UFC 217: Bisping vs St-Pierre - The return of GSP - 3 Title Fights - Nov 4 - MSG

[Mark Hammer]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/ce/Ufc-217-poster.jpg

Middleweight Championship
Michael Bisping (c) vs Georges St-Pierre

Bantamweight Championship
Cody Garbrandt (c) vs TJ Dillashaw

Strawweight Championship
Joanna J (c) vs Rose Namajunas


Stephen Thomson vs Jorge Masvidal
Johny Hendricks vs Paulo Borrachinnha


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0jNnzR784o

[Mark Hammer]

Card of the year lads. Cannot f'ing wait.

[Tyson]

Go on GSP, smash that fool... :canada:

[Nash Diesel]

The top 4 fights are just insane. The main event is crazy, never thought I'd ever see Michael Bisping as champ for one, defending against GSP for two, @ Madison Square Garden for three.

[Mark Hammer]

One has to wonder what GSP's plans are if he wins. At the media face-off he literally looked up to Bisping. The boys at MW are big and while I don't mind his chances vs Bisping there's a big possibility he'll be crushed vs the Weidmans and Rockholds of the division.

Of course Woodley isn't out of the question but DW said he's getting the winner of Lawler/Dos Anjos in December. Of course Dana will Dana so that doesn't really mean much.

[Nash Diesel]

One has to wonder what GSP's plans are if he wins. At the media face-off he literally looked up to Bisping. The boys at MW are big and while I don't mind his chances vs Bisping there's a big possibility he'll be crushed vs the Weidmans and Rockholds of the division.

Of course Woodley isn't out of the question but DW said he's getting the winner of Lawler/Dos Anjos in December. Of course Dana will Dana so that doesn't really mean much.

I haven't read too much into why GSP chose this path but one of the reasons I personally assumed was that maybe he let himself go a little while on hiatus and put on some muscle or something. He's always said he's an average Welterweight and he and his coaches used to talk about how you'd see him challenging Benson Henderson at 155 before moving up to 185. Maybe that's his plan, work his way backwards lol. I mean, Bisping used to fight at 205 and he's a decent sized MW. I am hoping GSP wins but I am curious if he has any real intention on staying there. I mean, could he take Whitaker? I've only seen a handful of fights from that kid. None within the last year.

Did you read RDA saying that he wants the UFC to make his fight for the interim title?? Laughable.

[Mark Hammer]

I forgot all about Robert Whittaker.

And yeah, lol RDA. Tarec Saffeidine and Neil Magny don't warrant a title shot, interim or not. I will be surprised if Lawler doesn't absolutely destroy him.

[Nash Diesel]

I forgot all about Robert Whittaker.

And yeah, lol RDA. Tarec Saffeidine and Neil Magny don't warrant a title shot, interim or not. I will be surprised if Lawler doesn't absolutely destroy him.

If Lawler hits him with the uppercut combo that Stephens and Alvarez did, he's out in the first. I know I've read some peeps saying that Lawler's loss to Woodley was a sign of things to come, that his battles are catching up to him but I don't know if I agree with that just yet outside of the obvious. IE He's getting older, slower, but still a killer. Is he Chuck Liddell now? Maybe. We'll find out.

[Mark Hammer]

He looked great vs Cerrone and ate plenty of shots. Going out to a Tyron Woodley haymaker isn't anything to be embarrassed about though I'd be surprised if his fight vs Condit didn't take a few years off.

[Fanny Batter]

I think it's going to be a bit of a dogfight. Both men damage quite easily, I can see GSP piecing up Bisping's face with his jab in the early part of the fight but shouldn't have the sting in his punches to drop him, then Mike will start landing a bit as GSP's explosiveness fades with the extra weight he's carrying. I think Bisping eventually lands something big and puts him away in the championship round. Michael Bisping, gatekeeper, suddenly gets into GOAT contention with a 4 fight win streak (not accounting for "primes" of course) comparable to any in the sport's history. 2 top 5 consensus GOAT's, a fringe top 10 GOAT and the reigning middleweight champion at the time to top it off.

Garbrandt vs. Dillashaw is an incredible fight. Their individual performances last time out were fucking unbelievable. Hard fight to predict as both seem to improve astronomically fight by fight. I guess I lean Cody with his power but it's a toss up.

Can't see Double J having any trouble with Rose unless there's a mad scramble, and she hasn't found herself in one yet.

[Nash Diesel]

Who gives Double J a run for her money? I mean, Claudia's getting into that "an in shape BJ Penn" status because she's so explosive the first 2 then she starts to fade. I'm just looking up and down that roster and I think to myself...who? Other than Claudia, I don't see a real strong threat. Thug Rose...The one advantage she has is that she's wild. She will have no problem going for something extremely outlandish even if it costs her the fight.

[Mark Hammer]

Tecia Torres is a sleeper imo.

[Nash Diesel]

Tecia Torres is a sleeper imo.

If she can get the fight. She might be someone who gets to the title fight, but JJ is gone by then or not the champ. Reminds me of a Tyson Griffin, Clay Guida almost.

[Mark Hammer]

If I were a betting man I'd say JJ vs Valentina Shevchenko is going to happen sooner rather than later and most likely at 125 lbs. Shevchenko could easily make that weight (and make waves) though I imagine Joanna would be a little small for the division.

[Nash Diesel]

If I were a betting man I'd say JJ vs Valentina Shevchenko is going to happen sooner rather than later and most likely at 125 lbs. Shevchenko could easily make that weight (and make waves) though I imagine Joanna would be a little small for the division.

I'd love to see it. It looks like JJ has a rough cut or maybe she's just lanky.

[Mark Hammer]

She looks like Skeletor.

[Nash Diesel]

She looks like Skeletor.

A hot female Skeletor. Hot by Skeletor standards mind you.

[OD50]

Shevchenko has defeated JJ three times in Muay Thai at -57 kilo which pretty much equals 125 lbs, so a fight between them at that weight could probably be built upon that. I'm guessing that if Shevchenko moves down or JJ moves up either of them would probably handle whoever wins the TUF 125 lbs tournament. I'm pulling for Barb Honchank, I'm kind of digging her.

I agree that Joanna should move up shortly, she looks way skinny at 115.

[Nash Diesel]

This 125 championship tournament, kind of a joke. I mean, they have women currently on the roster that they could have used that are already going up. There's a good chance someone with a 2-3 record could be champ.

[Fanny Batter]

Looking at Bisping's record and stats, he's had a really fucking remarkable career hasn't he? If he wins this fight he'll still be the outright leader for most wins (interestingly, all 3 fighters who are a win behind, Cerrone, Maia and GSP himself, fight in the next 2 weeks). Win or lose he'll be the outright leader for most fights in UFC history. Most wins in middleweight history. Second most fight time in UFC history. Would have at least one UFC win in TWELVE consecutive years. If he gets a (T)KO he'll go joint second all time. Never lost to anybody who wasn't good enough to challenge for or hold a recognised World title, never finished by anybody who didn't hold a PRIDE or UFC title. For a man who never had a top 5 win until we thought he was on the nacker yard, what an incredible career.

Likewise for GSP - has the chance to go joint top with most wins in company history, with comfortably the best win percentage out of the other 3 contending. Opportunity to become only the 4th person to win a World title in a second division, and only the second to win a third World title in the UFC. Would go outright top from Mighty Mouse for most wins in title fights, as well as going joint top with him for active win streaks.

Two incredible careers, it's a shame really that it's come about the way it has. It doesn't FEEL a big fight, when all of the points above suggest it's historically a huge one.

[Tainted Eclipse]

as a fight im much more interested in garbrandt/dillashaw

[Fanny Batter]

Yeah, I think considering the rate of improvement that both men have shown fight by fight, it might be the most advanced match-up we've seen in the sport's history. Legit. The way Dillashaw dissected John Lineker was a work of art. Like if that wasn't such a noteworthy show (Rousey getting smashed), that would have got so many plaudits he was that good. Flawless. Then Garbrandt's hand speed, power and movement in the Cruz fight, and his confidence, another amazing performance. Like there's no doubt in my mind that Dillashaw that night would have beaten the best ever Dominick Cruz too. And now they fight each other after another year of sharpening the skills. Should be superb.

I do like the Masvidal/Thompson fight too. Masvidal is so good. I say it before every fight he's in, but he's so fucking close to having an all time great career, he just comes up short, like literally JUST short. He's 4 rounds on the judges scorecard away from being 13-1 in the UFC, and genuinely had an argument to win every one of those fights. Then Thompson himself is pretty close to perfect in his career too, and should probably be sitting on 2 draws against Woodley in a row. It might be tentative at points but as a chess match it's a world class fight.

In an odd addition, Ovince St Preux has stepped in for Pat Cummins so the #6 light heavyweight in the UFC fights #7 in the 11th fight down, behind 4 unranked fights on FS1, with only 3 men ranked above them coming off wins. So a somehow relevant fight in the division somehow isn't.

[Mark Hammer]

So evidently tickets to this aren't selling up to expectations and the narrative is that it's because most of today's fans are post-Rousey and Conor and they have never seen a GSP fight or experienced the build to one. There's probably a lot of truth in that and as a fan for over a decade it breaks my heart.

The week leading to a GSP fight used to feel like WrestleMania weekend before wrestling became shit. The buzz was something else and I'm sad that there's such little hype for next weekend's fight.

[Mark Hammer]

I remember when the Rousey train started spiraling out of control she took an unprovoked jab at GSP saying the only reason he was a draw was because he was handsome.

When asked for a response by some media outlet GSP replied, "She thinks I'm handsome? I'm very flattered." Pure class. Heart GSP.

[Nash Diesel]

Could be a real thing. There was a guy who worked with me who said that he was already on the fence about the UFC and the Hendricks-GSP fight result made him stop watching it altogether.

[Mark Hammer]

He's a doofus then. I had Georges winning 3-2 not to mention Hendricks being an abrasive whiny steroid cheat.

I realize he never popped but there was just way too much evidence in his downfall and inability to make weight after USADA became implemented. And GSP mentioned that Johnny seemed suspiciously strong in that fight.

[Nash Diesel]

He's a doofus then. I had Georges winning 3-2 not to mention Hendricks being an abrasive whiny steroid cheat.

I realize he never popped but there was just way too much evidence in his downfall and inability to make weight after USADA became implemented. And GSP mentioned that Johnny seemed suspiciously strong in that fight.

I'd put money on it if GSP gets rinsed by Bisping one of the main arguments will be USADA.

He's not a doofus when a lot of fans/fighters/etc. felt Hendricks won that fight. Dude just didn't like the result of several other fights I guess and this result sent him over the edge. I mean you say "I had him winning 3-2", a lot of people had Hendricks winning 3-2, which is why it was a split decision and not even a bad SD. The first SD victory of GSP's career though.

GSP was smart. IMO, it was only a matter of time before someone was going to knock him completely out. He took more shots in his last 3 fights than his previous 24 combined. Diaz, Condit, and Hendricks lit that dude's brain up to where he legit thought he was abducted whereas it was probably signs of CTE.

[Mark Hammer]

He's a doofus for warding off the sport over a super close fight where there was an argument both ways. Especially when you consider Hendricks was probably cheating throughout that stretch of his career.

[Nash Diesel]

He's a doofus for warding off the sport over a super close fight where there was an argument both ways. Especially when you consider Hendricks was probably cheating throughout that stretch of his career.

Right, but as I said, I believe his lack of desire to watch the UFC was already growing due to previous fights he had watched.

You ask a lot of people, they'd say the same thing about GSP unfortunately. Probably a lot more people than they would Hendricks especially when Hendricks, dumbass that he is, has never popped. People are saying the same thing about dudes like Weidman for example, that he's slipping because of USADA. That's the go to excuse now for any dominant fighter. They lose, gotta be USADA. They miss weight, gotta be USADA. They win, gotta be USADA. lol. There's no joy in the UFC like there was pre-USADA.

[Mark Hammer]

Weidman and GSP have never failed to make weight nor did they go on to lose to the likes of Tim Boetsch. There are no signs that insinuate GSP ever juiced so if someone accused him of it I would immediately write him off as a hater and assume he would also be the type to become so outraged over GSP/Hendricks as to stop watching the sport.

Was this goofball aware that the judges are not affiliated with the promotions? They are people who are susceptible to misreading fights just like everyone who argued that Hendricks got robbed.

[Nash Diesel]

Weidman and GSP have never failed to make weight nor did they go on to lose to the likes of Tim Boetsch. There are no signs that insinuate GSP ever juiced so if someone accused him of it I would immediately write him off as a hater and assume he would also be the type to become so outraged over GSP/Hendricks as to stop watching the sport.

Was this goofball aware that the judges are not affiliated with the promotions? They are people who are susceptible to misreading fights just like everyone who argued that Hendricks got robbed.

Does it matter if the judges are affiliated with the promotions?

What about the whole thing where GSP was actually overweight for his title fight with Diaz and the commission tried to sweep that under the table? There's even audio of it........Losing to Tim Boetsch is a negative when you're moving up and you're not even a big 185 and Boetsch used to fight at HW? Makes sense I guess.

I still think you're too fixated on insulting this guy than paying attention to the fact that it was just a string of bad results. I don't even know if he meant judging, just results he wasn't happy with. Could be that he got sick of seeing the guys he wanted to win lose.

[Mark Hammer]

Yeah it does. Why stop watching a sport or promotion because of judges that have nothing to do with it? Based on the limited information I've been given your acquaintance sounds like an idiot.

[Cewsh]

Alright, so most of my knowledge of UFC comes from the early years or the period right before Silva's run ended to now, so I missed most of GSP's run as a top guy. Where did he go? And does it seem likely he has a big run left in him?

[Mark Hammer]

Alright, so most of my knowledge of UFC comes from the early years or the period right before Silva's run ended to now, so I missed most of GSP's run as a top guy. Where did he go? And does it seem likely he has a big run left in him?

He retired 4 years ago after taking more cumulative damage in 2 or 3 fights than he had in his entire career. He was known for absolutely dominating his fights from bell to bell but some didn't like his style because he tended to fight safe to a decision. But these were dominant decisions.

He's returning after a long hiatus, up a weight class. The UFC seems to be planting the seeds for a megafight between him and Conor McGregor so I can't see this run lasting more than a few fights. GSP is older now and surely in the twilight of his career. Nothing but big money fights if I had to guess.

[Mark Hammer]

You ought to check this one out Cewsh. Many (including myself) consider GSP the greatest of all time. The big question going into this is how the 4 years off has affected him.

[kangus]

Well he doesn't sound like my cup of tea.

[MikeHunt]

GSP's brain is completely mangled as well is it not.

[Mark Hammer]

Maybe. Like ND pointed out he did claim to have been abducted by aliens. I like to hope he was joking but who knows.

[Fanny Batter]

The sport has changed since the GSP era, as have general trends in promotion, marketing, how the content is distributed. Back during his heyday, the sport was kind of built on the strong champions defending against guys who went on good winning streaks and generally coming through with a win - GSP, Anderson, Cain (outside of the JDS upset), Penn, Aldo, Cruz (then Barao), Jones; and before that Liddell, Hughes and Ortiz. They were the champions, guys like Diego Sanchez and Jon Fitch were booked prominently for their rankings and got title fights that drew well based on a challenger looking a threat to a top champion based on strength of wins on accessible cards. The game has completely changed now. Fight Pass kind of exists in a separate bubble for hardcore fans but is a complete irrelevance to the casual viewer and any victory gained on that platform is virtually anonymous. The FS1 cards don't draw particularly good ratings, again existing predominantly for the hardcores, yet the UFC have to fill these cards with top names. So guys are building resume's for title shots in the background really. Compare that to the trajectory of a Johny Hendricks or Lyoto Machida in the build up to their title shots - spots on big PPV's, a couple of co-headliners included, and their title fights draw big. Then you have the cases of guys like Ray Borg and Kevin Lee, talented as they are, getting built up for shots the third fight down on FS1 cards, or maybe getting to headline a filler show in Oklahoma. The big fight model now is basically a big name, and there's so few, fighting somebody that will have a bit of needle with them. McGregor, Rousey and Jones all do their best numbers against the people who create buzz at weigh ins or press conferences. GSP's just not that dude. He had it a bit with Nick Diaz and it worked because Diaz is genuinely a bit of a nutter, but it's not working here because Bisping doesn't fully commit to being a cock. It's all a bit pantomine, he does all the kiss my arse stuff but in the same interviews will tell us about his love for his family making it hard to fully buy into the heel persona.

I feel the rockstar like vibes McGregor and Rousey created will leave a bit of a dent in the sport for the short term. Everybody's a bit of a cunt now. It's forced and disingenuous and the buying public see through it in the most part because there's not many with the charisma and talent to back it up, and possibly more importantly it's completely stripped the sport of protagonists. It's a general culture thing more than an MMA thing, but there's nobody to actually root for nowadays. The colourful persona's, even if forced, make guys like GSP or Demian Maia "boring", whereas in the past they'd be the good guys turning away the shit talking villain. Without that dynamic, I don't think GSP will ever be the draw he was.

[Spedizzo]

One has to wonder what GSP's plans are if he wins. At the media face-off he literally looked up to Bisping. The boys at MW are big and while I don't mind his chances vs Bisping there's a big possibility he'll be crushed vs the Weidmans and Rockholds of the division.

Of course Woodley isn't out of the question but DW said he's getting the winner of Lawler/Dos Anjos in December. Of course Dana will Dana so that doesn't really mean much.

I just cannot see GSP competing against the likes of Whittaker, Rockhold, Romero if he wins. They just seem too good and too big.

I bet this is GSP's last fight win or lose. If he wins, he will probably get "injured" or something and vacate the belt.

[Fanny Batter]

Let's not forget Whitaker was himself a welterweight, and not a particularly successful one either, before this run he's gone on. I'd be surprised if he was that big compared to GSP, who will have used every advantage when it comes to the sport science and nutritional aspect of the game to come in at a weight suitable for him. The biggest problem that Georges will face going up in weight now compared to five years ago is that the speed advantage he'll have had over the Rockhold's and Romero's of the division will surely have faded with aging. But honestly, who knows? It's easy to forget how good he was, and he very well might come back having not lost a step and that famous timing and fight IQ may lead him on another run? Remember, Kelvin Gastelum was a welterweight too and he had good success against Weidman before fading too. It's not impossible for guys to go up and look as good at a higher weight class, forgoing their natural advantages in size and strength in favour of being the quicker, better conditioned athlete (due to less of a weight cut). Look at guys like Poirier, RDA, Masvidal - they've not really been overwhelmed in the higher weight classes.

It's still strange to me that this is happening. It's such an odd fight to think about when you think of when GSP stepped away. Bisping had just had surgery on his retina after going 2-2 in his previous 4, then proceeded to go 1-2 when he returned from that. MSG was still a pipedream for MMA. TJ Dillashaw had just lost to Assauncao. Cody Garbrandt was 1-0 as a professional. Women's strawweight wasn't an active division. 13 of the 14 fighters on the prelims hadn't even debuted with the promotion. Now we're here, he's back, and it ain't the same place it was when he went away.

[Nash Diesel]

Final picks:

Bisping
Cody
JJ
Masvidal

3 of the 4 I'm not rooting for but usually when I pick with my heart I lose lol.

[Fanny Batter]

Masvidal doesn't really lose fights so I'm finding it difficult to bet against him. There's an argument that he could be unbeaten in the UFC, certainly at welterweight. Great fighter. But then again there's an argument there that Wonderboy didn't lose either Woodley fight as well. So it's two top class fighters who could have been fighting for the title instead of that Woodley/Maia fight if things had been scored a little differently. Expecting a very tactical fight and it going to a split verdict.

Can't see Johny Hendricks winning. He just seems done at this point. Borrachinha should get the stoppage. They fancy him as a future star in Brazil, he was rumoured to be fighting Vitor at some point so you have to feel they're giving him a name fighter they expect him to polish off.

Joanna is going to land 150+ significant strikes and win a decision against Rose. I agree that it's Joanna's most interesting title defence because of Rose's length and ability in scrambles, but still can't see her doing much.

Garbrandt and Dillashaw is so hard to call. If it goes five rounds it'll probably be fight of the year. Cody has the power to end it but TJ's level changes for takedowns are superb and we've not seen Cody off his back. Leaning Cody just based on his youth and power - I feel he's slightly more likely to have made greater improvements to his skillset, a skillset that beat up Dominick Cruz over 5 rounds last time out. I think he'll finish it too, can't see him letting TJ off the hook like he did Cruz, he'll want to smash him.

Everything during fight week thus far has me leaning back towards GSP. He looks confident. Doesn't look like a man that's taken a gamble coming back, he thinks he can do it. This is the most skilled all round fighter in welterweight history fighting Michael Bisping. Skillwise he should have enough to best him, the big question is whether he can maintain a solid pace carrying the extra weight. If he can, and he'll have figured that out before accepting the fight knowing the guy he is, then he takes a decision and cements himself as the GOAT.

[Mark Hammer]

I'm going with

GSP
TJ
JJ
Thompson (most likely via SD)

[Nash Diesel]

I would love nothing more than to see GSP win. There's just something in my stomach that's not sitting well when I think of the fight, like I'm going to be sad when Bisping knocks him out in the first 2 rounds or something, idk. I'll be rooting for GSP that's for sure.

[Mark Hammer]

I had never heard of this Borrachinha chap so I looked him up and on paper he is legit. 10-0 all first round finishes except his last fight which ended in the second.Handsome bastard too:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Borrachinha_galo.jpg

I definitely get the feeling Hendricks is being offered as a sacrificial lamb

[Spedizzo]

I am taking:

GSP (I keep going back and forth on this one. The way I look at it is, if size wasn't a factor, who would you pick? 100% GSP. I don't think the size difference is a enough to bet against him.)

Cody (TJ can win, but after what Cody did to Dom I will never bet against him.)

Joanna (I think she wins by UD, beats Rose everywhere.)

Stephen Thompson (too big and too counter-esque I believe for Masdival)

[Spedizzo]

Cool video that shows Jorge's street fighting days:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efptSyDU3sg

[Spedizzo]

Imagine him vs. Nick Diaz

[Mark Hammer]

Yeah. Or Nate. Big fan of Jorge, like Professor Batter said his record doesn't really do him justice. And like you said I think Thompson is too "elusivey" for him.

[Fanny Batter]

Masvidal is a great fighter, he's just too comfortable in there. It's like he wants to enjoy himself for fifteen minutes sometimes rather than just take somebody out. When he's clinical, like he was in the three fights before the Maia bout, he's fantastic. The way he tore Cowboy apart to the head and body was superb. It's like he's made to be a pressure fighter but prefers to work off the counter; if the pressure fighter comes to play against Wonderboy he can do damage as Wonderboy doesn't move his head off the centre line much. Going to be a very high level fight.

Press conference was reasonably entertaining. Bisping is fun to listen to. Garbrandt and Dillashaw brought it with the back and forth too, that's got needle. Between these two and Cruz, there's quite a three way rivalry there. And while Cody clearly beat Cruz, Dominick did take two rounds on all three scorecards of a FOTN so it's not like a rematch there wouldn't sell. Cruz/Dillashaw was super close. I wouldn't mind the loser fighting Cruz (should he beat Rivera) for an interim title or at least over five rounds, because I really want the winner against Mighty Mouse at flyweight. That's Demetrious' Chael Sonnen fight.

[Mark Hammer]

It's a brilliant completely organic 3 way feud between the top three bantamweights in the world. Any one could theoretically swap Ws and Ls with the others.

[Mark Hammer]

I just noticed that James Vick is fighting Joe Duffy at the top of the prelims. I met Vick the night before he shellacked Abel Trujillo. He and one of his coaches came in. Coach had a cocktail, Vick had water and a bowl of grub. I remember being taken back at how large he was, this is a guy that fights at 155 but he's tall and in good shape.

[Fanny Batter]

Vick's a pretty good fighter who has started to fight to his strengths, using his length well. Think he's about 6'3 and not particularly lanky with it either. The fight with Duffy is interesting because Duffy has really sound boxing and combinations so if he can get inside he should have a speed advantage. Winner should get a top 15 opponent for sure.

[OD50]

Think I take Bisping, Cody and JJ here.

[Droid]

My picks are

Bisbing - his size, him being a decent boxer, his takedown defense is pretty good and him fighting pretty regularly since GSP has been gone give him the edge.

Garbrandt - I think his fighting style mixed with his fight IQ give him the win.

JJ - I feel she's better than Rose anywhere the fight goes.

As for the Thompson/Masvidal fight - It's a close one to me. They are both skilled and have beaten some quality opponents. I lean more towards Masvidal but not by much.

Costa - His 8.8 significant strikes landed per minute and his almost 60% striking accuracy will win it for him as long as it stays on the feet.

This card overall is amazingly stacked and I hope no one has to call out for any reason. I'm quite looking forward to the GSP and Bisbing fight the most even tho its an odd fight.

[OD50]

I see JJ and Bisping winning via decision, I could see Cody finishing TJ. Something about Dillashaw feels off in the training footage so far, he seems slow or something, not sure.

[Nash Diesel]

There is something seriously creepy about JJ and her desire to touch other women. Go back and watch her on TUF, she is very into a couple of the girls on her team. I've just never really seen a fighter so touchy feely at the weigh ins. Especially when she'll put her fist on their face then immediately spring back like she got her fill by touching Thug's lips over and over.

[Mark Hammer]

Creepy?

[Mark Hammer]

Also Bisping via decision is a bold prediction. GSP has never lost a decision. Hell, he rarely loses rounds.

[virms]

Lots of people predicting Bisping.

[Mark Hammer]

The via decision part was the part I was referring to.

[Mark Hammer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X38QOJHGGY0

I am sooooo hyped for this.

[The Law]

Was thinking of going tonight but the nosebleeds are $150.

[Mark Hammer]

Ouch. No wonder tickets didn't sell out like they'd hoped. Still though, it's a ridiculous card and might be worth the price of admission just to witness the return of the GOAT.

Have I mentioned that I'm freaking stoked for this tonight?

[Mik]

Bisping, TJ, JJ, Wonderboy.

[Tainted Eclipse]

gsp, tj, jj, thompson

[Tainted Eclipse]

holy fuck that's a good start to the night. crazy KO.

[Mark Hammer]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oFoCufFd3JE

12:41

Ridiculous. That was Firas Zihabi's (GSP's head coach) little brother on the wrong end of that too. Hopefully not an omen.

[Tainted Eclipse]

lol, the finishes on this show are either incredibly awesome or incredibly stupid.

[Mark Hammer]

That was bs. He was already throwing the kick by the time the ref stepped in. Rogan and DC are incorrect here.

[Mark Hammer]

My boy James Vick ladies and gentlemen.

[Tainted Eclipse]

paulo p4p handsomest fighter in UFC?

[Droid]

Really heavy hits but that stopage in the Hendrix/Costa fight was a little early I think.

[kangus]

*DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP EXHALE*

[Tainted Eclipse]

damn this was a good card.

[Torn]

Gutted for Bisping but what a card that was

[Droid]

Same but both Bisping and GSP brought it and there had to be a winner.

[SheltonLondon]

Was there tonight, fucking incredible. So many great fights and finishes. Rose's win got one of the craziest reactions I've ever seen. Hardly any of the fighters I wanted to win going in won but didn't really matter. GSP is a hero, I was pretty sure he was getting fucked up by the end of the second round.

Never been a huge fan of Bisping historically, but got a lot of respect for the guy after this run he's been on. Tough, hard working bastard, and glad to see him have his time at the top in all honesty. He had George fucked up there from the ground, a lot of people thought that George was falling at that point!

That Costa lad is a fucking unit, think he's the real deal. Looked absolutely phenomenal in there, even though Hendricks is only really a gate keeper these days he's without the juice. Could see him being a huge star if he can get a couple more wins.
Seriously overwhelmed by how good that was, a lot of people calling it one of their best shows ever. Pretty sure I agree :yes: Tickets were expensiveeeee but well worth it!

What a night!

[Eddie Brock]

Fantastic win for GSP. One of the better comeback wins for a fighter in sports. Very rare to see a guy come back from such a layoff to get a win of that caliber.

[Mik]

What a fucking card.

[Chris Scott]

What a quality card that was, I’ll be watching this later on again.

[OD50]

Man, was I ever way off on the three title fights. Doesn't matter, really happy about the results. :yes:

[Mik]

It was fantastic, a great night for the good guys and a smack down for the trash talkers.

Wonderboy just bamboozled Masvidal.

TJ looked very big against Garbrandt, who is obviously the future of the division. It was excellent to see him get smashed as he's a pure prick, but he is undeniably talented. TJ would absolutely dwarf MM at 135lbs and I can't see any change of him dropping another 10lbs to get to Mighty Mouse.

Rose caught JJ and put her away, that was an excellent in great movement and game-planning. JJ also looked huge comparatively. I can't see Rose holding on to the title, but they need to market the fuck out of her, I don't understand how she isn't a big star already. There was a risk of JJ clearing out the division, so this breathes some big life back into it.

GSP just showed how important fight IQ is. Bisping had most of the physical advantages, GSP was obviously gassing and slowing down. Even so his technique won that fight. How can you say that he's not the GOAT?

[Nash Diesel]

GSP is hands down the current GOAT

Rose winning was beautiful. TJ looked great as well. Wonderboy is amazing. Plus the prelims had some amazing finishes from OSP and Vick.

[Fanny Batter]

Yeah, that was a gigantic win for GSP's standing as an all time great. Came back from four years out, survived adversity with the cuts, scored a clean knockdown then put the middleweight champion of the world out cold with a choke. I know that Bisping isn't considered a world beater but he's tough as shit, only stopped 3 times in his previous 27 UFC fights, and 2 of those to guys on TRT. Very impressed by St-Pierre. I think with the ring rust gone he's got some things to trouble Whitaker as it's clear his wrestling is still something great and he looks like he carries more power at 185 too.

Come from behind win for Dillashaw too was remarkable. 2 great fighters, as they were saying on commentary if they were to fight 10 times they'd split them five apiece, but on this night TJ had a bit of luck with when the round ended and possibly took advantage of Cody thinking he had it in the bag after that. Dillashaw vs. Mighty Mouse sounds bonkers if that can happen. Garbrandt will come again, he is a top fighter.

Shocked by Rose, but perhaps shouldn't have been. Joanna was rocked by Karolina and dropped by Gadelha, two girls not renowned for their power, so maybe her chin isn't the greatest. But even still she was so dominant through the rest of those fights that her flaws were forgotten. Rose landed a great shot and showed super killer instinct to get her out of there. As Mik said, there's high star potential in her, but whether she'll be good enough to build on it consistently remains to be seen.

Wonderboy dissected Masvidal. Great performance. He's probably stuck in the mud for a little while in that division but there's loads of fresh contenders for him to face now while hoping Woodley loses the belt.

Hendricks is done. Costa looked good but Johny has nothing left so we won't get a true feel for his potential until he fights a live top 15 opponent.

Some big stoppages on the prelims. OSP's sure turned his career around this year. James Vick looks good for a top 10 challenge. Great card all round.

[Mark Hammer]

What a night of fights.

GSP is the GOAT. Not just "currently", but of all time. While he looked good for the weight (vs Hendricks in comparison) he was still noticeably slowing down by the second round and I still don't know how I feel about his chances vs some of the monsters of that division. He'll probably do well vs Whitaker, a small MW himself, but Mike was a handful. Ideally he'll defend vs Robert in Australia next March and then drop down to either take back his natural division or for a megafight vs Conor (that GSP should win comfortably). It was great seeing him return to form, that's my favorite fighter ever and outside of some likely stamina issues he looked better than ever.

TJ Killashaw, Thrillashaw, Dolla Dolla Billashaw Dillashaw (copyright DC). Him winning was the best case scenario for that division as it extends that brilliant three way bantamweight feud. Should Dominic get through Rivera (fingers crossed) that rematch is an easy sell, and Cody is still in the mix with his win over Cruz as well. I'd hate to be anyone else in that division as you would have to think the title scene will be held up by those three at least for another year. TJ looked great and was impressive overcoming the adversity of getting dropped and badly hurt at the end of the first round. Great fight.

Thug Rose, who ever would have seen that coming. I like Joanna but she really deserved to lose that. Rose keeping her composure through all the trash talk and mind games leading to the fight only to win emphatically in the first round, strictly striking was poetic. Her record doesn't really do her justice as she entered the UFC in her early 20s with just a couple of pro fights vs the best the division had to offer. She's found her stride and I look forward to seeing how she follows up this monumental upset. Deserved or not you have to imagine her first defense will be Joanna, the previously undefeated ruler of the division. There aren't many top ranked fighters with momentum at 115 lbs. I love Michelle Waterson but for the sake of the division Tecia Torres needs to beat her next month.

Wonderboy vs Gamebred was probably the least surprising fight of the night. A tactical contest with Thompson comfortably out-skilling Masvidal. 30-26 or not however he didn't really do much to cement a return to the title picture, not with Till, Lawler/RDA, and Covington each on the cusp with comfortable claims as next in line.

Johny Hendricks has no business fighting at MW, he looks terribly out of shape and will get creamed by any half decent fighter at that weight. I admire his heart and honestly thought the stoppage was premature but it was the inevitable beginning of the end regardless.

UFC 217 delivered. Hail GSP.

[Mark Hammer]

paulo p4p handsomest fighter in UFC?

He's up there.

[Spedizzo]

wow.

insane card.

I thought Bisping had the fight after round 2, with GSP taking deep breaths and look visibly slower. Then GSP finished a tough guy like Bisping in awesome fashion.

TJ/Cody was a crazy fight. I think if they fight 10 times, they go 5/5. I want to see TJ vs. MM.

Speechless about Joanna/Rose. Never would have thought it would have ended like that. "THUG ROSE, THUG ROSE, THUG ROSE" kind of which DC would have STFU

[Nash Diesel]

I might be in the minority but I can't stand Cormier. His fights are fine, but whenever he talks I want to smash his head in with a pick axe.

[PullOut King]

Absolutely loved this card, might be the best I've seen. 3 title changes with compelling storylines and the introduction of the new beast at welterweight. Costa absolutely dismantled Hendricks. Sure, he's relegated to gatekeeper but this dude was former champ. Costa just put the division on notice with this performance.

What a stud dillashaw is. Saved by the bell after getting.rocked in R1 and comes back with high kick and then eventual tko.

And dam im so happy for GSP. Newfound muscle density had him gassing in R2 but he still pulled it out.

[Pablo Diablo]

Speechless about Joanna/Rose. Never would have thought it would have ended like that. "THUG ROSE, THUG ROSE, THUG ROSE" kind of which DC would have STFU

Oh god. That was so annoying.

What an excellent main event card that was. Probably the first I watched completely through in a while and it was not a disappointment.

[Spedizzo]

I might be in the minority but I can't stand Cormier. His fights are fine, but whenever he talks I want to smash his head in with a pick axe.

I dont mind him so much because I think hes a good guy and an amazing fighter and on UFC Tonight is pretty funny, but he has annoying tendencies when it comes to commentary. He thinks he is calling a WWE match and tries to get people over by being really annoying.

At least I attribute it to WWE-style of commentating because I know he is a wrestling fan

Dana White said when they got rid of Joe Rogan they would have a dream team of commentators, but its been really bad. I miss Mike Goldberg/Joe Rogan combo more than I ever would have thought. When I hear them play clips of his commentary, it just sounds right

Dominick Cruz is awesome, but too soft spoken. And Cormier is the opposite & annoying

[Nash Diesel]

Are people focusing too much on GSP's speed? I just read an interview with Whitaker (can't believe he's only 26) and he was talking about GSP looked slower. I think he did as well but I also think being out for 4 years and not having that real Octagon vibe probably had some affect right? Idk. Either way, he finished a dude who's only been finished 2 other times in 15 years and GSP isn't exactly the finisher of finishers. Whitaker is going to have a tough test and so will GSP.

[Mik]

I like Cormier as a fighter and don’t mind him as a commentator but his tendencies like the ‘thug rose, thug rose’ are obnoxious. Please someone on the team tell him not to do it.

[Mark Hammer]

The "Thug Rose" stuff was fine. Clearly inspired by JR and his "Stone Cold! Stone Cold! Stone Cold!" trope. I love DC as a fighter and think he's incredible on commentary; the only time I haven't cared for him was when he was trying way too hard during the build to both Jones fights, somehow managing to come across as the bad guy vs Jon Jones.

Cub Swanson put out a tweet following UFC 217: "Cocky champion < Calm challenger". That was the perfect narrative for this fight card.

[Mark Hammer]

Absolutely loved this card, might be the best I've seen. 3 title changes with compelling storylines and the introduction of the new beast at welterweight. Costa absolutely dismantled Hendricks. Sure, he's relegated to gatekeeper but this dude was former champ. Costa just put the division on notice with this performance.

What a stud dillashaw is. Saved by the bell after getting.rocked in R1 and comes back with high kick and then eventual tko.

And dam im so happy for GSP. Newfound muscle density had him gassing in R2 but he still pulled it out.

Welcome to the forums, I like your username. But FYI Paulo Costa is a middleweight.

[Mark Hammer]

Are people focusing too much on GSP's speed? I just read an interview with Whitaker (can't believe he's only 26) and he was talking about GSP looked slower. I think he did as well but I also think being out for 4 years and not having that real Octagon vibe probably had some affect right? Idk. Either way, he finished a dude who's only been finished 2 other times in 15 years and GSP isn't exactly the finisher of finishers. Whitaker is going to have a tough test and so will GSP.

He finished fights regularly before adopting a super safe style. He didn't fight that way vs Bisping; he took risks and showed what he could do.

[OD50]

It was crazy how safety minded GSP became after Serra 1, he even started throwing a super-man JAB to avoid getting countered. He also started to throw more kicks from his lead, left leg for the same reason, much safer but also much less power (he dropped Shields though). Against Bisping I was surprised how much he was sitting down and committing to his power punches, especially the overhand right.

:yes:

[Mark Hammer]

Did anybody catch Blaydes/Oliynyk on the early prelims?


The referee originally believed Blaydes delivered an illegal kick to a downed opponent and called a doctor to check on Oliynyk. The fight was stopped due to the doctor's advice. The replay, however, showed the strike did not deliver significant damage (as it only grazed the ear), and the fight was ruled a TKO win for Blaydes.

Based on this I assume Oliynyk hammed it up and got a TKO loss for his performance? Lol if that's the case.