringo]

I love Dan Lambert so much. His face when Scorpio and Page were talking :lol: Really enjoyed that whole segment actually, properly funny. Sammy & Tay should be a great heel duo.

[Ringo]

https://i.ibb.co/BfdXy5q/kcp.jpg (https://ibb.co/b6qSsMz)

[Tainted Eclipse]

I do want to see KENTA vs. Punk eventually just for the novelty of GTS vs. GTS. But it seems like a weak matchup for this show, unless they have a couple Okada/Danielson-level dream matches to carry it.

[Psycho666Soldier]

What's weak about KENTA/Punk? That match has literally been fantasized for years. Okada/Danielson might have better work rate, but KENTA/Punk as the first(and only) match announced not even a week after the show announcement seems like a pretty big deal.

[Tainted Eclipse]

I just don’t think it’ll end up being very good because Kenta hasn’t been very good since his new Japan comeback

[Psycho666Soldier]

That's fair. I haven't seen anything since last year's WK, so I don't really know what his quality's at. On paper, it's dope as fuck, but I get it not being quite enough for you on its own.

[VHS]

Am I alone in saying Kenta is kinda overrated? Eh? :dunno:

[Peter Griffin]

Let's fight forever :panic:

[Nash Diesel]

I just don’t think it’ll end up being very good because Kenta hasn’t been very good since his new Japan comeback

And CM Punk has?
VHS If this were 2010 or earlier I would say yes. I think he was checked out about 2 years prior to signing with NXT. I'm not slighting the guy I enjoy his matches and his heel personality but this is not the same KENTA I first saw way back teaming with Kobashi, fighting Prince Devitt, fighting Marufuji, but that's age and fighting that strong style as a JHW.

[Nash Diesel]

I would not be negative to El Desperado v. Sammy Guevara but if they're not going to do champ v. champ that won't happen.

Me personally I would rather see Okada v. Danielson. They've never fought to my knowledge and with Danielson not being in the title mix at the moment he's someone that could take that L and not be totally fucked.

There's going to have to be some flexibility here. New Japan isn't coming in to make AEW look good and vice versa. I don't see this harvesting any type of fan v. fan situation as I think most of us enjoy both promotions and don't mind seeing certain people take the loss.

[BGMaverick]

Some of the fantasy components to these pairings can probably be alleviated with the G1 so I'm not hard pressed to pin my hopes to a lot of specific matches having to happen at this show.

[Defrost]

Am I alone in saying Kenta is kinda overrated? Eh? :dunno:

He is literally my favorite wrestler ever so now I must challenge you to a dual

[VHS]

And CM Punk has?
@VHS (https://forums.rajah.com/member.php?u=36173) If this were 2010 or earlier I would say yes. I think he was checked out about 2 years prior to signing with NXT. I'm not slighting the guy I enjoy his matches and his heel personality but this is not the same KENTA I first saw way back teaming with Kobashi, fighting Prince Devitt, fighting Marufuji, but that's age and fighting that strong style as a JHW.

Ok. Yeah, sadly my first experience w/ Kenta was when he debuted in NXT and even then he was fine, but just wasn't earth shattering to me. His misery in NXT was apparent and so him returning to NJPW excited news. But he's just never held my attention. Stoked to see him against Punk, but it's really just going to be about the GTS vs. GTS.


He is literally my favorite wrestler ever so now I must challenge you to a dual


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36URL2UaE8c

[Bert]

https://youtu.be/VjU6CHUDh1k

Very short video but I'm loving Daniel Garcia and how he's going all in on this sports entertainer gimmick. Meltzer says he was pitched for BCC but Jericho hand picked him for JAS. His delivery of "if you're saying you're a sports entertainer...than I am too" was so good.

[Defrost]

Voices of Wrestling is saying the rumored main event of Forbidden Door is Kazuchika Okada vs CM Punk

[Mazer]

Hook should be smart enough to know that curses aren't real and just murder Danhausen

Curses aren't real? Tell that to Samuel L. Jackson, Sheamus, and Christina Ricci

[Bert]

Voices of Wrestling is saying the rumored main event of Forbidden Door is Kazuchika Okada vs CM Punk

Is that just rumored because Punk gave out his "address" before to Okada?

[MTR]

I mean I would like to see that match and I know Okada said he would like to do it and Punk tweeted out the address to the Chicago Center but to me it would seem like you go with Mox/Okada here for the reasons people have already stated. Punk/KENTA is a good match to do here. If there is another crossover show in the future or whatever there will be chances to do Okada/Punk. I guess we shall see.

[Defrost]

Is that just rumored because Punk gave out his "address" before to Okada?

I think they heard it from someone. It was their podcast network that broke the story on the show happening.

[Bert]

Fightful Select has learned that Top Flight member Darius Martin sustained a leg injury fairly recently and is sidelined from action. We’ve reached out to Darius and AEW for more, but can confirm that he will be replaced on this weekend’s Warrior Wrestling show.

Those that we’ve spoken to expect Martin to miss a lengthy period in the ring again. The situation is a heartbreaker, as Darius only recently returned from a torn ACL that left him out of action for over a year. Martin was able to work 11 matches during his latest run. He and his brother Dante went 6-1 since reuniting as a team.”

That explains why Dante was in that six man tag. That sucks.

[MTR]

That sucks for him. He just got back.

[Nash Diesel]

They were quick to bury Dante so they must really like Darius.

[Morrison]

Some of the fantasy components to these pairings can probably be alleviated with the G1 so I'm not hard pressed to pin my hopes to a lot of specific matches having to happen at this show.

i doubt there will be many big AEW names in the g1, unless they did an american block and a japanese block. AEW isn't going to send danielson, mox, punk, hangman, whoever else over to japan for an entire month away from weekly AEW tv, especially with it being the lead up to all out. ya might get danielson, but i wouldn't expect anybody else from the top of the card.

[BGMaverick]

i doubt there will be many big AEW names in the g1, unless they did an american block and a japanese block. AEW isn't going to send danielson, mox, punk, hangman, whoever else over to japan for an entire month away from weekly AEW tv, especially with it being the lead up to all out. ya might get danielson, but i wouldn't expect anybody else from the top of the card.

yeah, that's fine lol. the whole group doesn't have to go. I just said some. Could be 1-2 and that's fine.

[MTR]

I am guessing Danielson will go and maybe Yuta and maybe another person. I can't see Mox or Punk going. Mox has done it and I am not sure Punk is quite back to where he would like fitness-wise to do a G1. If Hangman is still champ they are not sending him. Even if he is not I can't see them sending him. Just my thoughts. Who knows if they end up sending anyone honestly. I just want to see Danielson go.

[Morrison]

yeah, that's fine lol. the whole group doesn't have to go. I just said some. Could be 1-2 and that's fine.

so then there isn't much being alleviated as far as dream matches.

[BGMaverick]

so then there isn't much being alleviated as far as dream matches.

I don’t know? If two guys go and they’re in different blocks, that’s a lot of matchups to burn through.

[Nash Diesel]

I am guessing Danielson will go and maybe Yuta and maybe another person. I can't see Mox or Punk going. Mox has done it and I am not sure Punk is quite back to where he would like fitness-wise to do a G1. If Hangman is still champ they are not sending him. Even if he is not I can't see them sending him. Just my thoughts. Who knows if they end up sending anyone honestly. I just want to see Danielson go.

You said this just to piss me off and I can appreciate that.

Just kidding. I think Yuta is going to be the next Juice Robinson.

[Bert]

HOOK spoke. 11/10.

[BGMaverick]

Good one between Cole and Ishii. White’s interference now presents the second time where he’s tangled up with Cassidy indirectly. That would be a fun one.

[Ringo]

https://youtu.be/7CbZQpmacJI

Not sure if this has been posted in here before but it's so well done. Great retrospective of a top tier modern wrestling feud. I could definitely see Punk beating Hangman only to lose the title to MJF later this year.

[VHS]

Caught Jade/Shafir and man... big fan of both, but man... both just ain't ready yet. Jade always has this look on her face after her matches like she's just happy it's over.

[Fanny Batter]

Fluidity between NJPW and AEW would be awesome. Relationship has been a bit one sided so far, admittedly half to do with quarantine in Japan. You feel they could do with an injection of top AEW names on their big cards, and likewise increased interest in NJPW would lead to the crossovers in AEW feeling like a bigger deal. As wrestling fans, Okada, Tanahashi, Naito, Shingo, Sabre Jr and Ibushi mixing it with Omega (again), Danielson, Punk, Hangman, Moxley and Joe would be huge. Personally I'd go:

AEW Title: Punk (c) vs. White
IWGP Title: Okada (c) vs. Danielson
Tanahashi vs. Moxley
LIJ (Andrade as La Sombra replacing Sanada) vs. Super Elite

Punk, Okada, Moxley and LIJ winning the relevant matches so they go 2-2.

[Tainted Eclipse]

I'm no Jay White fan so don't want to see him in that prominent a match, but Okada over Danielson and the AEW champ vs. a New Japan guy as the top two matches seems clearly the way to go. Maybe Punk/Tanahashi with Mox/Tanahashi already happening in May.

[Dreyski]

That explains why Dante was in that six man tag. That sucks.

Yeah it seems to be a thing where you (sub)consciously favour the uninjured side and consequently place more stress on it. Something similar happened to Chris Sabin several years back. Hope Darius makes a full recovery.

[Ringo]

Nice video on Dustin/Punk from Joseph Montecillo, who does a load of neat video essays about wrestling.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxMCf2serhU

[Bert]

Takeshita vs Cutler on Dark Elevation tonight

[MTR]

https://youtu.be/ZhScqwyaELg

Here is the Danhausen match from this weekend. Shouldn't be long and he will be in the ring for AEW.

[Nash Diesel]

In the words of Jim Cornette

What kind of outlaw mudshow is that?? The fuckin ropes....Or around the 10:45 mark the dude does a backflip and misses Jobhausen by about 6 inches.

[VHS]

I honestly thought Danblousand was just a character and not a wrestler. Never seen him wrestle until now.

edit. Eek, his offense though.

[Bert]

https://youtu.be/IuWk5VecT5w

[Nash Diesel]

I honestly thought Danblousand was just a character and not a wrestler. Never seen him wrestle until now.

edit. Eek, his offense though.

Yeah he's someone that should never see anything bigger than the lower card. Tease it a little but the guy is just too weird and ridiculous.

Watch....He'll sign with WWE, lose the weird late night horror movie host act and be a big star as himself lol.

[Donald]

Jobhausand, Dabblousand. Danhausbland? I've only ever seen him point at people so I can't say how I feel. At least he looks more menacing than Hook.

[VHS]

Jobhausand, Dabblousand. Danhausbland? I've only ever seen him point at people so I can't say how I feel. At least he looks more menacing than Hook.

Hook genuinely scares me. Definitely not someone I’d talk smack to in person.

[MTR]

In the words of Jim Cornette

What kind of outlaw mudshow is that?? The fuckin ropes....Or around the 10:45 mark the dude does a backflip and misses Jobhausen by about 6 inches.

They ropes were a mess. They finally came out and tightened them up before the Suzuki match and main event. They should have fixed them way before that. Dante Martin almost fell trying to do his finisher in his three way match. After they tightened them up they were good for the last two matches that of course didn't have any high flying people in them....

[MTR]

The tag match was entertaining for what it was honestly. The ropes did take away from it at times and they guys had to make do. I had never see Grindhouse before. Not a bad team. I really enjoyed the match and it was fun live especially with the antics of the manager and the lawyer who was with Danhausen and Dan the Dad. That was a big part of the story. Danhausen had nailed the manager in the nuts a couple months ago at a show so he was looking for revenge. The lawyer they used is all over social media here in St. Louis and is well known locally and the manager is actually a radio personality here in St. Louis as well besides being a wrestling manager. 6 1/2 stars for entertainment value. 7 if it was in the Tokyo Dome....

He didn't actually miss Danhausen. I was on that side of the ring and could see it. He didn't hit him square on though and Danhausen sold it like it was a big hit. Probably not the best idea but I see why he did it. It was supposed to be a big hit to keep him down leading up to the hot tag.

It was an indy show and the matches are not all going to be WWE, AEW, NJPW level stuff but there was some good matches and honestly some goofy fun stuff. Loved the atmosphere and the wrestlers really interacting with the crowd. Definitely going back. Eddie Kingston is booked against Davey Richards at the next show.

[Mazer]

Yeah he's someone that should never see anything bigger than the lower card. Tease it a little but the guy is just too weird and ridiculous.

Watch....He'll sign with WWE, lose the weird late night horror movie host act and be a big star as himself lol.

Why would he lose the horror act when he can star in the eventual NXT spin-off-NXT:UP All Night with Kelly Kelly and Danhausen?

[MTR]

Yeah he's someone that should never see anything bigger than the lower card. Tease it a little but the guy is just too weird and ridiculous.

Watch....He'll sign with WWE, lose the weird late night horror movie host act and be a big star as himself lol.

I have seen other matches via youtube. he is not bad in the ring. He is not great either. He is pretty average. His character is what gets him over with the internet crowd and everyone else. Yeah he is not a main event guy and that is okay. Being lower card is fine. The character is over and the fact that he stays in character almost all of the time is fun. I saw part of a podcast he did out of character which is rare and yeah he was not getting anywhere on the indy's just being a regular tough guy or whatever. He would wrestle Gargano or Richochet. or someone like that somewhere and have a good match but then not get booked again for a while. It wasn't until he created this character that he really was able to start doing wrestling full time and getting booked all over the place and even that took a while as he tweeked it as he went.

Personally I love the character and it is fun to watch him and his antics. That is what I love about pro-wrestling. I can be entertained by people like Danhausen in on way and I can really enjoy an awesome wrestling match by main event talents that are excellent in the ring. I like the overall package of shows that have a mix of stuff. I get that some people hate the comedy type stuff and to each their own. I love it as much as I like the rest.

[Nash Diesel]

I have seen other matches via youtube. he is not bad in the ring. He is not great either. He is pretty average. His character is what gets him over with the internet crowd and everyone else. Yeah he is not a main event guy and that is okay. Being lower card is fine. The character is over and the fact that he stays in character almost all of the time is fun. I saw part of a podcast he did out of character which is rare and yeah he was not getting anywhere on the indy's just being a regular tough guy or whatever. He would wrestle Gargano or Richochet. or someone like that somewhere and have a good match but then not get booked again for a while. It wasn't until he created this character that he really was able to start doing wrestling full time and getting booked all over the place and even that took a while as he tweeked it as he went.

Personally I love the character and it is fun to watch him and his antics. That is what I love about pro-wrestling. I can be entertained by people like Danhausen in on way and I can really enjoy an awesome wrestling match by main event talents that are excellent in the ring. I like the overall package of shows that have a mix of stuff. I get that some people hate the comedy type stuff and to each their own. I love it as much as I like the rest.

There are levels to being over. El Generico was over. He wasn't more over than Sami Zayn.

Trying to compare what someone was like on the indies versus what someone would be like in the WWE...that's apples and oranges. Which is why I used the Sami/Generico example. Danhausen is a lower card talent with that gimmick, it's just how it is. Go back to late 94, Doink and his minis were getting some really good pops. They were also squashed at Survivor Series. One could say Doink and Dink were pretty over. Nobody was looking at them as the next Mania main event.

Who said they hate comedy stuff? Not all comedy is good right? It's all subjective. There's stupid idiotic stuff like Hornswoggle that I'm sure plenty of people were dying laughing watching him and El Tortito doing their thing. I'm a big Santino fan. LOVED the guy. Always thought he had the right balance to make a comedy character work.

Just because I don't think Danhausen is someone who should be main eventing doesn't mean I or others for that matter dislike comedy type stuff.

[MTR]

Sorry I was not saying you don't like comedy stuff specifically. You are right things are subjective and some stuff is funny to some and not others. I was just talking in general about comedy stuff and people being over and where they fit in the card. I don't disagree about where he stands. He is not main event material. He has a gimmick that got him to a great place on the indies that got him to ROH and now to AEW. I will say I can't see him trying something different at this point. This is what got him to where he is at. Other things didn't work. It wasn't natural to him and he just couldn't get where he wanted with things until he created this character. Like you said people can be over but that doesn't make them main eventers. Santino was fantastic. Loved him back in the day.

Santino may be one of the few people we agree on. lol. Me and you seem to have different tastes in who we like in this business. I just don't rag so hard about the people I don't like *coughexcaliburcoughyutacough* ;)

[Nash Diesel]

I actually think we have a lot more in common than you think.

My comment about Dan and WWE was just an off the cuff remark as it pertains to how people think he's over now, watch him shed all this ala El Generico and wind up a huge star as himself ala "Sami Zayn". Maybe not so much himself but not this super over the top gimmick that would limit any chance he has of elevating. IF that's his intention. He might be totally fine with getting a fat check in AEW doing what works in that bubble.

I would also like to point out that whatever he was going prior to Danhausen, it didn't happen in the WWE. He didn't have the guidance. Listen to some of these mugs like Kevin Owens, Adam Cole, the praise they have for what the WWE has done for their careers and showing them that despite being 10-15 years on the indies, the indies aren't the end all be all. Neither is the WWE but again, my comment was more of just an off the cuff remark.

[Badger]

Santino was quite versatile as a worker, and not just a comedy guy. Possibly more than given credit for. He beat Umaga on his debut for a shock upset, worked good matches and pushed the likes of Bryan and Del Rio to make fans believe. Did good comedy shit with Austin and even Santina. It’s a shame he’s not around in WWE today as either way he could’ve been pushed either way.

The Hook/Danhausen stuff, yeah it is very silly and personal opinion whether fans eat it up or not but regardless Dan is drawing more attention to Hook and made him speak as soon as he messed with the Lays. Not gonna be everyone’s cup of tea but either way Hook will likely be pushed as a badass and Danhausen is helping. He could do the same for others. Comedy is very subjective especially in wrestling and not everyone will be a fan of it but Dan IMO doing his job very well so far.

[MTR]

I actually think we have a lot more in common than you think.

My comment about Dan and WWE was just an off the cuff remark as it pertains to how people think he's over now, watch him shed all this ala El Generico and wind up a huge star as himself ala "Sami Zayn". Maybe not so much himself but not this super over the top gimmick that would limit any chance he has of elevating. IF that's his intention. He might be totally fine with getting a fat check in AEW doing what works in that bubble.

I would also like to point out that whatever he was going prior to Danhausen, it didn't happen in the WWE. He didn't have the guidance. Listen to some of these mugs like Kevin Owens, Adam Cole, the praise they have for what the WWE has done for their careers and showing them that despite being 10-15 years on the indies, the indies aren't the end all be all. Neither is the WWE but again, my comment was more of just an off the cuff remark.

Fair point about the guidance. He didn't have that like he would have working WWE and performance center and what not. I just remember him saying what he was doing wasn't natural and wasn't working so it didn't matter if he had a good match or not when it came to reactions and bookings. Not sure if he has any thoughts about wanting to do more or not. Seems pretty happy doing what he is doing. He is doing well for himself so if you are happy and making all the monies why rock the boat. lol

You are right we probably like more of the same than not. :)

[MTR]

Ethan Page had some backstage footage and footage of his appearance at the Glory Pro show on his vlog. He was a surprise. He flew in and flew out the same day after getting the call on Saturday asking him to be there Sunday.

[Nash Diesel]

Santino was quite versatile as a worker, and not just a comedy guy. Possibly more than given credit for. He beat Umaga on his debut for a shock upset, worked good matches and pushed the likes of Bryan and Del Rio to make fans believe. Did good comedy shit with Austin and even Santina. It’s a shame he’s not around in WWE today as either way he could’ve been pushed either way.

The Hook/Danhausen stuff, yeah it is very silly and personal opinion whether fans eat it up or not but regardless Dan is drawing more attention to Hook and made him speak as soon as he messed with the Lays. Not gonna be everyone’s cup of tea but either way Hook will likely be pushed as a badass and Danhausen is helping. He could do the same for others. Comedy is very subjective especially in wrestling and not everyone will be a fan of it but Dan IMO doing his job very well so far.

Hook is looking more badass fucking around with Danhausen?? That's interesting.

Santino's serious side is a moot point. Has absolutely nothing to do with anything. It was me just letting MTR know I'm down with comedy despite some others here thinking because I don't like Wheeler Yuta I must have everything else in wrestling.


Fair point about the guidance. He didn't have that like he would have working WWE and performance center and what not. I just remember him saying what he was doing wasn't natural and wasn't working so it didn't matter if he had a good match or not when it came to reactions and bookings. Not sure if he has any thoughts about wanting to do more or not. Seems pretty happy doing what he is doing. He is doing well for himself so if you are happy and making all the monies why rock the boat. lol

You are right we probably like more of the same than not. :)

Again you're talking about things that are irrelevant. Him feeling comfortable doing Danhausen because what he did prior wasn't working doesn't mean anything when talking about the WWE machine. Which again was only brought up in jest. The idea being Danhausen, if he went to WWE, would lose that gimmick for obvious reasons and the wind up being an even bigger star as say Don Lemhusen.

The guy is a weird fuckin idiot but he works for the level he's at.

[MTR]

Just responding and reacting to things that you are saying. So not necessarily irrelevant. :)

And yes we know you hate all wrestling because you don't like Yuta. Just admit it. :D

[Badger]

Hook is looking more badass fucking around with Danhausen?? That's interesting.

Santino's serious side is a moot point. Has absolutely nothing to do with anything. It was me just letting MTR know I'm down with comedy despite some others here thinking because I don't like Wheeler Yuta I must have everything else in wrestling.



Again you're talking about things that are irrelevant. Him feeling comfortable doing Danhausen because what he did prior wasn't working doesn't mean anything when talking about the WWE machine. Which again was only brought up in jest. The idea being Danhausen, if he went to WWE, would lose that gimmick for obvious reasons and the wind up being an even bigger star as say Don Lemhusen.

The guy is a weird fuckin idiot but he works for the level he's at.

Okay badass maybe a bit of a strong word but at least if they do this in this current direction, could mess with Hook for a bit until Hook kills him. Either way, it’s silly and entertaining and don’t mind how it’s going so far. Personal perspective on that though.

I’m still not sure about your Yuta dislike myself tbh from what you’ve said so far. Not trying to be a dick here but just unsure unless you know something more about his prior history that I don’t. To me, it seems they’ve been slowly building up from the idea that he may have been a joke to actually taking him more seriously and see what he’s truly made of with the Moxley match. Keeping my feet on the ground there but do like the progression with him spilling his blood/guys to make him worthy. Hope it all works out for him.

[Nash Diesel]

Just responding and reacting to things that you are saying. So not necessarily irrelevant. :)

And yes we know you hate all wrestling because you don't like Yuta. Just admit it. :D

I know....It used to be that I hated everything because I wasn't high on Scooby Doo and South Park Jesus getting a stunner from Snowboardin' Tony Khan.

Justin Bieber was just in town. The reaction he got from the videos everyone posted was like watching an episode of Dynamite. Every song was this deafening reaction no matter how big/little the song, if it sucked, if he even sang lol. Just like Dynamite. Wheeler Yuta, CM Punk, Nyla Jax, Ethan Embry, 2 Cold Sky, they all get the same reaction.

Now Hook is a badass. Not because he was beating the shit out of actual wrestlers but because DANHAUSEN is the man. Jesus Christ.

[MTR]

Well I never said that. That was Badger. Hook is a bad ass because Hook is a bad ass. Or at least he seems to be. ;)

I am not sure we are watching the same shows when you keep going on and on about everyone gets the same reaction. I was actually waiting for you to say it. Surprised it took you this long. I disagree. But that is a whole other thing away from Danhausen.

[Nash Diesel]

Okay badass maybe a bit of a strong word but at least if they do this in this current direction, could mess with Hook for a bit until Hook kills him. Either way, it’s silly and entertaining and don’t mind how it’s going so far. Personal perspective on that though.

I’m still not sure about your Yuta dislike myself tbh from what you’ve said so far. Not trying to be a dick here but just unsure unless you know something more about his prior history that I don’t. To me, it seems they’ve been slowly building up from the idea that he may have been a joke to actually taking him more seriously and see what he’s truly made of with the Moxley match. Keeping my feet on the ground there but do like the progression with him spilling his blood/guys to make him worthy. Hope it all works out for him.

I'm basing everything I say about Wheeler Yuta from what I've seen since he started appearing with the Best Friends group in AEW. I have zero idea where he comes from. For all I know he's a black belt in kempo karate and has a 12-0 MMA record. He might've won the G1 Climax and the AJPW Champions Carnival tag tournament 4 years in a row. IDK.

So I'm with you and everyone else. I'm following the progression. I'm seeing this fuckin jobber, a square peg raping the circle hole for whatever reason. To prove a point that kayfabe is dead and Danielson can turn anyone into a killer? For me I just see that time and effort being wasted on Wheeler Yuta and instead could be toward someone else. Again, I 1000000% understand the storyline and what they're trying to accomplish but for me it's not working. For me it's even worse listening to fans Road Warrior pop for this guy because it feels phony.

Fans blowing up for Wheeler Yuta the same way they do for CM Punk is just disgusting to me as a fan, as a man, as a father. Plus the kid looks like Super Humann. It's impossible to think otherwise if you know who I'm talking about. Throw on an ICP shirt and some cactus covered barbedwire boards and they're virtually identical.

[Nash Diesel]

Well I never said that. That was Badger. Hook is a bad ass because Hook is a bad ass. Or at least he seems to be. ;)

I am not sure we are watching the same shows when you keep going on and on about everyone gets the same reaction. I was actually waiting for you to say it. Surprised it took you this long. I disagree. But that is a whole other thing away from Danhausen.

I know you didn't say that but my post was made while Badger was posting his follow up. Hook is badass because it's 2022 and motherfuckers are weak lol.

Hey I bring it up quite a bit because it's fucking true lol. I've been watching AEW since, well I guess All In if that's considered AEW. I was there when Page won the title. Sure I don't watch Dark/Elevation so I can't speak on those pops.

But when you're at a ppv and miss out on the free bags of cocaine to stay that hyped for 3-4 hours straight.....You start to wonder what show everyone else is watching lol. Kenny Omega came out and the crowd was just as lit for him as they were for Page winning the title. How does that make sense? Miro was out there, you would've thought Michael Jackson came back from the dead and Moonwalked out the chamber.

Reminds me of early TNA. Shark Boy, Jerelle Clark, Sting, Sabu, Abyss, Jeff Hardy, for awhile everyone was just as over as the next. Was it to spite WWE? IDK. Wait until Velveteen Dream returns.

[Psycho666Soldier]

What's wrong with that, though? Ignoring the fact that I don't actually think it's true that everyone gets the same pop, why does it matter that the paying audience is loud for most of the product? Because they're cheering for guys you personally have no interest in?

[MTR]

I don't see it. And yeah like Psycho says what if they are? Clearly the fans love the whole product and everyone there and are completely into the show. Nothing wrong with that.

That being said I don't think everyone is getting the same reactions.

[Badger]

I know you didn't say that but my post was made while Badger was posting his follow up. Hook is badass because it's 2022 and motherfuckers are weak lol.

Hey I bring it up quite a bit because it's fucking true lol. I've been watching AEW since, well I guess All In if that's considered AEW. I was there when Page won the title. Sure I don't watch Dark/Elevation so I can't speak on those pops.

But when you're at a ppv and miss out on the free bags of cocaine to stay that hyped for 3-4 hours straight.....You start to wonder what show everyone else is watching lol. Kenny Omega came out and the crowd was just as lit for him as they were for Page winning the title. How does that make sense? Miro was out there, you would've thought Michael Jackson came back from the dead and Moonwalked out the chamber.

Reminds me of early TNA. Shark Boy, Jerelle Clark, Sting, Sabu, Abyss, Jeff Hardy, for awhile everyone was just as over as the next. Was it to spite WWE? IDK. Wait until Velveteen Dream returns.

All I’m going to say is regardless if you feel Hook is being overhyped right now, I honestly thought to begin with myself that they wouldn’t take this kinda push with him but it’s fun to watch and the current hype is fun to play along with even if it burns out to nothing which you may eventually be right on. Just enjoying it and seeing where it goes. Better than being a negative nancy.

[Nash Diesel]

What's wrong with that, though? Ignoring the fact that I don't actually think it's true that everyone gets the same pop, why does it matter that the paying audience is loud for most of the product? Because they're cheering for guys you personally have no interest in?

I've literally answered that question not just in my last post but several times and you've responded. Whether you actually read the posts.....

Kenny Omega, the top heel, the World champ in AEW getting the same pop on the way to the ring as Adam Page received for winning the title should not be happening. Which makes me think there is something weird going on with some of you.

Just think about this board alone, how quick you are to come to AEW's defense. The only person who did that for WWE was Peter Griffin.....Maybe you two are tight but I'm just saying....It's like OMG people can't dislike something and comment about it and disagree with others who are being ridiculous.

[Nash Diesel]

All I’m going to say is regardless if you feel Hook is being overhyped right now, I honestly thought to begin with myself that they wouldn’t take this kinda push with him but it’s fun to watch and the current hype is fun to play along with even if it burns out to nothing which you may eventually be right on. Just enjoying it and seeing where it goes. Better than being a negative nancy.

"Better than being a negative nancy" Fuckin deal with it lol. You choose to make your little comments about how you just go with the flow and I'm a "negative nancy" wtf you sound like someone's Grandmother lol.

This thread is not immune to "negativity" You can kiss ass all you want, be a sheep it's what you do so well and I don't fault anyone for doing what is easy.

[Badger]

"Better than being a negative nancy" Fuckin deal with it lol. You choose to make your little comments about how you just go with the flow and I'm a "negative nancy" wtf you sound like someone's Grandmother lol.

This thread is not immune to "negativity" You can kiss ass all you want, be a sheep it's what you do so well and I don't fault anyone for doing what is easy.

Dude it’s just Hook thoughts lol. Seems like his hype is living in your head rent-free a bit lol.

You’re so easy at times. You’re sometimes (not always) one of the first to get on people for shitting on storylines before giving a chance to develop. That’s why it easy lol. Chill out and let us enjoy lol.

[Nash Diesel]

I don't see it. And yeah like Psycho says what if they are? Clearly the fans love the whole product and everyone there and are completely into the show. Nothing wrong with that.

That being said I don't think everyone is getting the same reactions.

It's not genuine imo. That's just how I see it and it's not coming from a place of ignorance.

[Psycho666Soldier]

I've literally answered that question not just in my last post but several times and you've responded. Whether you actually read the posts.....

Kenny Omega, the top heel, the World champ in AEW getting the same pop on the way to the ring as Adam Page received for winning the title should not be happening. Which makes me think there is something weird going on with some of you.

Just think about this board alone, how quick you are to come to AEW's defense. The only person who did that for WWE was Peter Griffin.....Maybe you two are tight but I'm just saying....It's like OMG people can't dislike something and comment about it and disagree with others who are being ridiculous.

I don't see how that's a problem. If you have a good product, ideally you want people to love every part of it, not just certain parts. People can have favorites and still get excited for other performers. Like if you have a roster of A-grade talent all at the same level, suddenly there's a problem because they're getting the same reaction?

I assume you'll say something about not everyone in AEW being on the same level. You're right. But if the majority of people watching the product feel strongly enough about multiple talents to the extent of giving them a similar reaction, then that's still a good thing for the person profiting off it.

You know, I notice almost any time the people generally positive about AEW have something negative to say about the product, you're strangely silent. Which is pretty convenient for your argument that no one can dislike something.

Which I've said multiple times. I don't care that you don't like something. Differences of opinion are fun. But you usually present your opinion as the end-all-be-all opinion that is superior to everyone else. Which I've also said multiple times and you typically have no response for.

If you don't like Adam Page or whoever, that's fine. But if a crowd of people cheer for him and you're in the minority of the crowd not caring, that doesn't mean everyone else is wrong or has bad opinions.

[MTR]

It's not genuine imo. That's just how I see it and it's not coming from a place of ignorance.

I am not saying you are coming from a place of ignorance.

I just don't share the same views that all of the reactions are the same. And if they were I wouldn't have an issue with it. I can see where you don't like and why you don't but I don't think it is a bad thing if it was happening and if it was happening I would think it would be genuine.

Just one of those things we won't agree on.

[Psycho666Soldier]

Like your argument about why people getting the same reaction is bad is because of YOUR opinion that Hangman isn't on Kenny's level. But that doesn't account for how the rest of the world perceives him.

[Badger]

If Nash says it so and we disagree on this here small forum then we must be wrong. All hail King Book…Nash….Diesel!!

[Nash Diesel]

Dude it’s just Hook thoughts lol. Seems like his hype is living in your head rent-free a bit lol.

You’re so easy at times. You’re sometimes (not always) one of the first to get on people for shitting on storylines before giving a chance to develop. That’s why it easy lol. Chill out and let us enjoy lol.

Yes Hook is living rent free in my head. That's an odd take but you also say a lot of stupid shit lol. Well documented and you can't even use past excuses for your behavior.

I'm completely chill. Don't assume tone it's corny lol.

You know you mentioned that thing about how I jump to conclusions about storylines sometimes and you have yet to produce one example. When it comes to shit like Hook and Yuta, I'm commenting on fan reaction. I'M the one wondering holy shit they've barely done anything with Hook and suddenly he's Hogan? They barely push Yuta and OMG every accomplishment is this great accolade despite the storyline being dogshit at the moment.

I don't think many people watch a story arc on a show and wait 3-5 years to have an opinion if it's good or bad. The argument that people should just sit and wait around because something YOU like isn't that appealing is ridiculous. How about some of you wait longer than a week before exploding all over each other with joy and making shit out to be bigger than it is? And for what reason---to spite other promotions and hope Tony sends you a paycheck?

[Psycho666Soldier]

I don't even think what you're saying about exaggerated reactions is completely untrue. But if reactions were purely out of spite for WWE, the Nightmare Collective would be a thriving stable right now.

[Badger]

Yes Hook is living rent free in my head. That's an odd take but you also say a lot of stupid shit lol. Well documented and you can't even use past excuses for your behavior.

I'm completely chill. Don't assume tone it's corny lol.

You know you mentioned that thing about how I jump to conclusions about storylines sometimes and you have yet to produce one example. When it comes to shit like Hook and Yuta, I'm commenting on fan reaction. I'M the one wondering holy shit they've barely done anything with Hook and suddenly he's Hogan? They barely push Yuta and OMG every accomplishment is this great accolade despite the storyline being dogshit at the moment.

I don't think many people watch a story arc on a show and wait 3-5 years to have an opinion if it's good or bad. The argument that people should just sit and wait around because something YOU like isn't that appealing is ridiculous. How about some of you wait longer than a week before exploding all over each other with joy and making shit out to be bigger than it is? And for what reason---to spite other promotions and hope Tony sends you a paycheck?

Okay AEW fan dictator Next time give us questionnaires and we’ll post them back to you before we decide how to react at the time. :yes:

[Badger]

I don't even think what you're saying about exaggerated reactions is completely untrue. But if reactions were purely out of spite for WWE, the Nightmare Collective would be a thriving stable right now.

Some things in AEW are no doubt exaggerated by fans I do agree, but the level he sometimes (not always btw) takes it to like he is Jesus Christ trying to steer fans in the right direction is a bit far.

[Nash Diesel]

Like your argument about why people getting the same reaction is bad is because of YOUR opinion that Hangman isn't on Kenny's level. But that doesn't account for how the rest of the world perceives him.

That has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. I'm saying that the crowd shouldn't be cheering and going crazy for the top heel and then go crazy for Adam Page winning. I'm only 40. I came up during the 90's where gimmicks that would've been mega heels in prior eras like the nWo and Stone Cold and The Rock were getting bigger pops than babyfaces. So I get it.

The fact is I mentioned more than just Page and Omega right? I mentioned Miro. At Full Gear the only person I think the crowd didn't pop hard for was Nyla Rose. Vickie was with her and you had a couple Eddie chants which were random as fuck but that was it lol. Poor Nyla. She's a juggalo though.

The rest of the world sure they might see Adam Page on Kenny Omega's level but that is irrelevant. To the rest of the world apparently everyone is a main event babyface in AEW.

[VHS]

It's become so difficult to decipher what the conversation is even about when Nash is going off like this. Folks like Hook for reasons... other folks don't like Hook for reasons. Regardless of all reasons, who cares really why? Like what you like and don't like what you don't like.


To the rest of the world apparently everyone is a main event babyface in AEW.

Like Sammy and Tay, who the crowd turned on?

[MTR]

Like Sammy and Tay, who the crowd turned on?

But the crowd cheers for everyone. You must be mistaken. ;)

[Nash Diesel]

I don't even think what you're saying about exaggerated reactions is completely untrue. But if reactions were purely out of spite for WWE, the Nightmare Collective would be a thriving stable right now.

I don't think they're 100% in spite of WWE, I do think there are fans who want all promotions to look at AEW as nothing sucks, everything is wonderful.

Nightmare Collective....That right there might be the KO to my argument. Although I will say this....I was hoping they would've let that stable actually form into whatever they were trying to do even with that turd Luther because I saw the potential. So anyone who thinks I don't want to see shit evolve, think again because that had some ingredients that would've worked. In a porn.

[Nash Diesel]

It's become so difficult to decipher what the conversation is even about when Nash is going off like this. Folks like Hook for reasons... other folks don't like Hook for reasons. Regardless of all reasons, who cares really why? Like what you like and don't like what you don't like.



Like Sammy and Tay, who the crowd turned on?

Keep that energy in the US Politics thread about people liking and not liking things lol. Unlike you I'm not playing a gimmick.

Sammy and Tay Conti are immune to this conversation. Those were just bots from the Thunderdome that bought tickets to AEW.

[VHS]

But the crowd cheers for everyone. You must be mistaken. ;)

Hah, no doubt.

I mean we've seen the crowd flip on faces quick. Like with Cody, lord folks got tired of his tldr promos and soap boxing. And Sammy/Tay, they had to course correct pretty fast which they're doing well to be fair.

[VHS]

Keep that energy in the US Politics thread about people liking and not liking things lol. Unlike you I'm not playing a gimmick.

Sammy and Tay Conti are immune to this conversation. Those were just bots from the Thunderdome that bought tickets to AEW.

Let's not talk about the dark place here :lol:

[Psycho666Soldier]

That has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. I'm saying that the crowd shouldn't be cheering and going crazy for the top heel and then go crazy for Adam Page winning. I'm only 40. I came up during the 90's where gimmicks that would've been mega heels in prior eras like the nWo and Stone Cold and The Rock were getting bigger pops than babyfaces. So I get it.

The fact is I mentioned more than just Page and Omega right? I mentioned Miro. At Full Gear the only person I think the crowd didn't pop hard for was Nyla Rose. Vickie was with her and you had a couple Eddie chants which were random as fuck but that was it lol. Poor Nyla. She's a juggalo though.

The rest of the world sure they might see Adam Page on Kenny Omega's level but that is irrelevant. To the rest of the world apparently everyone is a main event babyface in AEW.

If you're talking about Babyface vs. heel reactions, I think there's a difference between popping for someone during their entrance because you like/respect them vs. reacting appropriately to story-driven moments. Kenny was getting booed when he was beating up Hangman the week before.

You literally counted Nyla Rose as one of the people getting the same reaction as everyone else only posts ago. And it doesn't matter whether I say Hangman or anyone else. If the product is getting big reactions, regardless of how you or I feel, that's a good thing for the company. Even if it is just a means of sustaining the same crowd. Growth would be better, but I think it's more important that you're not losing fans.

I'll admit I prefer when the crowd plays along with the intended dynamics if I think the program is good. I used to get mad at the NXT crowd all the time for constantly heel-siding. I just don't think this is as big a problem.

I do get annoyed with how quick fans are to chant "This is awesome" and "Fight Forever." I'm usually the one at shows chanting "Not quite yet!" But I think that's a problem across all of modern wrestling.

[Psycho666Soldier]

I don't think they're 100% in spite of WWE, I do think there are fans who want all promotions to look at AEW as nothing sucks, everything is wonderful.

Nightmare Collective....That right there might be the KO to my argument. Although I will say this....I was hoping they would've let that stable actually form into whatever they were trying to do even with that turd Luther because I saw the potential. So anyone who thinks I don't want to see shit evolve, think again because that had some ingredients that would've worked. In a porn.

I'll give you props because I gave it a chance, but I was over it quick. I was at the Dynamite where Mel debuted and it was so awkward and no one knew what was happening and I don't think I could cringe harder.

[Tainted Eclipse]

I do get annoyed with how quick fans are to chant "This is awesome" and "Fight Forever." I'm usually the one at shows chanting "Not quite yet!" But I think that's a problem across all of modern wrestling.

it'll never stop annoying me. just cheer loudly if you feel that way! the worst is when a crowd is dead or tepid for most of the match, then the guys decide to do a bunch of spots and nearfalls in a row and the dead crowd starts half-heartedly chanting "this is awesome." ugh.

[Nash Diesel]

Let's not talk about the dark place here :lol:

Have to give you a little shit :)


I'll give you props because I gave it a chance, but I was over it quick. I was at the Dynamite where Mel debuted and it was so awkward and no one knew what was happening and I don't think I could cringe harder.

I'm going to let others have the last word about the crowd opinion as I'm thinking of giving up on the argument after this whole Nightmare thing was brought back to my attention lol.

[Badger]

Crowd reactions from AEW fans or just crowds in general can be annoying but overall how does the crowd factor take part when watching a match at home/online or on TV? No doubt there is one but how much? Generally I try not to let it affect me that much as long as I enjoy what’s in front of me and at least if the commentary is good. I personally try and put those over the crowd reaction when it comes to enjoying a match at home/TV/online.

[VHS]

Crowd reactions from AEW fans or just crowds in general can be annoying but overall how does the crowd factor take part when watching a match at home/online or on TV? No doubt there is one but how much? Generally I try not to let it affect me that much as long as I enjoy what’s in front of me and at least if the commentary is good. I personally try and put those over the crowd reaction when it comes to enjoying a match at home/TV/online.

I'd say the crowd adds a good portion of the excitement, in my opinion/guesstimation... eh, probably three quarters of the time I'm rolling with what the crowd's amped for. As mentioned before and in regards to the NXT crowd, AEW fans are nowhere near as annoying. NXT was my shit, but I'll be danged if they weren't the absolute worst at times. I'm the flipside of your crowd/commentary sitting though because I find AEW's commentary to be immensely distracting because it just doesn't do it for me. Excalibur's voice genuinely bothers me. The enjoyment for me comes from the crowd more.

[Badger]

I'd say the crowd adds a good portion of the excitement, in my opinion/guesstimation... eh, probably three quarters of the time I'm rolling with what the crowd's amped for. As mentioned before and in regards to the NXT crowd, AEW fans are nowhere near as annoying. NXT was my shit, but I'll be danged if they weren't the absolute worst at times. I'm the flipside of your crowd/commentary sitting though because I find AEW's commentary to be immensely distracting because it just doesn't do it for me. Excalibur's voice genuinely bothers me. The enjoyment for me comes from the crowd more.

The Excalibur thing I think is personal perspective again. He doesn’t personally distract me and I think he is trying to give history and backstory between the opponents. Maybe not all of it is relevant but I still don’t think he really distracts from matches the way some fans think he does but again personal perspective. I could perhaps agree the mask is not necessarily necessary lol.

But yeah though the crowd is somewhat important in an atmosphere, on occasions they can be deliberately obtuse and can chant random shit to get themselves over/be obtuse so try to judge each case on it’s case and not put too much stock personally on my own enjoyment watching at home.

[VHS]

The Excalibur thing I think is personal perspective again. He doesn’t personally distract me and I think he is trying to give history and backstory between the opponents. Maybe not all of it is relevant but I still don’t think he really distracts from matches the way some fans think he does but again personal perspective. I could perhaps agree the mask is not necessarily necessary lol.

But yeah though the crowd is somewhat important in an atmosphere, on occasions they can be deliberately obtuse and can chant random shit to get themselves over/be obtuse so try to judge each case on it’s case and not put too much stock personally on my own enjoyment watching at home.

It totally is perspective, no doubt. The mask thing is a non-issue though. And if he distracts someone from the matches, that's them being distracted... not thinking they're distracted. :dunno:

[Badger]

It totally is perspective, no doubt. The mask thing is a non-issue though. And if he distracts someone from the matches, that's them being distracted... not thinking they're distracted. :dunno:

That was more a joke at Mr Diesel about how he hates the mask lol.

[VHS]

That was more a joke at Mr Diesel about how he hates the mask lol.

Ahh roger that :lol:

[Defrost]

Not sure Shida thought through that white shirt/water combo there

[Tainted Eclipse]

BIG CASS!

crowd seems lethargic tonight

[VHS]

FENIIIIIX

[Nash Diesel]

Excalibur could look like Jim Ross and still suck. Wearing a mask is just some corny mark shit. Not to mention he's an idiot. IDC if someone approves it, you want to use the N word wrestling in front of 12 people to get heat....Zero respect.

[Badger]

So probably a bad idea for him to wear a cowboy hat on top of the mask then?

[BGMaverick]

For Philly, this crowd seemed somewhat subdued along the way. Not terrible but not really as boisterous as I anticipated.

Really good one between the FTR boys. Commentary seemed really good in parts and then really unprepared in parts. It seemed like they had to rehash the atmosphere of Philly, the importance of Owen Hart and the tournament. That’s fine but it felt like they said the same stuff each time they went back to those points. There was just something off about that. Really fun match though. Cool to see the tone shift when the eye poke went down.

Christian straight up stole Andre Chase’s shtick lol.

Very little that isn’t working for the Wardlow stuff right own. We getting Morrissey next week as the next hired gun? That would be fun.

Garcia is really embracing the JAS stuff and that’s likely going to pay huge dividends for him in the future. Kingston’s intensity and Jericho’s expressions were fantastic.

It has to be a bit now with Excalibur having to rattle off a Rampage/Dynamite card with no time lol. He literally had to run through five segments in about 30 seconds. Related: They didn’t really seem to make it a big deal that there was a ROH Women’s Unification Match next week lol.

Get out of here with that no sell of the fall onto the barbed wire ladder lol. You can’t get the crowd hyped with that and then have a well-executed fall onto the ladder just to see if diminished so quickly.

[Bert]

I'm excited to see Deonna on Dynamite, she's one of the best women's wrestlers in my opinion.

BCC match was good. Glad Yuta has a new tron now.

Wardlows hurricanrana was sick.

Cas XL/W Morrisey vs Wardlow should be good. Funny that MJF yells at his girlfriend Lexy Nair right before he called him.

The intro for JAS by Daddy Magic always makes me laugh. "AEW Galaxy" by Cool Hand Ang was amazing. Daniel Garcia sports entertainer with his Macho Man beret is the best.

Can't wait for Hernandez and Homicide to form super LAX.

At least Dante didn't take the pin for the match with Undisputed Elite.

Deeb with the pocket sand, sha sha sha! Deeb vs Thunder Rosa should be good. I still remember them fighting for the NWA title when AEW started.

Glad Fenix is back. That trios match will be good but I hope we get Matthews in singles action first.

Swerve vs Darby will be a great match.

Sammy is such a natural heel, I'm glad he turned. Huge pop for Sky winning the title. Huge pop for PVZ. I could see Ethan Page turning heel. Interesting that they showed Kip Sabian. He's been doing the Mr box head gimmick for a long time now.

[Morrison]

For Philly, this crowd seemed somewhat subdued along the way. Not terrible but not really as boisterous as I anticipated.

Really good one between the FTR boys. Commentary seemed really good in parts and then really unprepared in parts. It seemed like they had to rehash the atmosphere of Philly, the importance of Owen Hart and the tournament. That’s fine but it felt like they said the same stuff each time they went back to those points. There was just something off about that. Really fun match though. Cool to see the tone shift when the eye poke went down.

Christian straight up stole Andre Chase’s shtick lol.

Very little that isn’t working for the Wardlow stuff right own. We getting Morrissey next week as the next hired gun? That would be fun.

Garcia is really embracing the JAS stuff and that’s likely going to pay huge dividends for him in the future. Kingston’s intensity and Jericho’s expressions were fantastic.

It has to be a bit now with Excalibur having to rattle off a Rampage/Dynamite card with no time lol. He literally had to run through five segments in about 30 seconds. Related: They didn’t really seem to make it a big deal that there was a ROH Women’s Unification Match next week lol.

Get out of here with that no sell of the fall onto the barbed wire ladder lol. You can’t get the crowd hyped with that and then have a well-executed fall onto the ladder just to see if diminished so quickly.

crowd was fine, as involved as the last two shows that have been here.

the barbed wire ladder spot was fine. sammy took it, tried a desperation attempt to be in play on the ladder and got face smushed off without a fight. mirrored the cody ladder match very well.

[Morrison]

Swerve vs Darby will be a great match.


it was meh. sting was the most over guy during that match.

keith lee and swerve are so fucking boring.

[Badger]

it was meh. sting was the most over guy during that match.

keith lee and swerve are so fucking boring.

Sting is too good for his own good if that makes sense. Dude is off the top of my head without looking it up nearly 60
and doing crazy bumps just about every week probably moreso than Darby. The Sting wearing a Sting mask last week was hysterical though.

Just wish for his own sake he would slow down and can be more background while doing his part.

63 after looking it up. Nuts.

[Ringo]

I'm not always against short title reigns but the TNT title scene feels a bit aimless at the moment. I still want an Andrade run with the belt.

After seeing some of his work in Impact I'm actually looking forward to seeing Cass in AEW.

AND WHEN IS MIRO BACK FFS

[Bert]

I'm not always against short title reigns but the TNT title scene feels a bit aimless at the moment. I still want an Andrade run with the belt.

After seeing some of his work in Impact I'm actually looking forward to seeing Cass in AEW.

AND WHEN IS MIRO BACK FFS

He was on twitch last week and said he filmed a TV pilot in I think Brooklyn. Avoided questions about when he'd be back though. Maybe DoN.

[Mazer]

masked man Podcast (which typically has less hyperbole than some on actual news item) stated that Miro had some time due to the show, but he had also commented that he was waiting for creative. He's just a side player apparently, so show wasn't a full-time commitment.

[JP]

In the opening match last night, everything mattered. Physically, emotionally, psychologically, it all meant something. It was absolute brilliance.

In the last match last night, Sammy took one of the nastiest looking bumps off a ladder I've seen in ages. It was brutal, perfect end to the match. About 10 seconds later he was doing a springboard leap onto the ladder, just to get punched off. An unnecessary fake out which only served to interfere in the audience's ability to suspend their disbelief.

I love AEW, it's got me invested in wrestling more than anything has since 2013. But it's not growing anymore, despite the quality, and I think the schizophrenic nature of the shows/matches isn't helping in that regard.

When they burst on the scene there was a lot of talk about emulating WCW, and when they're at their best I think there are glimpses of that. But with their mix of incredible technical wrestling, fan service, and hardcore matches, they almost always put me in mind of ECW. Which in a way is fine, loved ECW, it was fun. But it was also, always, limited by its approach. There is a ceiling to presenting wrestling in such a manner. And there's a self-limitation to any company pulling stuff like the Jericho Appreciation Society. When your whole schtick is lampooning your more successful rival, making jokes and popping the crowd with insider references, you're not a serious entity, you're the BWO without the self-awareness.

[Bert]

So does Ethan Page try to cheat to help Sky beat Kaz and Sky gets mad at him and Page does the heel turn? Maybe they slow burn it but I feel like Ethan Page should be a heel.

[Nash Diesel]

Maybe I missed something but since when is Ethan Page a babyface? How does a heel turn heel?

[Bert]

Is Sky not a face now? There was a double turn.

[Badger]

Honestly this shit is with them is confusing and the constant hot potato with the TNT title doesn’t help.

Keeping Sammy face and out of that title picture for a bit going against a heel Jericho would’ve been gold but alas boat has sailed on that one.

[Bert]

Sammy is a natural heel and at least with hot potatoing the TNT title you don't get predictable reigns like with some of the other titles.

[Badger]

Which he was to begin with in the Inner Circle but his in-ring style also screams face. I think he’s good at both but I think he definitely had mileage left as a face not just aforementioned Jericho feud but even challenging the likes of Hangman or Punk in the big title picture. Other than the 24/7 title being worse, the title changes here is getting a bit ridiculous at this point. Maybe at least do a best-of-seven or something but unpredictability just for the sake of it can actually have the opposite effect and be quite boring and predictable.

I just think this is just a tad too early to turn him heel again.

[BGMaverick]

Honestly this shit is with them is confusing and the constant hot potato with the TNT title doesn’t help.

Keeping Sammy face and out of that title picture for a bit going against a heel Jericho would’ve been gold but alas boat has sailed on that one.

The changes helped execute turns, a women’s feud, a new challenger, produced good championship matches, created doubt between Page and Scorpio. The turn course corrected the top two characters into more natural roles. I get the disdain of the title changes if they didn’t produce anything and were done for the sake of doing them, but they certainly did produce noteworthy results. They just have to act on them now.

[Badger]

The changes helped execute turns, a women’s feud, a new challenger, produced good championship matches, created doubt between Page and Scorpio. The turn course corrected the top two characters into more natural roles. I get the disdain of the title changes if they didn’t produce anything and were done for the sake of doing them, but they certainly did produce noteworthy results. They just have to act on them now.

Absolutely no question of the match quality we have had and that a mixed tag is happening as a result. I just maybe think Sammi had more mileage as a face and this was the right circumstance for a double turn over a simple thing as a mixed tag and Lambert is a natural heel heat machine except us giggling at his shot at Mrs Rhodes. I just don’t know if this plus the hot-potatoing will all be worth it long-term for both guys as Sammi could have still been a great face and Scorpio could have still been a great braggy heel undefeated streak. Sammi is certainly a natural at both roles IMO but still think this was a tad early when he has had the fans behind him.

[BGMaverick]

He wasn’t going to keep those fans if Tay was going to be associated with him.

[Badger]

He wasn’t going to keep those fans if Tay was going to be associated with him.

Fair play Tay has been a bit of a factor here.

[Badger]

Whether they even needed to be acknowledged publically onscreen at this point is a different kettle of fish.

What they’re doing is not necessarily bad as such but Sammi on his own as a face still had mileage IMO.

[Murphy]

Agree that Sammy spring boarding off the top rope to the ladder after what was a great spot was daft.

I have no issue with the TNT Title switching around a bit. Reminds me of the WCW Cruiserweight Title in like 1998/99. Not every reign needs to be '200 days', here and '500 days' there. A bit of unpredictability is welcome.

Loved Dax and Cash. Loved the video posted on social media too. Shame that stuff can't make TV, really, but I understand. Love the New Hart Foundation ring gear too.

Bit confusing who are heels and faces at the moment. Guess FTR and Scorpio/Page are sorta 'tweeners' at this point. Surely Sammy has to be classed as full heel now.

Page and Punk should be a dandy. 'Mon the cowboy. :cool:

[Bert]

The barbed wire spot should have been the finish after the pie face spot. I'm surprised it was laid out how it was. I would like to see some new blood in the TNT title scene.

[Murphy]

An Ethan Page heel run after turning on Scorp.

[Badger]

Agree that Sammy spring boarding off the top rope to the ladder after what was a great spot was daft.

I have no issue with the TNT Title switching around a bit. Reminds me of the WCW Cruiserweight Title in like 1998/99. Not every reign needs to be '200 days', here and '500 days' there. A bit of unpredictability is welcome.

Loved Dax and Cash. Loved the video posted on social media too. Shame that stuff can't make TV, really, but I understand. Love the New Hart Foundation ring gear too.

Bit confusing who are heels and faces at the moment. Guess FTR and Scorpio/Page are sorta 'tweeners' at this point. Surely Sammy has to be classed as full heel now.

Page and Punk should be a dandy. 'Mon the cowboy. :cool:

I think title reigns recently in both companies kinda go from one extreme to the other lol. Either epically long with their world titles which is fine and can live with 24/7 or in this case of the TNT title Cody > Sammy > Cody > Sammy > Scorpio > Sammy rematch win every time etc. Kinda like a cheap whore lol. Unpredictability is good but room for breathing too.

Gotta be that happy medium somewhere ha

[Bert]

Punk should really beat Page for the title. Punk is old, Page can have other reigns later. Punk being champ will put more eyes on AEW and make the New Japan super show a bigger deal.

[Nash Diesel]

Punk should really beat Page for the title. Punk is old, Page can have other reigns later. Punk being champ will put more eyes on AEW and make the New Japan super show a bigger deal.

I agree with everything but the part in bold. AEW hasn't really grown their fanbase so I honestly don't think it matters who the World champion is to the majority of fans. I mean I wasn't even a fan of Jericho being their first World champ but it was better than the other option at the time. Still feel like Omega should've been the inaugural champion. Think back to the late 90's and how often that World championship flip flopped. If someone is over people will tune in whether they're the World champ or not. Punk has proven people will watch him and don't care what belt he has. Punk v. MJF was the best feud by a country mile AEW has ever produced, zero championships.

Does Punk even truly want to be World champion? Seems like his whole story has been about putting over the "future" and maybe this is another big notch Page can add to his belt. He would have wins over Omega, Danielson, and Punk which are bigger wins than any other AEW champion has had IMO. It's just a shame it's Page lol.

[Bert]

Punk is one of those people that always says you should want to be world champion of any company you're in. Maybe it's a work though.

[VHS]

I doubt Punk WANTS to be champion. (Purely conjecture.)

But him being champ would be the best move, and he’d be aware of that too if we get to that bridge. Hope that bridge is near tho.

[Nash Diesel]

Punk is one of those people that always says you should want to be world champion of any company you're in. Maybe it's a work though.

When did he say that?


I doubt Punk WANTS to be champion. (Purely conjecture.)

But him being champ would be the best move, and he’d be aware of that too if we get to that bridge. Hope that bridge is near tho.

I don't think Punk cares either way. That's just my opinion. He also said he didn't care about the money, yet bitched for 3 hours straight on Colt's podcast about not getting paid the same as The Rock and Undertaker.

Punk, hands down my favorite wrestler of the last 20+ years but the guy says one thing and does another. He was on his way back to a company he was never going to go back to and when they said no thanks he went with AEW.

[Donald]

Cm chump

[Tyrone]

I don't think I'm alone in Page's title run being the most boring of the four (Jericho, Mox and Omega). It feels like it should've ended a couple months ago. While he's been part of some very good matches, he's not the main reason why. I had been optimistic about what he could accomplish but Sammy as a champion with a lesser title feels like more of a big deal.

[MTR]

I like Page and I liked he won the title after the build up. But I hated the fact they put him right against Danielson. Great matches but you know fans wanted to see Danielson win the title and he will at some point be the champ. Despite getting the win over Danielson they didn't do Page any favors with that being his first title defense. I enjoyed the Cole feud because it made a bit more sense to keep things going with Page and the Elite after he took out Omega and they want the belt back. However I know that it has gotten mixed reactions and reviews from fans. I will say I while I enjoyed it, it didn't live up to what I expected it to be. I like Cole but not sure how much of a title contender he really is in this pond. So yeah Page's run has not been as fun and interesting as previous runs by the other champs. Even though I want to see Punk as champ at least once I am not sure I was quite ready for him to get there yet. That being said I am fine if he wins it from Page though. Kind of want to move on to someone different from Page. He can always come back and win it again and maybe have a better run.

[VHS]

When did he say that?



I don't think Punk cares either way. That's just my opinion. He also said he didn't care about the money, yet bitched for 3 hours straight on Colt's podcast about not getting paid the same as The Rock and Undertaker.

Punk, hands down my favorite wrestler of the last 20+ years but the guy says one thing and does another. He was on his way back to a company he was never going to go back to and when they said no thanks he went with AEW.

Yeah, I agree about him not caring.

As for Punk, if he was on his way back to WWE (if that's what you're referring to) then I wouldn't blame him saying no because the number wasn't big enough. Dude had that staph infection and they wouldn't help him, they had him lose to pretty much every top guy and plus he was just burnt out from their terrible management and schedule.

[Bert]

I've never heard anything about Punk going back to WWE. Are you taking Konnans word for it now?

[VHS]

I've never heard anything about Punk going back to WWE. Are you taking Konnans word for it now?

Me neither, that particular news never came across my desk.

[Morrison]

Absolutely no question of the match quality we have had and that a mixed tag is happening as a result. I just maybe think Sammi had more mileage as a face and this was the right circumstance for a double turn over a simple thing as a mixed tag and Lambert is a natural heel heat machine except us giggling at his shot at Mrs Rhodes. I just don’t know if this plus the hot-potatoing will all be worth it long-term for both guys as Sammi could have still been a great face and Scorpio could have still been a great braggy heel undefeated streak. Sammi is certainly a natural at both roles IMO but still think this was a tad early when he has had the fans behind him.
the fans VERY QUICKLY were not behind sammy as a face anymore. they broke the seal, and to try and repair it can just cause more problems and delay the inevitable. with the way tay and sammy portrayed themselves, they lost a sizeable portion of the crowd. there's no reason to try and push a square peg into a round hole just based off of potential. not every heel and face run has to be ran into the ground before a change, especially if the crowd reaction is already turning.

He wasn’t going to keep those fans if Tay was going to be associated with him.

their pairing would have been fine had it been handled differently. instead they were portrayed as juvenile and petulant, which turned people off.

[Donald]

I've never heard anything about Punk going back to WWE. Are you taking Konnans word for it now?

When he was on WWE Backstage, I think this was before AEW was a thing, I remember him saying it was a step to mending the bridge between he and WWE. I suppose that doesn't necessarily mean he was going to return to WWE, just fixing the relationship.

[Nash Diesel]

Yeah, I agree about him not caring.

As for Punk, if he was on his way back to WWE (if that's what you're referring to) then I wouldn't blame him saying no because the number wasn't big enough. Dude had that staph infection and they wouldn't help him, they had him lose to pretty much every top guy and plus he was just burnt out from their terrible management and schedule.

No, the WWE told HIM no lol. Fox wanted him, they said no thanks. Backstage was meant to be a bridge and he forgot he burned that fucker.


I've never heard anything about Punk going back to WWE. Are you taking Konnans word for it now?

Nobody banks their existence on whether or not you heard something Bert.

[Bert]

Ok so you asked where I heard Punk say everyone in the company should want to be champion but that's a totally reasonable thing to say and a lot of people have said it. On the other hand no one has ever talked about how CM Punk was going back to WWE and they said "no thanks" so he went to AEW.

[Bert]

https://i.imgur.com/v5taLFp.jpeg

[VHS]

Flat finish to Darby/Swerve.... disappoint.

[MTR]

Well it is not the G1 but Yuta is heading over to do the Best of the Super Juniors

[Bert]

https://youtu.be/9BU9AvJXYj0

[Donald]

I saw Sammy Guevara talking to Scorpio sky in the match and it just took me out of the match.

[Bert]

Dante Martin vs Fenix is going to be an Owen qualifying match. That should be crazy.

[Mazer]

It's true. That's a forced turn. Lambert is a strong heel, but fans don't actually dislike him enough to use him to stall anyone's heel heat. Didn't work for Cody. Wouldn't work for the Spanish God.

[Mazer]

Ok so you asked where I heard Punk say everyone in the company should want to be champion but that's a totally reasonable thing to say and a lot of people have said it. On the other hand no one has ever talked about how CM Punk was going back to WWE and they said "no thanks" so he went to AEW.

Punk didn't tell the story in those terms. He did talk about negotiations to return, and how he didn't like how they were handling negotiations.

[Badger]

It's true. That's a forced turn. Lambert is a strong heel, but fans don't actually dislike him enough to use him to stall anyone's heel heat. Didn't work for Cody. Wouldn't work for the Spanish God.

The thing with that is people like Lambert being cool heels are still too funny. He’s like how cool heel HHH was but better. Especially when Mrs Rhodes was being roasted.

While people like Morrison earlier made a few excellent points regarding how

[Badger]

Oops I got distracted and fell asleep before I finished that. What I meant to say was that while Morrison brought up excellent points about how the fans were turned off him as a face the way he and Tay were presented and it has worked for him as a heel to a degree, I still think he had a way to goes as a face if they didn’t couple up on-screen. I think the fans would’ve definitely still been behind him if he had risen up more against Jericho which I think would’ve been way more than just potential. If they stayed the course with him, not have him win the TNT title back so often and maybe dropped the Nob Dylan cards things and had him speak, definitely plenty face mileage left there along with opponents.

[Morrison]

well yeah. of course if someone is a face and gets booked well as a face, the mileage for them as a face increases. but they didn't do that. people dug tay, people dug sammy, so they stuck them together, but it turns out they're kinda insufferable together and it fucked up any babyface momentun that was built up, which fucked whatever potential mileage was there to explore, cause they'd have to detour off to pivot shit and get back on track, which isn't guaranteed to work. so ya just lean into what the crowd is telling you.

[Nash Diesel]

Ok so you asked where I heard Punk say everyone in the company should want to be champion but that's a totally reasonable thing to say and a lot of people have said it. On the other hand no one has ever talked about how CM Punk was going back to WWE and they said "no thanks" so he went to AEW.

Ah ok so it's totally reasonable for at some point in CM Punk's 40+ years on Earth that he said something like that but it's impossible that at least 1 person on this Earth has ever talked about how Punk was going back to WWE and they said no thanks?

[Psycho666Soldier]

I'm pretty sure Punk said something about "you should want to be champion" on commentary or something a few weeks ago. I remember him saying it to JR or referencing JR when he said it.

But I also specifically remember hearing the report about how Fox wanted Punk but WWE didn't. You can argue about whether Punk actually wanted to or not, but at least according to the rumor mill, WWE specifically chose not to do further business with Punk.

[Nash Diesel]

Yeah and I never disputed Punk saying that about being World champion because it's literally something everyone has probably said in this business-that if you're not in it to be champion you shouldn't be here. That doesn't take away the fact that maybe CM Punk doesn't WANT to be champion. He could just as easily lose to Adam Page at the ppv as he could win and it wouldn't shock me. I'm rooting for CM Punk.

[Mazer]

I want Punk to win. It would be a cool moment, and I've found Hangman's reign to be stale the last few months.

[Bert]

Rampage is on at 530 EST/430 CST this week because of playoffs.

[Donald]

Doesn't it just anger you that wrestling is moved around based on real, boring sports?

[Nash Diesel]

I want Punk to win. It would be a cool moment, and I've found Hangman's reign to be stale the last few months.

I'll keep beating this dead horse but Page killed all his momentum by dipping out when he did. Whatever the excuse, it derailed all his momentum. The crowd was happy when he won, they're happy when he comes out. I think most of us are fans of Adam Page right? But are we really fans of him as a main eventer, as the World champion? He's definitely not THE guy.

AEW did him no favors and their inexperience at booking showed in Adam Page's run. He will lose that title and be no bigger/better than he was prior. That's too bad. He just never had the really big wins and his feuds have been mediocre. Danielson was cool because it's Danielson fresh out of the WWE and working with jobbers like he was prior to Mania. But Page was no better/worse after that and that right there is why he needs to drop the title.

In my head I see CM Punk winning the title which results in the return of Kenny Omega and we get Punk v. Omega in Chicago.

[VHS]

I'll keep beating this dead horse but Page killed all his momentum by dipping out when he did. Whatever the excuse, it derailed all his momentum. The crowd was happy when he won, they're happy when he comes out. I think most of us are fans of Adam Page right? But are we really fans of him as a main eventer, as the World champion? He's definitely not THE guy.

AEW did him no favors and their inexperience at booking showed in Adam Page's run. He will lose that title and be no bigger/better than he was prior. That's too bad. He just never had the really big wins and his feuds have been mediocre. Danielson was cool because it's Danielson fresh out of the WWE and working with jobbers like he was prior to Mania. But Page was no better/worse after that and that right there is why he needs to drop the title.

In my head I see CM Punk winning the title which results in the return of Kenny Omega and we get Punk v. Omega in Chicago.

You mean like the royal we?

[Psycho666Soldier]

It's unfortunate because I feel like Hangman has been working his ass off and has had some cool character moments(like when he got extra spicy with Adam Cole), but it's all felt like too little too late, or was part of a program that felt like an afterthought. Like he looked great in that program with Bryan, but then it felt like his relevance to the show just fell off. And then they dragged the Cole thing out and it just meandered.

All for Punk winning. He's one of the biggest names in the company, he's built up well to it, and I think it'll do more favors for Page than giving him the rub. Even if the crowd happens to turn on Punk because of it, that's just an excuse to have him go heel which I'm sure he'll make work, even if he's a bit rusty at first. Whereas the crowd turning on Page could be problematic, and I'm not so sure he's quite ready for a heel run?

Regardless, the match should be fun. I'm just curious how the crowd dynamics will work out.

[Nash Diesel]

It's unfortunate because I feel like Hangman has been working his ass off and has had some cool character moments(like when he got extra spicy with Adam Cole), but it's all felt like too little too late, or was part of a program that felt like an afterthought. Like he looked great in that program with Bryan, but then it felt like his relevance to the show just fell off. And then they dragged the Cole thing out and it just meandered.

All for Punk winning. He's one of the biggest names in the company, he's built up well to it, and I think it'll do more favors for Page than giving him the rub. Even if the crowd happens to turn on Punk because of it, that's just an excuse to have him go heel which I'm sure he'll make work, even if he's a bit rusty at first. Whereas the crowd turning on Page could be problematic, and I'm not so sure he's quite ready for a heel run?

Regardless, the match should be fun. I'm just curious how the crowd dynamics will work out.

Another dead horse I stabbed and brought back to life (TIGTONE!) argument is the fact that we're even questioning how the crowd will react toward 2 babyfaces in Adam Page and CM Punk.

In Ring of Honor, there would be no worries. We would see this match as the top 2 wrestlers who happen to be babyfaces going at it for the championship. Maybe that's older ROH I'm referring to. The other spots, you start getting this Rock v. Hogan WM 18 vibe. Which babyface is going to get booed? Is someone going to turn heel?

Fantasy booking--Page turning heel isn't a bad idea but not yet. Punk beats Page, Punk drops title back to Omega in Chicago a month later via Page turning heel.

It won't happen but that's exactly what I would do. You keep Page v. Punk going, you do Omega v. Moxley II, and then revisit Punk v. Omega in a real feud. Tony's going to try and pull an ROH and wait like 10 years to have a 2x World champ but ROH didn't book their shit like they were on national tv. A short title run for the veteran Punk and you help re-establish Adam Page in a different light.

[Morrison]

punk did get a quick spattering of jeers during his promo on dynamite once he talked about hangman, which actually kinda surprised me. not sure if it was picked up well on the broadcast, though.

i love hangman and each title defense has been fun, and there have been some great moments, but after the second danielson match, it did feel like he faded into the background as far as focus for the show is concerned. don't think it's a coincidence that the fading occurred just as the punk/mjf feud really got going, either.

i liked hangman's piece of the cole feud, but kinda gave no shits about the rehash of the undisputed era formula, just as i gave no shits about it when they were doing it in nxt. cole came in pretty hot for me, was having some great tv matches, but as soon as fish showed up, it very quickly shifted to undisputed era 2.0 and i've been disinterested since.

this build for hangman/punk should be a lot more engaging. i don't have any real preference for who should win, i'll be happy with either, but i do think now would be a fine time to end hangman's reign. six month reign, he'll pass jericho in days held for the title, put on two classics with danielson, loses to a living legend on a huge comeback journey. he's got plenty more reigns left in him

tk talked about blood and guts probably making a return sometime this summer, and i wouldn't be surprised if the elite/undisputed elite storyline comes to a head in that match, maybe in august. i could see hangman being a key piece in that angle, where we finally see him reunite with kenny and the bucks, so losing the title wouldn't be much of a demotion.

[Bert]

I really feel like Blood n Guts is LAX vs JAS.

[Morrison]

I really feel like Blood n Guts is LAX vs JAS.

i could see that, too.

also could see the blackpool combat club being highlighted in the format.

could go a couple different ways, which is nice.

[Bert]

https://i.imgur.com/qOtNvy0.png

[Psycho666Soldier]

Kind of a shame. I think he was the most physically talented of everyone in Dark Order. But I don't really know what you do with him that isn't involving a tag team run.

[Ringo]

punk did get a quick spattering of jeers during his promo on dynamite once he talked about hangman, which actually kinda surprised me. not sure if it was picked up well on the broadcast, though.

i love hangman and each title defense has been fun, and there have been some great moments, but after the second danielson match, it did feel like he faded into the background as far as focus for the show is concerned. don't think it's a coincidence that the fading occurred just as the punk/mjf feud really got going, either.

i liked hangman's piece of the cole feud, but kinda gave no shits about the rehash of the undisputed era formula, just as i gave no shits about it when they were doing it in nxt. cole came in pretty hot for me, was having some great tv matches, but as soon as fish showed up, it very quickly shifted to undisputed era 2.0 and i've been disinterested since.

this build for hangman/punk should be a lot more engaging. i don't have any real preference for who should win, i'll be happy with either, but i do think now would be a fine time to end hangman's reign. six month reign, he'll pass jericho in days held for the title, put on two classics with danielson, loses to a living legend on a huge comeback journey. he's got plenty more reigns left in him

I'm with you. Hangman has been a bit of an afterthought to me lately but I'd put that more on Adam Cole than him. It feels like that feud exposed Cole more as a midcard talent than it did Page (although I'm not sure TK sees that - I've got a horrible feeling Cole is going to win the Owen Cup). It could probably go either way now with Page, in terms of how this title reign is remembered. The Punk feud should either get it back on track or end it on a high. Everything Punk has touched since like November has been gold.

[Nash Diesel]

1 down, about 17 others to go and we're finally rid of that shit stable. They milked the death of Brodie Lee and that stable hasn't done a fucking thing of worth since it was created. Tony Khan wants to pretend he's Michael Jackson to -1 and turn him into Corey Feldman, we don't need a stable for that. Plus AEW will be gone in a year.

[Nash Diesel]

Adam Page is going to be the guy we look back at this reign and go ok he beat Omega, Danielson, Cole, probably Punk, and he's still the 5th wheel of the Bullet Club. He's still the 5th wheel of the Elite. He was never Elite. He's the Wheeler Yuta of this little circle of tyrants.

Real quick--Despite what I personally think of Adam Cole, if every promotion he's been in whether that was FIP, ROH, NXT, now AEW....If they all consider him the man, we're in the wrong. Tony Khan said the only guy that worried him on Wed was Adam Cole Bay-Bay. Despite NXT's ratings dropping the more they pushed Cole.

Adam Cole is a guy that promoters see $$$ in. They see a main eventer. That's why Page worked with him, that's why Page beat him. And still hasn't done shit. If this were the WWE the fans would've been booing Page out of the building by now as WWE fans see the forced push a mile away.