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StoneColdChris
May 20th, 2013, 10:29 PM
We've noticed, we've heard the crowd reactions and it's pretty obvious that Daniel Bryan is the most consistently over guy in the company. I'm surprised the WWE hasn't taken advantage of this and started pushing towards the main event scene. Maybe now that he's lost the tag titles, they can start. Maybe he wins the WWE title MITB match in July to start his main event push?

Atty
May 20th, 2013, 10:32 PM
Put the title on him for the next eight years. Simple.

StoneColdChris
May 20th, 2013, 10:34 PM
Put the title on him for the next eight years. Simple.

I second this notion!

The Law
May 20th, 2013, 10:52 PM
He'd make a good challenger for Ziggler at Summerslam, and I could see him winning the World Heavyweight Championship. If they were to turn him heel, he could absolutely handle a feud with John Cena. I think that would be excellent: Bryan as the bitter King of the Indys who is disgusted by the fact that John Cena, a man who can't lace his boots, is the standard bearer for WWE. I feel like Bryan and Cena would be an excellent combination both in and out of the ring.

Also, if Punk is going to continue to be a heel when he comes back I would love to see a feud between him and Bryan over the title of "Best in the World."

Andy
May 20th, 2013, 11:03 PM
What to do with him? Put him in the main event right now. One of the easier conundrums for WWE. Just don't turn him heel for fucks sake.

mr sabu
May 20th, 2013, 11:04 PM
put a mask on him

Andy
May 20th, 2013, 11:07 PM
wrong thread

mth
May 20th, 2013, 11:46 PM
I'd have him and Kane feud but keep them both faces with the comedic flavor they've had as a team. Now they're mad at each other and arguing they were the reason they were champs, etc. So they have contests to see who can win a match faster, win a gauntlet match, etc. trying to prove they're better. One of them is about to win the challenges but the other attacks him to stop it, leading to them deciding to settle it the old fashioned way. Tehn either have a trilogy of matches between them or a 2/3 Falls match, winner gets a World Title shot. Bryan goes over in the end and then goes after Ziggler and wins the belt. Kane gets grumpy and turns monstrous (but still a face) for awhile and eventually he can earn a title shot against DB later on after they've both had a couple of feuds with other people.

Jordo
May 21st, 2013, 2:26 AM
Super underdog face against a champion ryback

Or lesnar I'd love to see that.

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 9:32 AM
I think with someone with as much talent as Bryan you milk it for all it's worth, And build on it in the process. He should cut a promo saying his next goal is to recapture the WHC or Win the WWE Title and become the best champion ever. But he never gets his opportunity. Other guys get the chance before him while he is on a tear beating everyone put in front of him. But the authority figure keeps holding him back do to his size and look. Until MITB or preferably Royal Rumble comes around and he wins. Setting up his opportunity to reach his goals.

It should take time and build anticipation and truly cement him as a main event star. WWE all to often just throws the title on a guy and let's him sink or swim. They don't take time to build a connection with the fans. Like they used to. Shawn Michaels "boyhood dream" angle was one of the best angle's ever, The best imo. It pulled everyone in, the connection was established. The interest was there and they tied it all together with the biggest match possible on the biggest stage possible and reaped the benefits for close to 2 decades.

Daniel Bryan deserves the same opportunity.

The Law
May 21st, 2013, 10:45 AM
The biggest issue with building up anticipation for guys winning the title is that everyone wins the title in today's WWE. The most accomplished member of the roster to not have been a world champion is probably Ryback. No one who wrestles above the midcard hasn't been world champion. Ziggler winning the title from Del Rio would have been a bigger moment if he hadn't had a ten minute title reign in 2011. Swagger challenging Del Rio would have seemed more important if he hadn't already had a run with the belt.

They've started to correct course on this, but it's still going to take some time before we get some truly great championship win moments. I'm struggling to remember the last time somebody's first title win really felt like a big deal. Jeff Hardy in 2008? It seems like every time a guy got it after that it was either too soon for people to really care about them or they used Money in the Bank so there wasn't any build to it.

Andy
May 21st, 2013, 10:52 AM
I think if Daniel Bryan wins the WWE title from John Cena or Ryback it would feel like a really big deal.

Ringo
May 21st, 2013, 10:59 AM
Sheamus beating Cena was a big deal, but it was different. Shock at this new guy getting a "fluke" win over the all conquering Champion.

You're right though. All MITB wins since then. They've been big moments, mainly due to shock factor, but haven't necessarily led to the wrestler in question establishing themselves.

You have also made me want to watch Jeff's win again. They built to it so well too - much better than the short term booking we generally get these days. What a moment. And that image, standing tall on top of the castle with the titan tron behind him...

http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/old_ep_slide/public/ep/image/2011/05/20110601_past_ppvs_armageddon08_d_r.jpg

http://twrnetwork.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/G4bj.I805380-02.jpg

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 11:06 AM
Oh man, that steady push for Jeff from the Umaga feud, through the Orton feud, through the Triple H feud/learning experience, to finally winning the title was magical. It's a horrible shame about what happened afterwards, because Jeff was genuinely the hottest thing in wrestling for a solid year.

Peter Griffin
May 21st, 2013, 11:07 AM
Shame Jeff is a complete cunt really.

StoneColdChris
May 21st, 2013, 11:15 AM
I'd count Christian winning the world title in 2011 as the last big first title win moment

Obviously not counting MITB wins

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 11:18 AM
Not taking anything away from Christian, but I don't think his title win is remembered quite so fondly. I know a lot of people were happy about it at the time, but he won a vacant title on a 3 week build up over a still midcard Alberto Del Rio.

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 11:31 AM
What happened with Jeff? He was a big deal? lol I missed all of it.

Ringo
May 21st, 2013, 11:36 AM
Drugs.

Then he went to TNA and became their Champion, the star of Hogan's heel Immortal stable.

Then more drugs. And he turned up fucked at a PPV where he was main eventing with Sting so Sting just ended it in like a minute.

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 11:38 AM
What happened with Jeff? He was a big deal? lol I missed all of it.

He came back to WWE in 2006 after a stint with TNA. Since he had left originally under drug issues and basic dick hattery, WWE made him work tons of midcard matches to start with, and Jeff actually was fantastic in those matches. He looked like a new person, and was stealing shows left and right, so they bumped him up into a feud with Umaga which was completely fantastic entertainment.

Then, when Randy Orton was the heel champion, they had Jeff unsuccessfully pursue him for the title for awhile, kicking into motion the idea that Jeff Hardy has never reached the moutaintop, but that it was time for him to go for it. And so the rest of the year revolved around Jeff learning how to be a successfully main event wrestler, including a prolonged friendship/rivalry with Triple H as they both chased after it. In the end, Hardy beat Triple H, and then finally won the title on the last show of 2008 and it was a big deal. At the time, he was easily the second most over man in the company behind Cena, and he was on his way to surpassing him.

Then everything fell apart, Jeff got busted for 100 different drug violations and now he's back in TNA.

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 11:38 AM
Then more drugs. And he turned up fucked at a PPV where he was main eventing with Sting so Sting just ended it in like a minute.

That's even underselling what happened.

Ringo
May 21st, 2013, 11:41 AM
Feel free to go into detail :yes:

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 11:45 AM
This is Vice and I reviewing it for Cewsh Reviews. I'll spoiler it because it is lengthy.


Segment – TNA World Heavyweight Championship – Sting(s To Have This On Your Resume) © vs. Jeff (Foreboding) Hardy.


Cewsh: Okay, the rest of this show was really just sprigs of parsley on a plate. This is the entrée you boys and girls have been waiting for, so I wont keep you from it any longer. For the sake of covering this match fully, I will break it into 4 parts. The backstory, what I saw, what we know about what really happened, and my thoughts. Sound good? Alright, let’s do this. First the backstory.



Part 1: The Backstory.


Now obviously Jeff Hardy has made himself into the Crown Jewel of Immortal recently, and has ruffled a few feathers ever since but this story actually dates back much further than that. The story goes back to the beginning of Sting and Hulk Hogan in WCW. Hogan had always fucked everything up and Sting had always fought him, and that caused Sting to be paramoid when Hogan came to TNA. That paranoia resulted in Sting seeing Immortal coming a mile away but being unable to convince everyone except for D’Angelo Dinero (who went insane) and Kevin Nash (who went to WWE). So he left, only to come back in Immortal’s darkest hour and vanquish Jeff Hardy as a surprise opponent for the title chosen by “The Network”.

Now Sting is the champion and Jeff is coming for him. Theoretically.



Part 2: What I Saw.


Alright then. An awesome video package leads us in and then Jeff Hardy’s awesome music hits. This is pretty much guaranteed to be awesome. His music plays for a good 40 seconds before Hardy comes stumbling out of the entrance, singing along to his own music and haphazardly doing spurts of his little dance like he’s not sure whether he’s supposed to or not. Then he wanders down to the ring, and trips getting into it with a big dopey grin on his face, that just looks strange with his wacky clown paint.

At this point Jeff seems strange, but not super visibly impaired. I mean, you’d see worse walking by a college in the middle of the day.

They get into the ring and JB does the ring introductions. Of course Sting is in the ring, but Jeff is outside it, seemingly being talked out by half the roster, from camera guys to agents to referees. As Jeff enters the ring, referee Brian Hebner gets a close up and genuinely looks anxious, like something is seriously wrong and he doesn’t know what to do. Still, Borash and Sting do their bit while Hardy makes faces in the corner until suddenly Eric Bischoff comes out and announces that there is a change of plans.

He announces that this is going to be a No DQ match now to allow revenge for what happened on Impact. Bisch also, while doing this, visibly tells Sting something he doesn’t want the camera to see him say. Throughout this Jeff makes no reaction whatsoever, including when Sting lays out Bischoff who falls right onto Hardy who expresses mild surprise at this, like you might if you found a gummy bear stuck to your shoe, say, or maybe a whole bunch of drugs conveniently in your locker backstage right before your main event match.

The bell rings, and Jeff decides to spend 5 minutes trying to figure out where to throw his shirt. Sting chases him into the corner and tries to engage Jeff but Jeff just kind of stands there and when Sting moves, he goes back to trying to decide where the shirt should go. He finally throws it (it travels 9 and 2/3rds inches) and the camera cuts to Sting in time for him to audibly and visibly say “FUCK!” Sting them grabs Jeff, seems to try to do something with him, and then suddenly cycles behind him, hits the Scorpion Death Drop, and covers Jeff for the three count as Jeff blatantly attempts to kick out very much for real, even getting his shoulder up. Jeff then gapes in astonishment at Sting as Sting gives him a stern look, and celebrates with the title.

The announcers try to make it seem like nothing out of the ordinary happened (it IS TNA after all) and then Jeff throws a temper tantrum, kicking the ropes and punching the turnbuckles, and acting like an 8 year old girl who has once again found her Christmas tree innocent of a pony.

The fans begin to chant bullshit as Sting walks back up the rant, including one especially vocal fan in the front row as Sting passes. Sting looks at the guy, looks back at Jeff and loudly says into the camera “I agree.”

Then Taz and Tenay have to spend 10 minutes watching and discussing a highlight video of the show. Which is arguably a jailable offense for whomever inflicted it on them.



Part 3: What Apparently Happened.


Well that’s the rub, isn’t it? What really did happen?

I’ve been compiling information from various sources all day, and while some details are hazy and other speculation, the general story that people have formed goes like this. At some point Jeff Hardy showed up late to the Impact Zone. According to eyewitness reports (of questionable veracity but this IS TNA, not WWE, and they don’t have as stringent privacy rules) Jeff was visibly fucked up and management was freaking out about it. Jeff was said to have appeared totally out of it (which obviously jives with what we saw in the ring) but went out anyway. When Bischoff came out, he allegedly said to Sting “Hit him with the bat and go home.” Despite this Sting TRIED to get something out of him, but judged Jeff too far gone to even be left alone long enough for Sting to find the bat, so he gave him the Drop, dead weight pinned him and left in disgust.

After the show it was announced that Jeff Hardy would not be coming to the Impact tapings, and Hulk Hogan tweeted that “some serious decisions need to be made”. So make of all of this what you will.

I hate to base so much of that on rumor and heresay but, well, that’s what there is at this point.



Part 4: Thoughts.


Hmm. What were my thoughts about all of this? I don’t know, maybe something along the lines of HOLY FUCKING WHAT THE FUCKSHIT JEFF WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WHAT ARE YOU DOING WHAT THE SHIT NO WHYWHATWHYWHATWHOWHEREFUCK YOU CAN’T DO THIS YOU WERE DOING SO WELL WELL NOT REALLY WHEN I THINK ABOUT IT BUT THE WHOLE FUCKING COMPANY IS BUILT AROUND YOU AND YOU’RE GOING TO PUT EVERYONE OUT OF A JOB WHEN THE FANS SUE YOU FUCKING SHITBRICKING FUCLOADED LITTLE TWAT OF A TWEET!

Or something to that effect.

I can honestly say that if this is REAL, and let me reiterate the if on that because the way it was done could easily indicate that this was storyline all the way through, but if this is real then it is totally unheard of as far as I’m aware. To show up to the main event of a PPV sold with your name in absolutely no condition to wrestle at all and to ignore the demands of everyone around you to do so isn’t just fucking stupid, its career suicide (Note: Maybe he can become Suicide).

You know Jeff Hardy used an interesting line in the opening video tonight. “It doesn’t matter because I’m Jeff Fucking Hardy.” Based on tonight, I can’t deny that he certainly seems to feel that way. Now let me make this clear. If Jeff Hardy showed up for this match inebriated, ruined the main event of this show, and just ruined his career in one segment then this will and should go down in history as the single stupidest thing that has ever occurred in the history of professional wrestling (mud wrestling miscarriages included). If, on the other hand, this is a storyline and they’re planning on working it into a feud somehow, then it is a pathetic message to TNA fans that there is absolutely no need to buy their PPVs if they want to see matches or feuds blown off, or even any main event at all. They will have murdered the concept of their own PPVs in a way that is practically unprecedented, and might as well close them up now and try something else.

I’m sure all 3 people who bought this in the first place will be devastated. I’m just glad nobody got hurt.

But what the hell, I’m feeling charitable. Sting was the epitome of class and veteran leadership in this debacle (seriously, he was) and what’s the harm in a little silliness to end the night. You know what? Fuck it.

http://i641.photobucket.com/albums/uu132/CewshReviews/Awards/TanahashiPlatinum.gif?t=1300242675

100 out of 100.

Cewsh’s Platinum Seal of Approval.


Wait, wait, wait. Sorry. Typo.


1 out of 100.


Vice: Ahahahha this was the greatest thing I have ever seen. This whole Sting nonsense has been a load of bile on my already average dinner that TNA has been serving me lately, and the Jeff Hardy bullshit is just disgraceful. Brilliant at first, but they need to make their damn minds up with what is happening.

I didn't really have any interest in this match, so Jeff coming out completely intoxicated beyond belief and unable to actually compete was just.. amazing. So bad that it's good. It's dreadful for the company, too, and could even become catastrophic. It was a laugh out loud moment when Sting got the win a minute and a half in, after a minute and a quarter spent stalling and messing with the crowd. I do wonder if Sting just said fuck it. And this brings me to something I'd like to mention..

You know why I still have fun with American wrestling despite hating it almost constantly? Because I love it when stuff like this happens. It gets everyone talking. Everyone speculates on whether it was real or a work. People debate about whether TNA did the right thing or should have been more on the ball. What is going to happen to Jeff. What the hell is going on in Sting's mind. Stuff like that. There really are a bajillion things to talk about, and aaaaaaaaaaaaalllllll the crazies come out of the asylum to discuss their conspiracy theories, and it's so entertaining. As much as people love to say that TNA is like WCW in the Russo days, it's really not. Not even fucking close. But I almost wish TNA was at those levels. They're trying to be a decent company-- they really are. And at times they show so much hope that it's just crushing to see them fall back into their bad habits again and again. Sometimes I really do wish they'd stop trying and just become something that is universally mocked and simultaneously adored for the sheer entertainment value of the nonsense.

Charlie Sheen for TNA World Heavyweight Champion.

Book it.

So yeah, it was an insane disaster. I even wound up doing a podcast on how nuts it was for Wrestlespective because so few people actually even saw it take place, being TNA.

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 11:51 AM
Fuck man, All I can ask is Why? Isn't this all those kids ever wanted? and he threw it all away for drugs. So sad but happens far to often in this society.

Thanks for the responces. Gonna read that review now.

Jimmy Zero
May 21st, 2013, 12:02 PM
Fuck man, All I can ask is Why? Isn't this all those kids ever wanted? and he threw it all away for drugs. So sad but happens far to often in this society.

Thanks for the responces. Gonna read that review now.

Me thinks you've never dealt with an addiction, or had a person close to you deal with an addiction.

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 12:12 PM
Me thinks you've never dealt with an addiction, or had a person close to you deal with an addiction.

Yep. As harsh as I was to Hardy in that review and elsewhere, the man is an addict, it's as simple as that. He's never been to rehab of any kind, and he's prone to relapses, as any drug addict is. That TNA brought him back and put him the exact same situation without him having had any rehabilitation whatsoever is reprehensible on their part.

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 12:19 PM
Me thinks you've never dealt with an addiction, or had a person close to you deal with an addiction.

Me thinks you shouldn't make assumptions about such things. I was addicted to methamphetamine for years, Quit Cold Turkey. I Smoked Pot for the better half of my young life, Quit cold Turkey. Smoked Cigarette's for over 15 Years and quit cold turkey.

I've battled with my own addiction problems in life.

If you want something bad enough and have the will power to better yourself you can do anything. I didn't have as much to throw away as Jeff Hardy. I wasn't living out my dreams....I wasn't successful at anything. But I knew that I wanted more from my life. And I did everything in my power to achieve what I wanted. And I did.

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 12:22 PM
Major props for that, Kimura. Appreciate you sharing that with us, and that's one fucking impressive accomplishment.

Ringo
May 21st, 2013, 12:24 PM
...and not everyone is the same. That's a pretty narrow-minded view to hold.

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 12:30 PM
...and not everyone is the same. That's a pretty narrow-minded view to hold.

"If you want something bad enough and have the will power to better yourself you can do anything."

Yeah super narrow-minded

Hard time understanding how that's narrow-minded.

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 12:33 PM
Because it isn't necessarily true for everyone.

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 12:39 PM
We can agree to disagree.

I guess I may be closed minded. I don't agree that people aren't in controll of their own destiny. I truly feel If you have the will power and desire to change, you can.

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 12:43 PM
Probably. But there are so many reasons why people are prevented by their own brains or situations from being able to use that willpower, or even to possess it at all.

The Law
May 21st, 2013, 12:45 PM
The problem with that logic is that it's circular: If someone changes, then you can say that it's because their willpower was strong. If they fail, then their willpower wasn't strong. What if someone had even stronger willpower than you did, but failed to kick their addiction because their addiction was strong than yours?

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 12:47 PM
Yeah, I guess you guys are right. Sometiomes I don't think things through all the way.

Sorry if I came across like an asshole with a superiority complex.

Jimmy Zero
May 21st, 2013, 12:48 PM
Me thinks you shouldn't make assumptions about such things. I was addicted to methamphetamine for years, Quit Cold Turkey. I Smoked Pot for the better half of my young life, Quit cold Turkey. Smoked Cigarette's for over 15 Years and quit cold turkey.

I've battled with my own addiction problems in life.

If you want something bad enough and have the will power to better yourself you can do anything. I didn't have as much to throw away as Jeff Hardy. I wasn't living out my dreams....I wasn't successful at anything. But I knew that I wanted more from my life. And I did everything in my power to achieve what I wanted. And I did.

Well if you've been through it, I'd have thought you would actually be able to, you know, not have such a narrow and asinine view of it. Go figure.

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 12:48 PM
It's all good. We should probably get this back to what they should do with Daniel Bryan.

Personally, I just desperately want another match with Sheamus.

Stanford
May 21st, 2013, 12:50 PM
So I think we all agree that Daniel Bryan should wrestle with drug addiction for the fate of Jeff Hardy's soul. Good chat.

Kimura Kid
May 21st, 2013, 12:51 PM
Well if you've been through it, I'd have thought you would actually be able to, you know, not have such a narrow and asinine view of it. Go figure.

Prolly just not as educated about it as you. Was only going off my own experiences with addiction.

I apologize.

Jacknife
May 21st, 2013, 12:55 PM
It's all good. We should probably get this back to what they should do with Daniel Bryan.

Personally, I just desperately want another match with Sheamus.

This time with Sheamus as a heel?

Cewsh
May 21st, 2013, 12:55 PM
Hells yeah.

The Law
May 21st, 2013, 12:57 PM
As much as everyone seems to love Bryan as a face, I'd love to see him turn heel and go after John Cena. All I can think of is this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7hRwRk9vF4

"You are not better than me." Those words form the basis for a great rivalry. I can envision Cena triumphant at the end of a Raw after a win in the main event. Then Daniel Bryan appears from out of nowhere and kicks his head in. Locks him in the LeBell Lock. Tortures him. Because he hates John Cena. More than he hates John Cena, he hates what John Cena represents: the triumphant of phony, WWE-style wrestling over real wrestling, the triumph of flash over substance. Daniel Bryan spent years traveling the world, wrestling in flea market gyms for $50 a night. Meanwhile, John Cena was immediately tagged for greatness and handed the world on a silver platter. While Daniel Bryan was getting dropped on his head in front of 50 people in Hoboken, New Jersey, John Cena was making movies. When Daniel Bryan finally got a chance at wrestling in WWE, he was humiliated on NXT, buried by WWE's top hack (Michael Cole) and unceremoniously fired. Finally, he forced WWE to care and won the World Heavyweight Championship. What did he get? Relegated to the opening match of Wrestlemania while John Cena fought in the main event, despite not holding any title at all. Now Daniel Bryan is going to prove to the world that he's the best and that John Cena is a fraud.

In substance, this is very similar to the Punk/Cena feud from 2011, except without the part where Punk was leaving the company as champion. But rehashing one of WWE's best feuds of the last decade wouldn't be a bad thing. Also, these guys could absolutely tear it up in the ring together.

Badger
May 21st, 2013, 1:00 PM
And if Bryan could get us those ice cream bars, that'd be great.

Andy
May 21st, 2013, 2:34 PM
I would expect a Bryan/Cena feud to be amazing if it happens. They must've spent a hell of a lot of time together recently so I'm sure they've bounced some ideas off eachother.

OD50
May 21st, 2013, 3:07 PM
I'm guessing DB turns heel, feuds and wrestles Kane at/around SummerSlam, goes after Cena.. Loses at/around Survivor Series and then goes back to the mid-card.

mr sabu
May 21st, 2013, 8:57 PM
db vs a panda at payback

Kev
May 21st, 2013, 9:10 PM
Bryan/Cena (both as faces) & Bryan/Lesnar would be immense for me.

I'm also keen to see him mix it up with the likes of Cesaro, Ziggler (yes, again), Swagger (I think he could really help put over Swagger's offense) and Wade Barrett more often. And while I personally don't want to see him in the midcard division, how Vince see's the bloke and how I see the bloke are two very different views, I imagine.

HHHnFoley_Rulez
May 22nd, 2013, 6:27 PM
Ken Shamrock style "snap" - that's what he needs. And a bigger beard.

Ochoa
May 22nd, 2013, 6:49 PM
Last big first title win for me was Henry. Anyway, If they turn DB, I'd love to see him with Heyman.

Beer-Belly
May 23rd, 2013, 4:05 AM
I said it in the Smackdown thread, but making Kane the 911 to Daniel Bryan's Sabu would be incredible.

StoneColdChris
June 1st, 2013, 10:50 AM
Just watched Smackdown.....BRYAN IS ON FIRE!!!!!! CAPITALIZE ON IT

Ringo
June 1st, 2013, 12:18 PM
epic moment. Definitely further suggests a face push.

OD50
June 1st, 2013, 2:34 PM
I know it would be moronic but I still expect DB to turn heel on Kane and then be Cena's next feud after Ryback.

ReDPath
June 1st, 2013, 8:25 PM
What to do with Daniel Bryan?

Well obviously, you release the man.

Heres why....

1. HBK
2. Chris Jericho
3. Bret Hart
4. Jeff Hardy
5. Randy Savage, arguably a bigger guy
6. CM Punk

The short list of short guys they actually made a considerable effort in getting over enough to be a top guy without giving up on them completely.

Vince likes above average-to giant sized guys, its well documented. Regardless of whether or not they fizzle out, the proof is in the pudding.

1. Giant Gonzalez
2. Vladimor Kozlov
3. Bobby Lashley
4. Umaga
5. Viscera
6. The Rock
7. Steve Austin
8. Hulk Hogan
9. Scott Hall
10. Kevin Nash
11. Undertaker
12. Kane
13. Brock Lesnar
14. Ryback
15. Deano Bravo
16. Hercules
17. Barbarian
18. Warlord
19. Lex Luger
20. Sid
21. Bam Bam Bigelow
22. Roddy Piper
23. Ahmed Johnson
24. Ron Simmons
25. Bradshaw
26. One Man Gang
27. Earthquake
28. Bossman
29. Yokozuna
30. Vader

And...that's probably a short list of guys who were mixed successful/unsuccessful. Nevetheless guys Vince really liked at one time or another.

Mills
June 1st, 2013, 8:27 PM
http://hotnerdgirl.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/double-facepalm1.jpg

HHHnFoley_Rulez
June 2nd, 2013, 10:55 AM
http://static.quickmeme.com/media/social/qm.gifhttp://static.quickmeme.com/media/social/qm.gifhttp://img94.imageshack.us/img94/2161/frymeme.png

DJAOAS
June 2nd, 2013, 11:25 AM
Bryan is so ridiculously over as a face, why would they turn him when they're so short on over faces. He consistently gets pops at the same level or greater than Cena. A feud with Ziggler makes sense for all involved. Two guys that can work, are entertaining on the mic. Bryan could get Ziggler the heel heat that he's not really had since he left Vickie and it wouldnt put too much emphasis on either guy's size, which WWE may or may not be worried about.

JP
June 2nd, 2013, 12:46 PM
Can't believe I'm going to say this, but have Ryback beat Cena for the belt and have Bryan go after it in a slight tweak of the plucky underdog role.

The slight tweak being he is utterly mental.

Mills
June 2nd, 2013, 1:50 PM
This I like but with a slight caveat.

Have Ryback take out Bryan like he did Kofi. Bryan is out for a month, and while he is out Kane challenges for the belt, but Ryback retains. The next Raw, have Ryback challenge the locker room for an open challenge and have Kofi answer it. He puts up a valiant effort but fails. Have Ryback attempt to put Kofi through a table when Bryan's music hits. Bryan runs out, saves Kofi and puts Ryback on notice.

Andy
June 2nd, 2013, 2:13 PM
The last thing you want to do at this stage is take him off TV for a month and risk losing his momentum.

Bennedy
June 2nd, 2013, 2:49 PM
What to do with Daniel Bryan?

Well obviously, you release the man.

Heres why....

1. HBK
2. Chris Jericho
3. Bret Hart
4. Jeff Hardy
5. Randy Savage, arguably a bigger guy
6. CM Punk

The short list of short guys they actually made a considerable effort in getting over enough to be a top guy without giving up on them completely.

Vince likes above average-to giant sized guys, its well documented. Regardless of whether or not they fizzle out, the proof is in the pudding.

1. Giant Gonzalez
2. Vladimor Kozlov
3. Bobby Lashley
4. Umaga
5. Viscera
6. The Rock
7. Steve Austin
8. Hulk Hogan
9. Scott Hall
10. Kevin Nash
11. Undertaker
12. Kane
13. Brock Lesnar
14. Ryback
15. Deano Bravo
16. Hercules
17. Barbarian
18. Warlord
19. Lex Luger
20. Sid
21. Bam Bam Bigelow
22. Roddy Piper
23. Ahmed Johnson
24. Ron Simmons
25. Bradshaw
26. One Man Gang
27. Earthquake
28. Bossman
29. Yokozuna
30. Vader

And...that's probably a short list of guys who were mixed successful/unsuccessful. Nevetheless guys Vince really liked at one time or another.

Why do you waste your time typing all this shit out? Do you not have a life or something?

HHHnFoley_Rulez
June 2nd, 2013, 3:04 PM
Orrrrrrrr......

Week 0: Bryan Vs Ryback, Ryback calls him "STOOOPIIDDD" and he snaps, almost has Ryback beaten when The Shield come out. Kofi and Kane run out and fend off for a while (Ryback leaves, with his title) but they get a beatdown. Ryback then returns, gives the Shellshock to Kofi and then Kane. Bryan is stirring and is pissed but can bearly stand. Ryback gets a chair and lays waste to him. Wraps it around his leg and either jumps on it for smashes Kofi down onto Bryan's leg. Ryback then leaves, laughing, as Bryan screams in agony while EMTs rush to the ring and the refs make sure Ryback backs off.

Week 1: Say he has a leg injury, have him unable to walk (he's in a chair or something at a hospital) but he demanded a title shot from Ryback, who agreed (because Bryan is practically crippled at this point) for the PPV. Have Bryan visited by Kofi who tries to apologise but Bryan is just crazy/angry and screams "NO" all the time. Have Kofi and Kane Vs two of The Shield, Ryback interferes and mocks Bryan which prompts Kane to chase him, The Shield double-team Kofi for the win.

Week 2: Bryan's arguing yes/no with doctors and vowing to come back and tear Ryback apart. Meanwhile Kofi fights Ryback and loses spectacularly.

Week 3: Then the week after he's at a rehab place, walking/limping, going "yes, yes, yes" then falls/stumbles and has to be caught and he does a platnoon-esq "NOOOOOO!", have Kane catch him or something and just say "Daniel, I can't let you do this.. I'll take down Ryback" and end on Bryan seething mouthing "No!". On that weeks RAW have Kane Vs Ryback, the Shield get involved and all 4 of them quadruple power-bomb Kane through 2 tables or from the top rope through some tables - whichever looks cooler without killing him. The Shield then turn to Ryback who backs off laughing at what they've done.

Week 4: Have them tell us that they can't get in touch with Bryan, show a CCTV video of Bryan in a hospital gown (but wearing his ring gear under it, cos he's nuts) screaming at doctors/nurses and limping out screaming about getting Ryback. Kofi is at the arena trying to reach him and goes to Booker T/Brickie for help, who wash their hands of it. Kofi leaves the arena to search for Bryan. Backstage Rollins and Ambrose find Reigns unconscious in the locker room after a fight. Ryback arrives a the arena as usual and has a match-up with Zack Ryder or something ridiculous. Matt Striker interview Ryback asking if he is concerned about Bryan and he laughs it off before bitch-slapping Striker for being a dumbass.

So it gets to Ryback Vs Ryder, Ryback wins in about 10 seconds (give or take entrances) and then pummels Ryder into the mat. This brings out Kane (who has taped ribs or some injury) to Ryback's amusement. Ryback splats Kane down after some brief offence and gives him the Shell Shock. He picks him up and does it again. The crowd are probably bored, but lets just say they're totally bought into it. The screen lights up, it's a nondescript door with a big box pushed in front of it... And Rollins and Ambrose screaming to be let out. The camera pans down and there's a hospital gown on the floor, you know, to tease Bryan.

The crowd are going nuts (yeah they are) chanting "YES! YES! YES!" just before:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ehssxWrpu4

Bryan comes steaming out with a chair, hangs on the apron, Ryback is confident and taunts him - but Kane pushes him from behind, Ryback turns to strike him which gives Bryan the opportunity to climb to the ropes and then deliver a knee + chair straight to the back of Ryback's head, taking him down. Kane roles out of the ring (in pain) and Bryan continues to blast the arms/legs of Ryback with the chair. Referee's pile out and Bryan tosses them aside like a man possessed. He puts Ryback in the Yes Lock and Ryback holds on, and on, and on, before tapping like crazy - but Bryan won't let go. More referees come out and so does Booker T. Bryan lets go but picks up the chair and chases everyone off, before hitting Ryback with it again and again applying the Yes Lock.. it seems like Ryback is out cold. Kane drags Bryan off who goes nuts celebrating as the referees scurry to rescue Ryback from further harm.


You then go into the PPV with Ryback looking like he can be stopped, Bryan looking like a madman and you've still got the outside chance that The Shield will be involved to keep all the storylines going.

....well that wasted 10 minutes of my life :yes: Never would happen. Ever. EVER.

Edit: this was in reply to taking him off TV for a month being a good way to kill his momentum. Tried to counter it slightly in a mental improbable way.

hitster
June 2nd, 2013, 3:58 PM
I'd build up towards a Bryan vs Punk match at Summerslam if they don't want to do Punk vs Cena there or have Bryan vs Ziggler and have them have a 30 minute iron man match.

VHS
June 2nd, 2013, 4:26 PM
ReDPath comes off like Patton Oswalt in his filibuster.

The Law
June 2nd, 2013, 5:57 PM
Here's a good rule to follow: Whenever you're about to accuse someone on a wrestling message board of having no life, please stop and remember that you are posting on a wrestling message board.

The Rosk
June 2nd, 2013, 7:20 PM
Turn Orton to feud with him for the No.1 contendership. Elevates both men from where they currently are and I reckon they could have some good matches. Done.

mr sabu
June 3rd, 2013, 2:00 AM
untill orton fucks up and gets his 3rd strike

The Rosk
June 3rd, 2013, 1:01 PM
But Orton's going to put him over.

Fanny Batter
June 3rd, 2013, 1:25 PM
Have him solidify himself as a main event presence, win the Royal Rumble then win the WWE title off one of the big players (Cena, Orton, Punk, Lesnar) in the main event of Wrestlemania. Everybody loves him, and they can do a lot worse than having pretty much the nicest guy in the world as champion.

OD50
June 4th, 2013, 12:16 AM
Sounds very similar to another undersized, overachiving, underappreciated, submission based workhorse.. :scared:

DJAOAS
June 4th, 2013, 11:58 AM
I wonder what they're going to do with him at Payback? Hell No Rematch with The Shield? Zzzzzz. They're so close to creating another bona fide star, they really need to feature him in a prominent way.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 1:44 PM
Dude is turning heel. It's a pretty clear story arc. Probably in the next few weeks.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 1:56 PM
If they turn him heel I seriously might take a break from WWE again.

Here you have a guy who is more over that anyone in the company right now. Probably more over than anyone has been since Punk in the summer of 2011. He's getting amazing reactions and putting on brilliant matches. If you give him a singles run as the mega face he is, he could face Cena, Ziggler, Punk, Ryback, Henry, Show etc. Or turn him heel, which would likely keep him away from the titles and have him feud with the likes of Kane, Orton, Sheamus and Jericho. I know what I'd rather see.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 2:01 PM
If they turn him heel I seriously might take a break from WWE again.

Here you have a guy who is more over that anyone in the company right now. Probably more over than anyone has been since Punk in the summer of 2011. He's getting amazing reactions and putting on brilliant matches. If you give him a singles run as the mega face he is, he could face Cena, Ziggler, Punk, Ryback, Henry, Show etc. Or turn him heel, which would likely keep him away from the titles and have him feud with the likes of Kane, Orton, Sheamus and Jericho. I know what I'd rather see.

I agree that I'd love to see that, but at the same time, his best chance to make it as a serious main eventer is to become a heel and face Cena. Until you've feuded with Cena, and actually given him a rough go of it, you are not a main eventer in this company. So while it'd be great to see him being his usual facey self and facing all the big names, he will have a glass ceiling over his head no matter how over he is until he goes heel, establishes a main event persona, and then the fans can turn him face again. That's exactly what every current main eventer not named John Cena had to do. Main event babyfaces are just main event heels who the fans came to love. Main event heels are guys that they push into those spots to face the main event babyfaces, who then are able to stick and be successful. It's the career trajectory of Sheamus, Edge, Punk, Orton and every other meaningful breakthrough babyface of the past decade.

So if you really want Daniel Bryan to succeed and to see him wearing the belt and being the guy, root for him to betray the fans and his friends and go heel. Because every boo he gets is another step up the ladder to the top. Don't let your runaway expectations keep you from enjoying what could be an awesome reality.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 2:06 PM
Dude is turning heel. It's a pretty clear story arc. Probably in the next few weeks.

I don't think I could disagree with you more.

I think they're setting him up to be one of the top faces, not just in reaction but company positioning by going after a Ryback who's beaten, easily, Cena for the belt and sent Cena for a short break.

VHS
June 4th, 2013, 2:12 PM
Turning Daniel Bryan heel shouldn't drive anybody away from WWE, why? BECAUSE IT'S STILL DANIEL BRYAN, STUPID.

Anaconda Sniper
June 4th, 2013, 2:14 PM
As long as they keep him a main player I'll be happy. But I"d love for him to win the wwe title in the next year.

The Law
June 4th, 2013, 2:15 PM
It's possible he's just developing a more serious character as a face, but it's far more likely that he's going to turn heel, because that's what almost always happens when a major tag team splits.

Also, I'd be absolutely stunned if they put the title on Ryback. He's improving rapidly as a heel, but I don't see them having Cena dump the title to him. I don't think Ryback is ready to be WWE champion, and I'd be beyond surprised if WWE had enough confidence to give him their top title and build their program around him for any period of time right now. Add in the fact that Cena never takes time off unless he's seriously injured and I don't think we're getting a Ryback title reign this summer.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 2:17 PM
I don't think I could disagree with you more.

I think they're setting him up to be one of the top faces, not just in reaction but company positioning by going after a Ryback who's beaten, easily, Cena for the belt and sent Cena for a short break.

There is absolutely zero precedent in WWE history to suggest that they would even consider using a character like Bryan is now to do that, regardless of how over he is. Like I said, I'd enjoy it, but it's not a realistic expectation, and it wouldn't necessarily be the best thing for Bryan in the long term. Asking an upper midcarder in the real main event for the first time to carry the drawing load for Cena? Even Punk, who was hotter and had more to his character, couldn't do that until he turned back heel.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 2:18 PM
It's possible he's just developing a more serious character as a face, but it's far more likely that he's going to turn heel, because that's what almost always happens when a major tag team splits.

Honestly, I don't think he is developing a more serious face character. I think what we're seeing is the beginnings of a heel turn, and that's exciting to people because it's different from the status quo.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 2:20 PM
Bryan turning heel would annoy the hell out of me in all honesty.

He is the single most over person in the entire company, full or part time. The only thing he should be doing at the moment is shooting for the stars. Luckily, I think they know this, hence why they broke him away from The Shield and onto Ryback. Not to say his stuff with The Shield is over with completely, just that he seems to have been able to change their plans from what seemed an inevitable feud with Kane to a run on top against the main heel of the company.

Now, obviously this all rests on Cena dropping the belt to Ryback, something I think he will do in 3 stages of Hell, maybe even in only 2 falls to make Ryback look as strong as possible and Cena taking a break. He hasn't had one for a while and it freshens things up.

Also, he and Kane both get to stay face, which I think is better for them both after such an endearing run. Imagine the visual of Bryan going after the WWE belt and Kane the World on the same ppv. It just feels the natural way to go with this.

They turn him heel and it just feels like a waste.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 2:23 PM
Why? The best time to turn someone heel is when the fans love them and are really invested in them. Having him betray their trust like that is how actual heat is generated. The series of matches between he and Kane could be the highlight of the summer.

Again, a big part of this is the understanding that Daniel Bryan, midcard babyface, is never going to jump straight into the main event without some kind of tangible change to his character to reflect to the fans that he is now a big deal.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 2:23 PM
I agree that I'd love to see that, but at the same time, his best chance to make it as a serious main eventer is to become a heel and face Cena. Until you've feuded with Cena, and actually given him a rough go of it, you are not a main eventer in this company. So while it'd be great to see him being his usual facey self and facing all the big names, he will have a glass ceiling over his head no matter how over he is until he goes heel, establishes a main event persona, and then the fans can turn him face again. That's exactly what every current main eventer not named John Cena had to do. Main event babyfaces are just main event heels who the fans came to love. Main event heels are guys that they push into those spots to face the main event babyfaces, who then are able to stick and be successful. It's the career trajectory of Sheamus, Edge, Punk, Orton and every other meaningful breakthrough babyface of the past decade.

So if you really want Daniel Bryan to succeed and to see him wearing the belt and being the guy, root for him to betray the fans and his friends and go heel. Because every boo he gets is another step up the ladder to the top. Don't let your runaway expectations keep you from enjoying what could be an awesome reality.

I disagree with a lot of that. Yeah, some guys have faced Cena as a heel and gained credibility that way, but none of them have beaten him convincingly. Even Punk couldn't get the last laugh despite a whole angle being based around Cena being unable to beat him for a while. Then you look at someone like Barrett/Nexus who are still trying to rebuild their credibility after running into Cena.

What Bryan is doing at the moment has gotten him so over and it's a fresh way to do it. The match against Ryback last night made both guys looks like a million dollars and put Bryan across so convincingly. Plus, Bryan has been a heel World Champion and did a brilliant job of that too. He's feuded with Punk, Show, Henry and Sheamus as a heel and done it brilliantly. He had great matches all the way through and then done some great stuff with Kane. The fans getting behind him has been totally organic and I think it would be a serious mistake to turn him heel now.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 2:24 PM
Asking an upper midcarder in the real main event for the first time to carry the drawing load for Cena? Even Punk, who was hotter and had more to his character, couldn't do that until he turned back heel.

I'm not entirely sure that's correct, though fully accept that may be pure bias on my behalf.


Also, I'd be absolutely stunned if they put the title on Ryback. He's improving rapidly as a heel, but I don't see them having Cena dump the title to him. I don't think Ryback is ready to be WWE champion, and I'd be beyond surprised if WWE had enough confidence to give him their top title and build their program around him for any period of time right now. Add in the fact that Cena never takes time off unless he's seriously injured and I don't think we're getting a Ryback title reign this summer.

See, Raw was the first time I looked upon Ryback as potentially carrying the belt successfully, and not actually because of anything Bryan did. His selling, hesitancy and general confused demeanor added a vulnerability to him which makes him more accessible and conversely much meaner in his execution of bad things to others. There were echoes of Lesnar in how he was holding himself and he could do much worse in terms of people to imitate.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 2:30 PM
Again, a big part of this is the understanding that Daniel Bryan, midcard babyface, is never going to jump straight into the main event without some kind of tangible change to his character to reflect to the fans that he is now a big deal.

Upper mid-card, former World Champion who beat off Big Show and Mark Henry to keep the belt, survived the elimination chamber and in the course of last weeks SD and this weeks Raw hasn't just looked like a million bucks but has shown the kind of excitable aggression that audiences pick up on that only a select few people have had before. People like Austin, Foley, Vader, HBK in certain situations; these are the people he is now beginning to be able to be spoken of in similar terms when it comes to the buzz he can generate with his aggression.

He is a big deal because the fans have made him a big deal, the tweaks to the character in recent weeks have just emphasised this.

If they don't run with this then they are fools.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 2:30 PM
I disagree with a lot of that. Yeah, some guys have faced Cena as a heel and gained credibility that way, but none of them have beaten him convincingly. Even Punk couldn't get the last laugh despite a whole angle being based around Cena being unable to beat him for a while. Then you look at someone like Barrett/Nexus who are still trying to rebuild their credibility after running into Cena.

You don't beat top babyfaces. Beating John Cena has nothing to do with this. In order to be a main eventer in the WWE, you have to show that you're on even footing with John Cena. That is how the pecking order has been established. Who gave Cena the hardest time? Edge, Orton, Batista, Punk, Sheamus and Big Show, among others. The company uses him as a barometer of worth, just like they used the Rock to make CM Punk and John Cena stand on that next level up, just for challenging or beating a true legend. Sometimes they put guys in there with him and it doesn't work, and so they don't work. Barrett, R-Truth, and others are examples of that. But nobody skips the system altogether and hopskips their way to stardom. That is not a thing that happens.

There's always someone who fills that role. It was Triple H before Cena, The Rock before him, Austin before him, Michaels before him, Hart before him, etc. This is the formula for creating main eventers. They weren't ever going to break it because Daniel Bryan was the most cheered guy on the show for a month straight.


What Bryan is doing at the moment has gotten him so over and it's a fresh way to do it. The match against Ryback last night made both guys looks like a million dollars and put Bryan across so convincingly. Plus, Bryan has been a heel World Champion and did a brilliant job of that too. He's feuded with Punk, Show, Henry and Sheamus as a heel and done it brilliantly. He had great matches all the way through and then done some great stuff with Kane. The fans getting behind him has been totally organic and I think it would be a serious mistake to turn him heel now.

Why? Do you not think he could make them cheer him again? Is it just that you'd prefer that he be face and would be disappointed to lose that? Because WWE is in the business of making money from people, and long term there's more money in turning him heel now so he can be a babyface later against the next up and coming heel to come down the line.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 2:36 PM
I'm not entirely sure that's correct, though fully accept that may be pure bias on my behalf.

When CM Punk did his promo, it was getting mainstream press attention. Objectively, it has to be seen as much hotter than Bryan getting cheered by a few live audiences in a row. I'm not trying to diminish Bryan or how great this all is. Just historically, it's a completely different level for Punk at that time.


Upper mid-card, former World Champion who beat off Big Show and Mark Henry to keep the belt, survived the elimination chamber and in the course of last weeks SD and this weeks Raw hasn't just looked like a million bucks but has shown the kind of excitable aggression that audiences pick up on that only a select few people have had before. People like Austin, Foley, Vader, HBK in certain situations; these are the people he is now beginning to be able to be spoken of in similar terms when it comes to the buzz he can generate with his aggression.

First of all, let's be clear about Daniel Bryan's World title reign. He cashed in Money in the Bank and pinned a weak Big Show, and then was a chickenshit heel for a few months, beating Santino in the Chamber, and then lost his title in 8 seconds in the opening match of Wrestlemania. He was not anywhere close to being a main eventer.

And while I can relate to being so interested in invested in this aggressive Daniel Bryan, you're kind of tuning out reality to paint the picture you want to see. His interactions with Kane and Orton paint a very clear picture of someone about to turn on his friends. The aggression is a symptom of the heel disease, not a reason to get the vaccine.


He is a big deal because the fans have made him a big deal, the tweaks to the character in recent weeks have just emphasised this.

If they don't run with this then they are fools.

They are running with it. Just not in the direction you want right now.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 2:53 PM
When CM Punk did his promo, it was getting mainstream press attention. Objectively, it has to be seen as much hotter than Bryan getting cheered by a few live audiences in a row. I'm not trying to diminish Bryan or how great this all is. Just historically, it's a completely different level for Punk at that time.

A few live audiences in a row? This has been the norm since his organic face turn with Kane and has just grown and grown in strength throughout the year. I would argue such long-term sustained reaction from the fans, which has now built into a level we haven't seen in a long, long time, means he is just as hot as Punk ever was, except at Money in the Bank (hometown loveliness that it was). Bryan is getting the biggest face reaction on the entire roster, something Punk never achieved, and I consider this much more important than the level of mainstream media coverage somebody gets (which Bryan has actually received quite a bit of anyway thanks to YES and the beard). Punk gets loud reactions from hardcore fans and always will. Bryan manages to get that, but also bring the casual fan on board with his natural charm. This is more substantive.




First of all, let's be clear about Daniel Bryan's World title reign. He cashed in Money in the Bank and pinned a weak Big Show, and then was a chickenshit heel for a few months, beating Santino in the Chamber, and then lost his title in 8 seconds in the opening match of Wrestlemania. He was not anywhere close to being a main eventer.

And while I can relate to being so interested in invested in this aggressive Daniel Bryan, you're kind of tuning out reality to paint the picture you want to see. His interactions with Kane and Orton paint a very clear picture of someone about to turn on his friends. The aggression is a symptom of the heel disease, not a reason to get the vaccine.

He closed Elimination Chamber ppv standing victorious as the camera faded to black having beat not just Santino but also Barret, Rhodes, Khali and Big Show. This is after spending months closing the SD shows. And then after remaining on top with his great series with Sheamus and then even better series with Punk and then also with Kane.

To claim he wasn't a main eventer is ludicrous. He spent 8 months either World Champion or in title matches for either the World or WWE belts. Seriously, mind blown.


They are running with it. Just not in the direction you want right now.

:lol:

You have absolutely no idea if that's true or not beyond your inkling of which way it will go, same as me.

Unless you have secret contacts and if so, SPILL MAN, SPILL!!! :panic:

VHS
June 4th, 2013, 3:01 PM
Miz is a midcarder face that used to be a main eventer. If he was to be plopped into the main event again next week, it would be forced.

Daniel Bryan is a mid carder face that used to be a main eventer. If he was to be plopped into the main event next week, it would NOT be forced.

Cewsh, love you buddy, but you really see things as black & white sometimes and come off as someone who gets off on shooting down other people. :dunno:

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 3:05 PM
Michaels and Hart getting to the top were a bit before my time, were they both heels?

Cewsh, I think you're downplaying just how over Bryan is. He's getting HUGE reactions from every crowd and has done for the whole year. It's just been even bigger than usual the last few weeks. He got the biggest reaction in front of 80,000 at Wrestlemania and that card also had Rock, Cena, Trips and Lesnar on it.

I just think there's more ways they could go with this if they pushed him as a face. Overcoming Ryback for the title would be huge, feuding with Punk over who is the best would be epic, a title feud with Ziggler would be fun. And if he stays just as hot, it could lead to a feud with Cena which could be huge.

StoneColdChris
June 4th, 2013, 3:10 PM
The chamber PPV ended with Cena beating Kane, not Bryan winning.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 3:12 PM
Yeah let's just try not to think about that.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 3:12 PM
A few live audiences in a row? This has been the norm since his organic face turn with Kane and has just grown and grown in strength throughout the year. I would argue such long-term sustained reaction from the fans, which has now built into a level we haven't seen in a long, long time, means he is just as hot as Punk ever was, except at Money in the Bank (hometown loveliness that it was). Bryan is getting the biggest face reaction on the entire roster, something Punk never achieved, and I consider this much more important than the level of mainstream media coverage somebody gets (which Bryan has actually received quite a bit of anyway thanks to YES and the beard). Punk gets loud reactions from hardcore fans and always will. Bryan manages to get that, but also bring the casual fan on board with his natural charm. This is more substantive.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFLQs5j-7m8

That's not even really fair, since it was his hometown, but you really need to go back and watch that month of shows if you think Bryan approached Punk's level of momentum in the summer of 2011. It was unprecedented in this era. Having your storyline covered by legitimate media outlets and discussed on radio shows nationwide is infinitely more significant than getting pops from live audiences, even though they're both important.


He closed Elimination Chamber ppv standing victorious as the camera faded to black having beat not just Santino but also Barret, Rhodes, Khali and Big Show. This is after spending months closing the SD shows. And then after remaining on top with his great series with Sheamus and then even better series with Punk and then also with Kane.

To claim he wasn't a main eventer is ludicrous. He spent 8 months either World Champion or in title matches for either the World or WWE belts. Seriously, mind blown.

Look, I don't want a semantics argument here, but you're taking things that sound fine on paper and putting them here out of context as if they're as impressive as they sound. Daniel Bryan has exactly zero legitimate wins over main eventers on PPV on his resume. Zero. He held the secondary title on the secondary show for four months, did a chickenshit heel act that fans enjoyed but didn't take seriously, and then he got to wrestle Punk on a few PPVs to give the champion some credibility building victories in great matches. And none of those matches were the main event of the show that they appeared on.

Again, this isn't me trying to bust Daniel Bryan's balls. That was part of his development process, and CM Punk took a very similar step on his way up. But you can't say that any of that has anything to do with being a credible main eventer, because it doesn't. It made him a viable upper midcarder who could flirt with the title, which is what he still is.


:lol:

You have absolutely no idea if that's true or not beyond your inkling of which way it will go, same as me.

Unless you have secret contacts and if so, SPILL MAN, SPILL!!! :panic:

You're getting bent out of shape about this, and I'm really not trying to get on your nerves or even to have a heated debate here. Clearly we disagree, and that's cool, but even if you hope to see what you've spelled out, you have to recognize all the hallmark signs of a heel turn in progress, right?

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 3:15 PM
Miz is a midcarder face that used to be a main eventer. If he was to be plopped into the main event again next week, it would be forced.

Daniel Bryan is a mid carder face that used to be a main eventer. If he was to be plopped into the main event next week, it would NOT be forced.

Cewsh, love you buddy, but you really see things as black & white sometimes and come off as someone who gets off on shooting down other people. :dunno:

I really didn't mean to shoot down anybody. Honestly, I'm trying to talk people off the cliff when the heel turn probably does happen. I love face Bryan, and this run is completely awesome. It will just ALSO be awesome when Bryan gets to main event a PPV across from Cena.


Michaels and Hart getting to the top were a bit before my time, were they both heels?

Neither was. Only Triple H has really held that role as a heel.


Cewsh, I think you're downplaying just how over Bryan is. He's getting HUGE reactions from every crowd and has done for the whole year. It's just been even bigger than usual the last few weeks. He got the biggest reaction in front of 80,000 at Wrestlemania and that card also had Rock, Cena, Trips and Lesnar on it.

I think that bit at the end is hugely debatable, but I'm not trying to downplay it at all. He's tearing the roof off of the place and I'm loving it.

Zacharie
June 4th, 2013, 3:16 PM
Heel/face doesn't matter anymore, he's going to get cheered no matter what he does. Kind of like Angle was. All we need is for Bryan to win that WWE Title Money in the Bank briefcase next month and this will all sort itself out.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 3:22 PM
Cewsh what do you mean the fans enjoyed it but didn't take it seriously? I think he came across as a perfectly credible champion and his entire reign was really good.

Also, it's pointless to say he had good matches but didn't close the show. Only Cena closes the show. We've already gone over the ambulance match against Kane which was a travesty. I think you have to accept that John Cena is an anomaly. Nobody will beat him clean and he will always close the majority of PPVs, no matter his place on the card.

But that doesn't mean WWE can't or shouldn't take advantage of this situation. There's loads of things Bryan could do before he has to run into Cena, I still think he should be in the title picture though. Where Bryan is at the moment reminds me a little of Chris Benoit in early 2001. He was still acting like a bastard pretty much but his matches were so good that the fans were basically forced to take notice of him and cheer him, leading to the "I'm better than you" feud with Angle which really put him on the next level. Difference is, Bryan is more over, better on the mic and more charismatic. He's ready for the main event and the fans are desperate for it so they should put him there.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 3:26 PM
And re: Wrestlemania, I can only speak of my own experience. The reaction Bryan got seemed by far the loudest, plus he had his Wrestlemania moment with entire stadium YESing along with him. And the key thing again, for me, is that he had everyone behind him. Kids, women, adults, smart fans. Everyone loves the guy, and that is unique in the WWE at the moment.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 3:36 PM
You're getting bent out of shape about this, and I'm really not trying to get on your nerves or even to have a heated debate here. Clearly we disagree, and that's cool, but even if you hope to see what you've spelled out, you have to recognize all the hallmark signs of a heel turn in progress, right?

:lol:

Oh come on you big bag of humbugs, I'm enjoying the conversation. I just put my point across strongly, same as you do. :yes:

And no, I honestly don't see the signs of a heel turn. I see him frustrated and angry, but not in leaning towards a heelish way, more a use it to prove himself and be as strong as he can be. Again, that may be my own personal bias coming into play as what I want to see happen, but I really don't see the heel thing.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 3:39 PM
And the key thing again, for me, is that he had everyone behind him. Kids, women, adults, smart fans. Everyone loves the guy, and that is unique in the WWE at the moment.

This was the point I was trying to make earlier.

Punk has the hardcore fans in the palm of his hand but struggles to draw the casual fan in. Cena is the biggest attraction the casual fans but hardcore fans, on the whole, despise him.

Bryan, more than anybody in wrestling today, is able to draw support from every type of fan.

Cewsh
June 4th, 2013, 3:57 PM
Cewsh what do you mean the fans enjoyed it but didn't take it seriously? I think he came across as a perfectly credible champion and his entire reign was really good.

That's really confusing to me, because he was never booked to be seen that way. From the start they booked him as a crazy underdog champion, who then cheated and used his gullible girlfriend to sneak his way through title defenses. He never had a single credible title defense without that being involved. And the Elimination Chamber was not about him until the end. He was a chickenshit, non credible heel. That was the whole idea of his character.


Also, it's pointless to say he had good matches but didn't close the show. Only Cena closes the show. We've already gone over the ambulance match against Kane which was a travesty. I think you have to accept that John Cena is an anomaly. Nobody will beat him clean and he will always close the majority of PPVs, no matter his place on the card.

That's pretty much what I have been saying. That's why you aren't a real main eventer until you've worked with him and made it stick.


But that doesn't mean WWE can't or shouldn't take advantage of this situation. There's loads of things Bryan could do before he has to run into Cena, I still think he should be in the title picture though. Where Bryan is at the moment reminds me a little of Chris Benoit in early 2001. He was still acting like a bastard pretty much but his matches were so good that the fans were basically forced to take notice of him and cheer him, leading to the "I'm better than you" feud with Angle which really put him on the next level. Difference is, Bryan is more over, better on the mic and more charismatic. He's ready for the main event and the fans are desperate for it so they should put him there.

I don't know that the fans are desperate for it. They love him, and they cheer him and they're passionate about him. But not every over act in the company needs to be pushed straight into the main event. The things you need to do in that role have castrated a lot of promising faces, and wrecked their momentum. Not everyone needs a gigantic push all the time.


:lol:

Oh come on you big bag of humbugs, I'm enjoying the conversation. I just put my point across strongly, same as you do. :yes:

And no, I honestly don't see the signs of a heel turn. I see him frustrated and angry, but not in leaning towards a heelish way, more a use it to prove himself and be as strong as he can be. Again, that may be my own personal bias coming into play as what I want to see happen, but I really don't see the heel thing.

:D

I'm putting "A Big Bag of Humbugs" on my tombstone.

JT4104
June 4th, 2013, 4:05 PM
Punk struggles to draw in the casual fan? Am I missing somethng, during the summer of 11 he had everything in terms of fans cheering him, that didn't stop until...............he attacked the rock and got the women and children to boo as a heel should.

When Bryan does turn heel and I wish some of you would see it. It is rather obvious and I complete agree with Cewsh that when if you want a guy to be a huge face he first has to face Cena as a heel. In the Cena era this has been pretty cut and dry and short of Ryback going over Cena WWE needs a few more heels.

JP
June 4th, 2013, 4:08 PM
Punk struggles to draw in the casual fan?

Yes, it's his biggest flaw. I love him, but he doesn't connect with the general audience like he should.

JT4104
June 4th, 2013, 4:12 PM
Yes, it's his biggest flaw. I love him, but he doesn't connect with the general audience like he should.
Guess we disagree then...during the summer of 11 he was fine doing that and really never lost it. He then turned on beloved women/children favorite the Rock and they booed him. Not sure he is supposed to connect with the general fans when the idea is for them to boo him.

Kimura Kid
June 4th, 2013, 4:18 PM
A lot of causuals don't view punk as a Top Star.

Why?

Because he isn't a roided up monster! He looks like a guy most of us could beat up. He doesn't look like he even knows what a gym looks like.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 4:22 PM
That's really confusing to me, because he was never booked to be seen that way. From the start they booked him as a crazy underdog champion, who then cheated and used his gullible girlfriend to sneak his way through title defenses. He never had a single credible title defense without that being involved. And the Elimination Chamber was not about him until the end. He was a chickenshit, non credible heel. That was the whole idea of his character.

Yeah I didn't word that very well. I didn't mean he was credible in terms of his character, I mean that he seemed like he belonged there. Unlike say, Jack Swagger when he won the title. The stories he told were believable, the fans didn't reject him as a guy who had that place on the card.



That's pretty much what I have been saying. That's why you aren't a real main eventer until you've worked with him and made it stick.


I think you can be a main eventer without going up against Cena, maybe not the top guy though. The way I see it is WWE have a unique situation on their hands here. Daniel Bryan is a guy who has become the most over performer in the company by being awesome in the midcard. It's not an engineered situation like the Punk push in 2011 (that was awesome, but not as organic as this). Why not have him go over Ryback for the title? Or face Cena as a face with this intensity, demanding to know who the better man is? I would pay to see that and the reaction it gets. Why not try something different like that instead of the usual Super Cena defeats the newest heel challenger.



I don't know that the fans are desperate for it. They love him, and they cheer him and they're passionate about him. But not every over act in the company needs to be pushed straight into the main event. The things you need to do in that role have castrated a lot of promising faces, and wrecked their momentum. Not everyone needs a gigantic push all the time.

Again, I think you're underestimating how over Bryan is. He's not just another over act or a promising face. He's more over than anyone has been in years and he's still in the midcard. Going back to the argument of whether he should turn heel, this is why I think it would be a waste. WWE is short of main event faces and he's ready to take on that role immediately.

JT4104
June 4th, 2013, 4:30 PM
Again, I think you're underestimating how over Bryan is. He's not just another over act or a promising face. He's more over than anyone has been in years and he's still in the midcard. Going back to the argument of whether he should turn heel, this is why I think it would be a waste. WWE is short of main event faces and he's ready to take on that role immediately.They are also completely short of main event heels as well. Besides Cena and Punk there is no one else currently on the roster who has really been built up to be a main event guy. Sheamus is now Cena light and Orton can't be trusted. Ryback while working really hard is still hearing crickets and not explosion when he comes out. Bryan at this rate would be massively booed if they went the heel route, the same women and children who love his bearded goofy self would boo the guy who becomes serious and wants to win. That is the dynamic problem the WWE has right now.

Say, you keep bryan face, who are all the "main event" heels for him and Cena to split, there is Punk and I guess Ziggler, two guys who get face pops anyways and WWE still seems to want to try and draw lines between faces/heels.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 4:33 PM
Punk, Ziggler, Show, Henry, Ryback, possibly Orton and Lesnar. I'd like to see them face eachother too.

The Law
June 4th, 2013, 4:50 PM
Regardless of whether or not it's a good idea (and I don't think it is), I can't see WWE having Ryback vs. Bryan main event a pay-per-view right now. Especially with John Cena sitting at home and not on the card, as some people have proposed. I don't know what the buyrate for that show would be, but I don't think there's any way that WWE would want to find out. Bryan jumping into the main event right now would be very surprising. I guess Eddie Guerrero is the one precedent I can think of: he was in Los Guerreros up until he challenged Lesnar at No Way Out 2004 and won the title.

Andy
June 4th, 2013, 5:05 PM
This situation is pretty unprecedented though. I can think of maybe three people this has happened to in the last 15 years. Austin, Cena and maybe Punk. All three started getting huge reactions in the midcard and went on to be elevated to main event level and beat the biggest heel at the time (Cena in Chicago was a heel and they knew that would be the case). At this point Ryback is the biggest heel in the company. I'm not saying that's exactly how I want it to go down, but in the rare previous similar circumstances, that's how it's gone down.

There's a number of things they could do though. Having Kane turn on Bryan could be an enjoyable transition feud, they could have him win MITB, they could have him feud with Ryback, Ziggler, Punk or Cena right away for a title. As I say, to me any of those options are infinitely preferable to him turning heel and feuding with face Kane/Orton, Sheamus, Cena etc.

The Rosk
June 5th, 2013, 4:30 AM
Turn Orton to feud with him for the No.1 contendership. Elevates both men from where they currently are and I reckon they could have some good matches. Done.

Cheers writers. Just give me a cut of his shirt sales. Cheers.

JP
June 5th, 2013, 4:35 AM
Oh Cewsh.

Peter Griffin
June 5th, 2013, 4:38 AM
Cheers writers. Just give me a cut of his shirt sales. Cheers.

You seem to be indicating that Orton turned, which could only be at the SD taping, which would be a spoiler, just saying ;)

Judas Iscariot
June 5th, 2013, 4:53 AM
TL;DR everything posted on forums.rajah.com:

Cena is the absolute worst and Daniel Bryan is hottest man in the industry.

Both of those are FACTS, by the way.

FACTS.

But Daniel Bryan doesn't have a new cool K-Mart clothing line coming out.

Judas Iscariot
June 5th, 2013, 4:55 AM
Yes, it's his biggest flaw. I love him, but he doesn't connect with the general audience like he should.

I don't think he even wants to.

Because he's so punk and all.

During his BIG SHOOT where he was blaming the fans for the state of things, that part wasn't worked at all. He legit believes that, and he's right.

mr sabu
June 5th, 2013, 5:29 AM
you make him dance............................. again

StoneColdChris
June 5th, 2013, 7:41 PM
Things just got interesting



This is from the new Wrestling Observer by Dave Meltzer.

For those who think the company doesn’t see Bryan as a main eventer, right now the penciled in main event for Money in the Bank on 7/14 in Philadelphia is Cena vs. Bryan, with Bryan not being a heel, as the title match. As you should be aware, everything is subject to change. It’s pretty much a sure thing Bryan will be cheered in that match, given the city, and they are fully aware of that. The impression is they won’t try and make him a heel but that’s certainly something that can change. I sense the goal for the next two months is try to make Cena a “legend” by beating Rock, surviving Ryback and then having a match of the year with Bryan.

JP
June 5th, 2013, 7:44 PM
Oh Cewsh.

Cewsh
June 5th, 2013, 7:48 PM
I'll admit I was wrong gladly...after Money in the Bank. ;)

Beer-Belly
June 5th, 2013, 7:49 PM
That sounds amazing. I hope they go through with it. Money in the Bank is generally one of the better shows of the year, but that match would really put it over the top.

StoneColdChris
June 5th, 2013, 7:57 PM
Oh God, if Bryan takes the gold off Cena, I'll(as well as the rest of the internet, I'm sure) lose my mind in excitement.

Beer-Belly
June 5th, 2013, 8:01 PM
Turning him heel would be the most tone deaf decision they could make right now.

Tainted Eclipse
June 5th, 2013, 9:00 PM
good lord that sounds amazing. might even try to get tickets to the event if as the date approaches it looks like thats what they're doing.

mth
June 5th, 2013, 9:06 PM
Not much I can say but holy crap that all sounds lovely.

Andy
June 6th, 2013, 6:52 AM
I'd be confident of Cena/Bryan having a spectacular match too, given how much time they must be spending together at the moment. If they did that match and had Bryan win the belt I would probably mark out more than anything ever.

lotjx
June 6th, 2013, 6:59 AM
Bryan is going to job to Cena and then go back down to mid-card hell. Don't get your hopes up.

MMH
June 6th, 2013, 7:55 AM
If all this MITB stuff is true then I can see Bryan getting more frustrated over the next few months before trying to get a title match with Cena so that he can prove himself. Cena agrees coz he is a nice guy and they have a bit of mutual respect in the build up and then Bryan wins the title and either rubs it in his face turning heel or Cena gets pissed off and turns heel on Bryan, which wont happen more than likely but I think if they ever wanted to turn Cena Bryan would be the man to do it on as I think the fans are truly behind him.

Or of course Bryan just loses and snaps, turning heel which would be quite boring.

Andy
June 6th, 2013, 1:26 PM
We're at the stage now that if Cena ever turns heel it will be one of the biggest moments in wrestling history, so I can't see it happening anywhere other than a Wrestlemania. I think he will but probably not for another 5+ years yet, when he's winding his full time career up, just to appease the fans who have wanted it for so long.

Jacknife
June 6th, 2013, 1:56 PM
If it's Cena vs. Bryan, do you see the Bellas being involved somehow?

Zacharie
June 6th, 2013, 3:29 PM
I wonder if this till end up being a push similar to CM Punk's title reign. Punk/Cena/Bryan at WM omfg.

VHS
June 6th, 2013, 4:09 PM
If it's Cena vs. Bryan, do you see the Bellas being involved somehow?

No. :wtf:

JP
June 6th, 2013, 4:10 PM
No. :wtf:

Bryan is dating one Bella, Cena the other.

If gossip is to be believed.

The Rosk
June 6th, 2013, 4:14 PM
I think there is always the risk that when Cena turns, he will be roundly cheered like fucking crazy, purely because its something that people have been waiting for for seven years. I think the only person that wouldn't get cheered against is someone like Bryan, who everyone in the audience now likes, as supposed to Rock who in spite of his awesomeness still divided the crowd.

Andy
June 6th, 2013, 4:16 PM
Yeah a turn at this stage would basically reverse the current dynamic. The people who boo him now mostly appreciate that he's a good worker but just think he's stale as shit. They would likely cheer and the kids and women would boo.

Bennedy
June 6th, 2013, 4:17 PM
Daniel Bryan could be their next big face. Bryan beating Cena for the title would be massive. GAME CHANGING.

It won't happen.

Andy
June 6th, 2013, 4:27 PM
It might happen via shenanigans. That's what I'm clinging onto at this stage.

Cewsh
June 6th, 2013, 4:35 PM
I just read the ratings breakdown for the Raws this month. Segments where Bryan wrestles are gaining a SUBSTANTIAL number of viewers. Ratings as a whole are improper indicators, but the trend is undeniable.

However, segments where he talks lose viewers in the hundreds of thousands.

mth
June 6th, 2013, 4:46 PM
Bryan is dating one Bella, Cena the other.

If gossip is to be believed.
The Bellas confirmed in a recent interview that their relationships with Cena/Bryan would be featured on the new diva show.

Hero!
June 6th, 2013, 5:38 PM
Not to mention, we saw a picture of them all together at the family christmas dinner...

mth
June 6th, 2013, 5:40 PM
Maybe you did. I'm not on their Christmas card list. :\

Hero!
June 6th, 2013, 5:41 PM
Sorry man, you're not in their FAVE FIVE.

mth
June 6th, 2013, 5:44 PM
Just wait 'til DB sees my beard...

Hero!
June 6th, 2013, 5:45 PM
Your beards can be friends.

Badger
June 6th, 2013, 6:26 PM
If the Weakest Link was still around, I'd love Bryan to go on it then lose his shit at Anne Robinson.

Peter Griffin
June 6th, 2013, 6:34 PM
I'd love it if he got the labelle lock on the crusty old witch :rant:

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 1:11 PM
I might be done for a while if we see the start of a feud with Axel tonight. No issue with him not winning last night but how it happens scares me that he's spending the rest of the year in an IC title feud.

Cewsh
July 15th, 2013, 1:14 PM
Is that bad? It's be a feud that gets him lots of screen time and great matches, and the chance to interact with Heyman. He might even have a part to play in the Punk/Lesnar feud.

JP
July 15th, 2013, 1:21 PM
Do you really want the hottest property in the wrestling world playing second fiddle and being somebody's henchman?

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 1:21 PM
I'm starting to see a difference in Being over and having something catchy to connect with the fans with.

He's fantastic in the ring, He's decent on the Mic, He's got a mediocre look at best, But that Chant tho.....

That chant is really all that sets him apart right now.....And it's kinda fucking annoying how everyone feels he's owed something special because he gets the entire fucking arena to chant "Yes"

And people chant "Yes" cuz it's easy....it's easy to participate. Not because they fucking love Daniel Bryan.

My wife who never watched a single event was Chanting "Yes" at payback to participate....not because she loved the guy....ffs she hadn't even seen a match of his ever!!!

He's not selling out arena's, selling the most Merch or anything significant outside of the Chant.

Wrestling fans make it seem like Daniel Bryan is the second coming, Some huge money making machine that WWE is over looking.

I don't buy the hype.

Beer-Belly
July 15th, 2013, 1:26 PM
Yeah, just like Austin 3:16 got big because it looks nice on a sign.

Bryan had the biggest pop of the night.

Kdestiny
July 15th, 2013, 1:29 PM
Yeah, that's not right KK

JP
July 15th, 2013, 1:30 PM
I'm starting to see a difference in Being over and having something catchy to connect with the fans with.

He's fantastic in the ring, He's decent on the Mic, He's got a mediocre look at best, But that Chant tho.....

That chant is really all that sets him apart right now.....And it's kinda fucking annoying how everyone feels he's owed something special because he gets the entire fucking arena to chant "Yes"

And people chant "Yes" cuz it's easy....it's easy to participate. Not because they fucking love Daniel Bryan.

My wife who never watched a single event was Chanting "Yes" at payback to participate....not because she loved the guy....ffs she hadn't even seen a match of his ever!!!

He's not selling out arena's, selling the most Merch or anything significant outside of the Chant.

Wrestling fans make it seem like Daniel Bryan is the second coming, Some huge money making machine that WWE is over looking.

I don't buy the hype.

:lol:

I just quoted this before you edit it out in a desperate attempt to save face after realising this makes it look like you've spent the day drinking pints of lead paint and chasing them down with shots of irradiated water.

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 1:30 PM
Yeah, just like Austin 3:16 got big because it looks nice on a sign.

Bryan had the biggest pop of the night.

Did you seriously just compare Austins to Bryan.......This is exactly what I'm talking about.

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 1:30 PM
I'm starting to see a difference in Being over and having something catchy to connect with the fans with.

He's fantastic in the ring, He's decent on the Mic, He's got a mediocre look at best, But that Chant tho.....

That chant is really all that sets him apart right now.....And it's kinda fucking annoying how everyone feels he's owed something special because he gets the entire fucking arena to chant "Yes"

And people chant "Yes" cuz it's easy....it's easy to participate. Not because they fucking love Daniel Bryan.

My wife who never watched a single event was Chanting "Yes" at payback to participate....not because she loved the guy....ffs she hadn't even seen a match of his ever!!!

He's not selling out arena's, selling the most Merch or anything significant outside of the Chant.

Wrestling fans make it seem like Daniel Bryan is the second coming, Some huge money making machine that WWE is over looking.

I don't buy the hype.

I'm honestly baffled by this statement. Daniel Bryan is regularly getting the greatest reactions from the crowds, and it's more than just the "YES" chants. Sure, it's simple, but who's the won that got it to catch on? Why do they mostly do it when HE comes out? How come when he does something crazy in the ring, or goes wild, or kicks someone in the head, the crowd goes INSANE before chanting YES like they're wild? Dude, it may just be a chant, but "WHAT?" was just a chant, and it started a revolution in crowd participation(albeit a somewhat annoying one now). Austin had the ability to get a simple word like "What" popular. Daniel Bryan is possibly the only person to have done that in wrestling outside of Mr. Austin. Do you not see the correlation?

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 1:31 PM
:lol:

I just quoted this before you edit it out in a desperate attempt to save face after realising this makes it look like you've spent the day drinking pints of lead paint and chasing them down with shots of irradiated water.

Not gonna happen. I stand by my opinion. Take away the yes chant and Bryan isn't over.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 1:32 PM
People don't just like him because they like chanting YES. Come on.

He's the best in the company in the ring at the moment, he's the most over in the company at the moment and has been for at least six months, he's been producing brilliant match after brilliant match for at least 18 months.

I don't understand how those things don't equate to a spot in the main event. I may be jumping the gun here and we may get Bryan/Cena at Summerslam, but I just see them having him feud with Axel now. And the annoying thing is they could've had Axel take out anyone. The spot would've been perfect to cost RVD for example, or Christian. Both of those guys could have a good IC title feud with him.

JP
July 15th, 2013, 1:32 PM
Not gonna happen. I stand by my opinion. Take away the yes chant and Bryan isn't over.

:rofl:

Mate, please, stop digging.

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 1:32 PM
I'm starting to see a difference in Being over and having something catchy to connect with the fans with.

He's fantastic in the ring, He's decent on the Mic, He's got a mediocre look at best, But that Chant tho.....

That chant is really all that sets him apart right now.....And it's kinda fucking annoying how everyone feels he's owed something special because he gets the entire fucking arena to chant "Yes"

And people chant "Yes" cuz it's easy....it's easy to participate. Not because they fucking love Daniel Bryan.

My wife who never watched a single event was Chanting "Yes" at payback to participate....not because she loved the guy....ffs she hadn't even seen a match of his ever!!!

He's not selling out arena's, selling the most Merch or anything significant outside of the Chant.

Wrestling fans make it seem like Daniel Bryan is the second coming, Some huge money making machine that WWE is over looking.

I don't buy the hype.

Let's not even go with the chant aspect. THE CROWD REACTION COMES BEFORE THE CHANT!!! Who cares if it's simple?! THE CROWD LOVES IT! They go crazy for Bryan! It's the same thing that got Cena so over in the first place, yet Bryan has all the skill to back it up. I'm sorry, I just can't see how you don't consider Bryan a future major player. When he's getting one of the best, if not the best, reaction in the company, you need to take advantage of that.

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 1:34 PM
Not gonna happen. I stand by my opinion. Take away the yes chant and Bryan isn't over.
You realize, ever since Bryan cashed in the MITB, he got killer reactions BEFORE the "YES" chant started, right?

Beer-Belly
July 15th, 2013, 1:35 PM
Did you seriously just compare Austins to Bryan.......This is exactly what I'm talking about.
It's less absurd than saying Bryan is only over because of "Yes" and "No".

And you're missing the part where he got the biggest pop of the night. No one goes ape shit over a wrestler just so they can chant something.

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 1:36 PM
You realize, ever since Bryan cashed in the MITB, he got killer reactions BEFORE the "YES" chant started, right?

No I didn't.

I could be completely wrong here guys. He could end up being a huge player in the WWE. I personally feel that he's not. He'll be a top mid card talent in a few years once people get sick of chanting yes every week. Just my opinion.


It's less absurd than saying Bryan is only over because of "Yes" and "No".

And you're missing the part where he got the biggest pop of the night. No one goes ape shit over a wrestler just so they can't chant something.

YES THEY DO!!

It's the problem with the fans today

Kdestiny
July 15th, 2013, 1:41 PM
KK, I like you, but you are just flat out wrong.

He already is a huge player and will continue to be.

show me someone that the fans have gone crazy over for eighteen months and keep chanting yes even after they lost in such a fashion as he did at Wrestlemania? He has something special. If you can't see that then it is your loss, but he is going to be a big time player whether you say he should or not. He has something special. Even former superstars and guys like JR have been praising his work for a very very long time

Beer-Belly
July 15th, 2013, 1:41 PM
YES THEY DO!!Except they chant "YES" and "NO" whenever they want. They don't have to give him a thunderous response when he enters, but they do.

Let's not forget that "Daniel Bryan" chants were pretty big way before "YES" and "NO" were even a thing.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 1:42 PM
Who else does the crowd go crazy over just so they can chant something?

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 1:43 PM
And everyone saying he got the loudest pop of the show??? You kidding? RVD and Punks reactions were louder. Just not as many people with their arms flailing about.

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 1:45 PM
KK, I like you, but you are just flat out wrong.



Guys lemme just say that we can all still maintain our current relationships while disagreeing on something.

I'm not looking to become public enemy # 1 here...lol

I still like you the same too KD

Tainted Eclipse
July 15th, 2013, 1:45 PM
Not gonna happen. I stand by my opinion. Take away the yes chant and Bryan isn't over.

Come now that's quite a statement to make. Surely you've seen his matches. The "Yes" chant is a BIG part of how over he is -- which is hardly taking anything away from him because he came up with it and got it over himself; surely coming up with a successful catchphrase is a valuable skill -- but the crowd go crazy for a lot of his signature spots. His flip out of the corner into the running clotheline, where the crowd do that "ooooOOOOOOOO" wind up thing. The crowd is always nuts when he goes on his rampage, attacking people left and right with kicks and dives. His signature moves are over. A lot of what Bryan does is over as shit, the Yes chant being the most noticeable and successful.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 1:48 PM
And everyone saying he got the loudest pop of the show??? You kidding? RVD and Punks reactions were louder. Just not as many people with their arms flailing about.

Come on man, you need to watch the entrances again. RVD and Punk got big reactions, no doubt, but Bryan's pop (not yes chants) was the biggest.

The really telling thing for me is that Bryan was the most over guy at Mania. The only guy that even came close was Undertaker and we're talking about a card which also had Rock, Cena and Trips on it.

Cewsh
July 15th, 2013, 1:49 PM
Do you really want the hottest property in the wrestling world playing second fiddle and being somebody's henchman?

Yes. Because I don't believe that his momentum is sustainable. I know that you disagree, and that's fine, but we need to be realistic. Daniel Bryan isn't going to be dominating WWE title feuds right now, but he's hardly off the shows losing to Zack Ryder. If this feud takes place, he'll be in a high profile feud with another guy getting a substantial push. He'll still be all over the shows, and if he maintains his momentum, they can always push him back up as time goes on. Or maybe they just have a throwaway match on Raw, and Bryan gets involved in the title feud with Cena and Henry, leading to a triple threat match at Summerslam which protects Bryan from the pressure of having to draw on his own. Either way, he isn't going anywhere.

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 1:49 PM
And everyone saying he got the loudest pop of the show??? You kidding? RVD and Punks reactions were louder. Just not as many people with their arms flailing about.

I actually think Punk got the loudest reaction, but RVD and Bryan were definitely on the same level, if not Bryan a bit louder. I remember being surprised that Bryan got a louder reaction, but mind you, I watch with about 8 or so friends, so there's a lot of talking and reacting going on.

Still, when Bryan unloaded on everyone, the crowd went nuts.

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 1:49 PM
Come now that's quite a statement to make. Surely you've seen his matches. The "Yes" chant is a BIG part of how over he is -- which is hardly taking anything away from him because he came up with it and got it over himself; surely coming up with a successful catchphrase is a valuable skill -- but the crowd go crazy for a lot of his signature spots. His flip out of the corner into the running clotheline, where the crowd do that "ooooOOOOOOOO" wind up thing. The crowd is always nuts when he goes on his rampage, attacking people left and right with kicks and dives. His signature moves are over. A lot of what Bryan does is over as shit, the Yes chant being the most noticeable and successful.

Great Points.......and I agree he's got a bit of a "Hulk Up" thing going and his ability to get crowd involved is something that we haven't seen in quite some time. But I just don't think he's as big a deal as many of you think he is in the eyes of those that matter.

He's a internet darling.

Cewsh
July 15th, 2013, 1:49 PM
Who else does the crowd go crazy over just so they can chant something?

Fandango comes to mind.

Beer-Belly
July 15th, 2013, 1:51 PM
Not comparable. No one is ironically cheering Bryan.

Matthew
July 15th, 2013, 1:52 PM
they don't even really chant his song that much. nothing near when it first started.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 1:52 PM
Yes. Because I don't believe that his momentum is sustainable. I know that you disagree, and that's fine, but we need to be realistic. Daniel Bryan isn't going to be dominating WWE title feuds right now, but he's hardly off the shows losing to Zack Ryder. If this feud takes place, he'll be in a high profile feud with another guy getting a substantial push. He'll still be all over the shows, and if he maintains his momentum, they can always push him back up as time goes on. Or maybe they just have a throwaway match on Raw, and Bryan gets involved in the title feud with Cena and Henry, leading to a triple threat match at Summerslam which protects Bryan from the pressure of having to draw on his own. Either way, he isn't going anywhere.

He's sustained the momentum for well over a year. I don't see any reason it can't continue...unless they stick him in a fucking feud for the IC title for months. Why don't you believe the momentum is sustainable? I haven't seen anyone stay this over for this long since the Attitude Era.

Cewsh
July 15th, 2013, 1:52 PM
I agree. I was just offering one example.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 1:53 PM
Fandango comes to mind.

That happened on about three shows then it stopped. Bryan has had this going for nearly two years.

JP
July 15th, 2013, 1:54 PM
I agree. I was just offering one example.

Why offer an example if you don't think it's a suitable one?

I think somebody is in a mischievous mood. :hic:

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 1:54 PM
Yes. Because I don't believe that his momentum is sustainable. I know that you disagree, and that's fine, but we need to be realistic. Daniel Bryan isn't going to be dominating WWE title feuds right now, but he's hardly off the shows losing to Zack Ryder. If this feud takes place, he'll be in a high profile feud with another guy getting a substantial push. He'll still be all over the shows, and if he maintains his momentum, they can always push him back up as time goes on. Or maybe they just have a throwaway match on Raw, and Bryan gets involved in the title feud with Cena and Henry, leading to a triple threat match at Summerslam which protects Bryan from the pressure of having to draw on his own. Either way, he isn't going anywhere.

I agree with your sentiments 100%, though I personally would rather he not get to involved with the Punk/Lesnar deal. Having a match with Axel could be good, but I'd rather he move on to something else from there. Depending on what the Wyatts are doing, I would REALLY like to see him get involved with that whole spiel with Kane. If there's a SummerSlam match of sorts(Brothers of Destruction vs. The Family or something), seeing a reunion of the "Full" Brothers of Destruction would be great.

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/p480x480/547910_557652150923474_783857416_n.jpg

Though that's highly unlikely, even Bryan coming to help out Kane in a 2 on 3 match would be pretty epic, and more valuable than an Axel/Bryan match.

Quite honestly, the most value I see in a Bryan vs. Axel match is Axel finally getting an excellent opponent that will both garner a strong crowd response and a quality match for fans to enjoy of his. It wouldn't hurt Bryan at all, I just would prefer other options.

Cewsh
July 15th, 2013, 1:55 PM
He's sustained the momentum for well over a year. I don't see any reason it can't continue...unless they stick him in a fucking feud for the IC title for months. Why don't you believe the momentum is sustainable? I haven't seen anyone stay this over for this long since the Attitude Era.

Daniel Bryan is super over. But I continue to think that the degree to which that is true before the past few months is overstated. And he has yet to prove that he can sustain his momentum without being grouped with other people who are significantly over and always have been, (Kane, Orton.) I'm not saying this to denigrate him, and I want to see him prove that he can do it. But a feud with a hot up and coming heel while everyone above him shoves about on the way to Summerslam is not going to ruin his career.

Cewsh
July 15th, 2013, 1:56 PM
Why offer an example if you don't think it's a suitable one?

I think somebody is in a mischievous mood. :hic:

I was agreeing with Matthew, that those Fandango chants have stopped.

How about the What? chants continuing on years after Austin left?

Beer-Belly
July 15th, 2013, 1:56 PM
By the way, did anyone catch the announcers say the Daniel Bryan is the hottest guy in the company? I don't see them saddling him with an as yet unproven Curtis Axel for title that no one gives a shit about.

Cewsh
July 15th, 2013, 1:58 PM
By the way, did anyone catch the announcers say the Daniel Bryan is the hottest guy in the company? I don't see them saddling him with an as yet unproven Curtis Axel for title that no one gives a shit about.

Putting a guy who needs to establish credibility and a belt that needs to establish credibility with a hot babyface who has nothing but great matches? That sounds like EXACTLY what they should do.

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 2:01 PM
Daniel Bryan is super over. But I continue to think that the degree to which that is true before the past few months is overstated. And he has yet to prove that he can sustain his momentum without being grouped with other people who are significantly over and always have been, (Kane, Orton.) I'm not saying this to denigrate him, and I want to see him prove that he can do it. But a feud with a hot up and coming heel while everyone above him shoves about on the way to Summerslam is not going to ruin his career.

I'll say that there is a lull of crowd reaction most people seem to gloss over after the initial hotness of Team Hell No. They simmered down for a while until they started getting involved with The Shield. Since WrestleMania 28, though, he was getting insane reactions all the way through to the Anger Management sessions, which got even MORE of a reaction. He's constantly been getting huge reactions, but it's only been the last few months that it's been on a more consistent basis, and considerably over-the-top on PPVs and RAW.

I can agree the pairing can help him a lot, but when he originally joined up with Kane, it didn't feel like he needed to get that reaction. It felt more like something for Bryan and Kane to do because neither had plans, and it turned out to be genius that got a larger reaction than anyone could have expected. Both men have come out reinvigorated and over as fuck because of it, and while the pairing of Bryan and Orton and the like has helped, it's only because he has yet to be established in the top light.

At some point it has to happen, and now that it has, we're going to witness how he sustains this new level of momentum, which as he's proven with each level before, I think he will succeed.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 2:01 PM
Daniel Bryan is super over. But I continue to think that the degree to which that is true before the past few months is overstated. And he has yet to prove that he can sustain his momentum without being grouped with other people who are significantly over and always have been, (Kane, Orton.) I'm not saying this to denigrate him, and I want to see him prove that he can do it. But a feud with a hot up and coming heel while everyone above him shoves about on the way to Summerslam is not going to ruin his career.

In what way is it overstated? It's undeniable that he's getting the biggest reactions in the company and has been for a long time. I don't understand the point about Kane and Orton. Kane was boring as hell before he got paired with Bryan and I don't think he was particularly over at all at that stage. Orton has been fucking dull as hell too and although he often gets strong reactions it's only recently that his reactions have really picked up. And guess when that started? When he started working with Daniel Bryan. So I think the reality is actually the opposite of what you said there. Kane and Orton have been rejuvenated by working with Bryan because the guy is so good and so over. And when Bryan has been working with those two he's still got the bigger reaction. Look at the response he got to making Orton tap out, they went fucking crazy.

The Law
July 15th, 2013, 2:05 PM
The first time I really noticed just how over Bryan had gotten was Wrestlemania. Him leading 80,000 people in the "Yes!" chant after his match was pretty staggering. I felt like he got a better response than anyone else that night, though I could be misremembering. Since Wrestlemania, he's been the hottest and most over guy on the roster. He's been on fire for about 3 1/2 months now. My thought is that they should ride the hot hand and run him and Cena at Summerslam. Same reason I was happy when they did Ryback and Punk at Hell in a Cell last year. I probably wouldn't have him win, but a solid effort with Cena being lucky to win would be a good step. And then there are several interesting directions they could go with Bryan responding to his loss.

On the other hand, nothing is ruined forever if Bryan feuds with Curtis Axel. I'm not a huge fan of the idea, although him and Punk teaming up would be fun. Could Bryan turn on Punk and join Heyman? And then we can have another Bryan vs. Punk program for the title of "Best in the World."

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 2:07 PM
The first time I really noticed just how over Bryan had gotten was Wrestlemania. Him leading 80,000 people in the "Yes!" chant after his match was pretty staggering. I felt like he got a better response than anyone else that night, though I could be misremembering. Since Wrestlemania, he's been the hottest and most over guy on the roster. He's been on fire for about 3 1/2 months now. My thought is that they should ride the hot hand and run him and Cena at Summerslam. Same reason I was happy when they did Ryback and Punk at Hell in a Cell last year. I probably wouldn't have him win, but a solid effort with Cena being lucky to win would be a good step. And then there are several interesting directions they could go with Bryan responding to his loss.

On the other hand, nothing is ruined forever if Bryan feuds with Curtis Axel. I'm not a huge fan of the idea, although him and Punk teaming up would be fun. Could Bryan turn on Punk and join Heyman? And then we can have another Bryan vs. Punk program for the title of "Best in the World."

I do not dig the idea of a heel turn. Bryan is too over as a face right now. They need to ride that pony as long as it's buckin'.

THEN he can turn heel and be completely awesome all over again, but ideally, that wouldn't be at least for another year or two.

Beer-Belly
July 15th, 2013, 2:08 PM
Putting a guy who needs to establish credibility and a belt that needs to establish credibility with a hot babyface who has nothing but great matches? That sounds like EXACTLY what they should do.

Who gains anything out of this? Bryan goes down several levels and is put on par with a guy who only gets a reaction because of his manager. Bryan doesn't need to be dicking around with IC title and Axel doesn't need to be getting wins over the hottest guy in the company.

Tainted Eclipse
July 15th, 2013, 2:16 PM
Man if Axel/Bryan is really Bryan's program for the summer I'll probably stop keeping up with WWE. I don't like the be the guy who says "I'll stop watching if my upper mid card favorite doesn't get in the main event!" and I'm sure it's not a feeling the majority of WWE fans share, but Bryan is the most interesting guy in the company, on a crazy hot streak and feels to be on the cusp of real stardom. Putting him in a lower-midcard feud with perhaps the least interesting guy in the company, well I feel comfortable saying that's objectively a BAD idea in every way.

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 2:21 PM
That is my only problem. It's bad timing to make Bryan a fall-guy for Axel to get over. I see the value in it, but not when Bryan is where he is at. You need to keep him in hot, meaningful feuds until you're ready to make that push. A Wyatt Family program could do that, and it would help put the Wyatt Family over. Involving Kane keeps it multi-faceted. Keep that up until it's time to get him prepped for the Royal Rumble. Perhaps Ambrose loses the U.S. title by Hell In a Cell/Survivor Series time and gets into a feud with Bryan to sustain through to the Rumble?

On that note, imagine Bryan and Ambrose off of a hot feud being the final two in the 2014 Royal Rumble. That would be immense.

Beer-Belly
July 15th, 2013, 2:26 PM
Bryan vs. Axel is great idea for a Raw match, but it makes no sense as feud. Bryan doesn't need the IC title and Axel doesn't need to be beating him clean.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 2:26 PM
The thing is if they wanted someone from that match to feud with Axel to get him over they could've literally gone with any of them. RVD returning to a hot reception and going after the IC title would be good, a feud with Christian should produce good matches. Same with Orton and Sheamus. It just feels like Bryan and Punk are the two guys who are clearly above that level at the moment.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 2:27 PM
Man if Axel/Bryan is really Bryan's program for the summer I'll probably stop keeping up with WWE. I don't like the be the guy who says "I'll stop watching if my upper mid card favorite doesn't get in the main event!" and I'm sure it's not a feeling the majority of WWE fans share, but Bryan is the most interesting guy in the company, on a crazy hot streak and feels to be on the cusp of real stardom. Putting him in a lower-midcard feud with perhaps the least interesting guy in the company, well I feel comfortable saying that's objectively a BAD idea in every way.

Spot on. I hate saying things like this because it's almost impossible not to come across as a smark internet nerd but you hit the nail on the head. :yes:

The Law
July 15th, 2013, 2:30 PM
RVD vs. Axel would make a ton of sense. RVD had history with Heyman. He's a veteran who should be putting people over. And he should be wrestling in the midcard. That definitely makes more sense than doing Axel vs. Bryan right now.

Hero!
July 15th, 2013, 2:32 PM
There is so much madness in this thread that I am just lost. Bryan doesn't need MITB, hell if he's gonna go after Axel, make it for the IC title and have Punk screw Axel. Bryan wins and demands Champ v Champ at SS. Bryan wins at SS, Orton cashes in on him.

from this, you get:
Bryan's big title win
Axel involved with Punk and Bryan
Orton as a fucking heel
The title off Cena


Or whatever. Fuck optimism.

Psycho666Soldier
July 15th, 2013, 2:36 PM
There is so much madness in this thread that I am just lost. Bryan doesn't need MITB, hell if he's gonna go after Axel, make it for the IC title and have Punk screw Axel. Bryan wins and demands Champ v Champ at SS. Bryan wins at SS, Orton cashes in on him.

from this, you get:
Bryan's big title win
Axel involved with Punk and Bryan
Orton as a fucking heel
The title off Cena


Or whatever. Fuck optimism.

Hero! with the motha-fuckin' hammer droppin'!

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 2:42 PM
Yeah this thread went a bit mad so let me just clarify something.

I'm not one of those people who is saying Bryan should've won full stop. No, he didn't have to win and it's not a bad thing that he didn't. I think the guy is destined for the WWE title anyway and it'd be more meaningful if he did it the hard way.

I just hate the idea of him feuding with Axel.

Hero!
July 15th, 2013, 2:44 PM
Axel is a pawn in the bigger feud of Brock & Heyman vs Punk. Sure, he fucked Bryan last night, so all Bryan has to do is take the dude's IC title and we're square.

chatty
July 15th, 2013, 2:50 PM
I'll wait and see what happens tonight. We may get Bryan v Axel on Raw and that'll be the end of it and he''ll move onto whatever program he is going to go into the summer with.

If it is Axel v Bryan over the summer that would be poor, its a bit of a lose/lose situation as well as it'll kill Bryans hot streak and either he loses and stays in the mid-card or Axel loses and moves down to the lower mid-card. Bryan beating Axel does nothing for him and Axe beating Bryan makes no sense whatsoever as Axel isn't moving up any further for the time being.

Only good thing would be Bryan destoying him and Hayman and it somehow leading to a Brock feud down the line. That said if they aren't willing to push him into a feud with Cena now then its unlikely they will with Brock come later in the year (Mania to Mania).

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 2:50 PM
I don't think anyone wants to see Bryan win the IC title though. The thing is a poisoned chalice just now.

Andy
July 15th, 2013, 2:52 PM
Oh god a Brock/Bryan feud would be spectacular.

Peter Griffin
July 15th, 2013, 2:56 PM
Fuck me what a bunch of whining, bitchy DB marks we have in here. Stop watching if he feuds with Axel ffs get a grip.

Matthew
July 15th, 2013, 2:57 PM
peter griffin you have no place to talk when it comes to whining

Kimura Kid
July 15th, 2013, 2:59 PM
I'll wait and see what happens tonight. We may get Bryan v Axel on Raw and that'll be the end of it and he''ll move onto whatever program he is going to go into the summer with.

I'm assuming this is what will happen. Sometimes as wrestling fans we get a bit worked up over assumptions. Myself included. Most of the people posting in this thread have Bryan vs Axel a forgone conclusion even though nothing besides Axel coming out to "help Punk" win MITB has lead us to believe anything of the sort.

Why does Axel's interference have to lead to a fued with Bryan? He came out to help insure a Punk Victory, Not to screw Bryan.

Hero!
July 15th, 2013, 3:00 PM
I don't think anyone wants to see Bryan win the IC title though. The thing is a poisoned chalice just now.


Be only the 3rd guy in history to hold the IC title and a world title. Bryan winning a belt on his way to Summerslam can only help "on a hit streak" buildup.

chatty
July 15th, 2013, 3:11 PM
I do feel this is the best time to throw Bryan in with Cena though. You have Punk v Lesnar which is gonna sell the show and Cena alone makes numbers so it would be perfect to test Bryans resolve as a top player. Plus they can have Orton sniff around in the build up and play up a cash in to give the feud more dimensions. Even though at current that would be face v face v face feud I still feel it would work as Randy must be on the verge of going heel and Bryan in in effect a super over tweener.

Anyone questioning whether Bryan has longevity must be mad though, the guys had top 3-5 (sometimes 1-2) reactions in the whole company for near two years now and he hasn't been blessed with the greatest pushes or stories to work with until recently. He's probably the best out and out wrestler in the company in-ring, can hold his own on the mic and has proved to be able to play a face role, heel role, comedy role, tweener role. Sure, people say he aint got a great look but so what, he already grew a huge beard to get the goatface thing going and despite being one of the smallest guy on the roster he has move than proven he can hold his role.

Over the last two years he's probably had the best feuds with Punk, Sheamus and got the best out of Kane as well as working alongside Taker and Rock for short periods in which he didn't look out of place.

Will Bryan be the face of the company? No, but can he be a long term player in the main event scene, definitely. I could see him fitting into a Jericho type role whereby he bounces from the main event and into the upper mid-card on occasion but still be a multiple time WWE/WHC and have some excellent runs.

Peter Griffin
July 15th, 2013, 3:13 PM
peter griffin you have no place to talk when it comes to whining

Haha fuck off, The vast majority of people on this board whinge and bitch all the time, and just because Im not so fucking blind as the idiots in this thread crying and throwing their fucking toys out the pram as if Daniel Bryan is on the verge of slipping down to curtain jerker, the best you can come up with is 'your one to talk' brilliant.

Zacharie
July 15th, 2013, 3:19 PM
I don't think Bryan/Axel will be that bad, it's better than watching Miz or Jericho going after the belt. A lot of you seem to forget that the feud probably wouldn't be restricted to JUST Bryan and Axel either. There's Heyman, Punk, and Brock too. Maybe they even fit Christian and RVD into the picture somehow.

The Law
July 15th, 2013, 4:05 PM
Be only the 3rd guy in history to hold the IC title and a world title. Bryan winning a belt on his way to Summerslam can only help "on a hit streak" buildup.

Do you mean win the IC Title after being world champion? Or be World and IC champion at the same time? I'm pretty sure only Warrior has done that. If you mean win a world title and then become IC Champion later, tons of guys have done that: Pedro Morales, Chris Jericho, Triple H, Kane, Miz, Ric Flair, Christian, Rey Mysterio, JBL, Booker T (if you count his WCW Championship reigns during the Invasion), Big Show, CM Punk

StoneColdChris
July 15th, 2013, 4:09 PM
The second was HHH beating Kane at No Mercy 02 when both the world and IC title were on the line.

The Law
July 15th, 2013, 4:13 PM
Right. I can't believe they actually got rid of the Intercontinental Title. And only had one mens singles championship on Raw for several months. That was a really horrible idea.

MichaelC
July 15th, 2013, 4:27 PM
I still think the slow build to Mania 30 is best for Bryan. The longer the wait, the bigger the payoff, and it allows them to build him up on that level. Beating up Curtis Axel on that route wouldn't derail him anymore than jobbing to Mark henry did for Rock. And I think we've passed the danger point of fans cooling on Bryan if he isn't immediately successful right now. He's been mega over for at least 15 months now.

Matthew
July 15th, 2013, 5:39 PM
Haha fuck off, The vast majority of people on this board whinge and bitch all the time, and just because Im not so fucking blind as the idiots in this thread crying and throwing their fucking toys out the pram as if Daniel Bryan is on the verge of slipping down to curtain jerker, the best you can come up with is 'your one to talk' brilliant.

it wasn't 'the best i can come up with', it was just the truth dude. don't whine about it so much

Kdestiny
July 16th, 2013, 1:36 AM
Well, we got our wish, should be a good match.

looks like he is over

JP
July 16th, 2013, 7:30 AM
"You are not better than me!"

This is going to be amazing.

McBain
July 16th, 2013, 7:40 AM
I want him to kick the twatting face off of that wanker.

Andy
July 16th, 2013, 7:51 AM
PHEW. And not even a sighting of Curtis Axel. :yes:

Peter Griffin
July 16th, 2013, 10:22 AM
I would hope a lot of people are feeling a bit silly after yesterdays collective hissy fit.

Jacknife
July 16th, 2013, 10:24 AM
How do Bryan and the Wyatt family keep those beards. I have a full beard and it sucks in this heat.

Andy
July 16th, 2013, 10:42 AM
Peter you need to actually read before you get so angry.

JP
July 16th, 2013, 10:51 AM
I would hope a lot of people are feeling a bit silly after yesterdays collective hissy fit.

:lol:

Oh mate.

When did you decide self-awareness was for other people? ;)

StoneColdChris
December 11th, 2013, 9:28 AM
BUMP

Well, he began a 2 time WWE champion, even though it lasted about a day combined. The good news is that despite the questionable booking Bryan has gotten over the past couple of months, he still remains insanely over!

Now the question I ask again, in 2014, what do you do with Daniel Bryan? Personally, I'd have him win the rumble and go on to face Cena in a rematch at Wrestlemania.

WizoOzz
December 11th, 2013, 9:37 AM
It's easy.

You put the belt on him.

/thread

JP
December 11th, 2013, 9:39 AM
Dude is turning heel. It's a pretty clear story arc. Probably in the next few weeks.

Mate, oh mate.

Rip
December 11th, 2013, 9:42 AM
See that white thing in the night sky?

The Moon?

Yeah.

Push him to it.

JP
December 11th, 2013, 9:45 AM
Oh man, can somebody rename this thread 'Cewsh and KK's Bad Day', please?

Eddie Brock
December 11th, 2013, 2:10 PM
I'd have him banned from the Rumble, forcing him to run a gauntlet or something to even qualify for it. Then, raging that he's in the Rumble, they give him the number one spot. Yet another epic performance where he goes from bell to bell in the Rumble, and do everything possible to stack the deck against him. Have interference from Orton, Triple H, and others halfway through the match and so on. Imagine midway through the match, a bunch of people are ganging up on Bryan and kicking him while he's down, and then all of a sudden, Hogan's theme explodes throughout the arena. Hogan comes into the ring, and he and Bryan clear the ring of everyone.

Nash Diesel
December 11th, 2013, 2:32 PM
Full blown tweener role. I think there's a bigger picture going on with the Wyatt Family feud. They will bring out "the monster" inside of him, and I see DB coming out of this a more serious, darker character. No pandering to faces/heels, no appearances on Total Divas looking like an ass clown, just a straight up wrestler who's been fucked over too many times and has no time to make friends, only win championships. Let the fans keep the YES chant going, trust me it won't stop, Austin stopped doing the "what" stuff and it hasn't died down in 12 years and gets even "worse" when Austin returns from time to time. Take a page from how they booked Austin, he was more of a face than a heel obviously, but he wasn't shy about sticking 2 middle fingers in the face of the others good guys and dropping them cold with a stunner.

In the last 20 years we've really seen less of "this feud/match has to be a good guy v. a bad guy" type scenario, and since John Cena isn't going anywhere as the top face, and the crowd won't let DB go full heel, why not build a true anti-hero? CM Punk was never really that guy, he's pretty much been a face or a heel, he's just cooler than the other faces and heels, like The Joker (personal opinion, even though Riddler is the best villian ever, just not as cool as the Joker).

If they play off how many times he's been fucked over, beaten up, now add in how his spot was taken by the likes of John Cena and Big Show, maybe even CM Punk, mixed in with his hatred for The Authority and others, I don't see how this could turn out bad.

VHS
December 11th, 2013, 2:39 PM
Sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, you'd have him stop egging on the YES chants then?

O...

http://i.imgur.com/U1Z4bjE.gif

...k

Nash Diesel
December 11th, 2013, 2:43 PM
He doesn't really egg on the yes chants, just like Austin doesn't egg on the what chants.

As soon as his music hits, the crowd starts the YES chants. If he's going to become a more serious character, there are certain things that he's going to have to scale back doing and things he'll have to change. I would have him take his time when he walks down the aisle, have him acknowledge the YES chants by doing one after getting in the ring, climbing up the 2nd turnbuckle, and do it to acknowledge his supporters/fans. But don't have him cutting promos where he's going to start going "YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES" because again, like with Austin, he won't have to do that to keep the fans doing it themselves. For God's sake, they chant his name and do the YES shit when he's not even in the match/segment, I don't see them stopping it just because he's not all animated bouncing down the aisle throwing his hands up in the air.

VHS
December 11th, 2013, 2:49 PM
Yes he does. :wtf:

What the heck do you call it when The Wyatts cut a promo and you cut to Bryan doing the Yes chant with the crowd? And him joining the fans in doing it IS egging. If he was to suddenly stop doing it, yeah the fans would do it still... but they'd be wondering why he stopped doing it. Over time it would peeter down, but not die. I just think it's a stupid idea to think it'd be cool to have him stop doing it.

Less crowd interaction/acknowledgement means less fun. Less fun means... less fun.

Nash Diesel
December 11th, 2013, 2:59 PM
Yes he does. :wtf:

What the heck do you call it when The Wyatts cut a promo and you cut to Bryan doing the Yes chant with the crowd? And him joining the fans in doing it IS egging. If he was to suddenly stop doing it, yeah the fans would do it still... but they'd be wondering why he stopped doing it. Over time it would peeter down, but not die. I just think it's a stupid idea to think it'd be cool to have him stop doing it.

Less crowd interaction/acknowledgement means less fun. Less fun means... less fun.

That's why I said scale back. I used Austin's "What" chants in hopes that it wouldn't be confusing to understand why it isn't necessary to Daniel Bryan's career to keep doing the same routine. It's the biggest crowd interacting chant today, and like with the "what" chant, if DB scales back doing it himself or completely stops, it's not going to prevent fans from doing it and even if it does, you think the only reason he's over is because the fans can chant something?

Eventually Hogan stopped saying "say your prayers, eat your vitamins" and Austin stopped saying "what". LIke I said, I would like to see him become a more serious character after the Wyatt Family feud, and to do that he'll have to change up what he does to fit that tweener role and to be a darker character. Does he have to completely stop doing it? Of course not, but the best way to stay relevant and interesting is to not become a parody of yourself, and a lot of wrestlers have that happen to them. They start phoning it in for cheap pops instead of being truly interesting and relevant.

I never said it'd be COOL to have him stop doing that, where did you read that? I specifically explained WHY he would need to scale back and change certain things. The only thing I'd think would be cool is if he was a more serious wrestler that had a darker side to him that we haven't seen.

VHS
December 11th, 2013, 3:14 PM
Austin's WHAT chants, Hogan's VITAMINS/PRAYERS catchphrase, etc. have nothing to do with Bryan's YES chants. "Scaling back" on the biggest crowd interaction today would be a horrible mistake. And like I mentioned just minutes ago, the chants would peeter out, but not die.


I never said it'd be COOL to have him stop doing that, where did you read that?


No pandering to faces/heels ... Let the fans keep the YES chant going, trust me it won't stop, Austin stopped doing the "what" stuff and it hasn't died down in 12 years ... Take a page from how they booked Austin

Right there, there, and there.

It's what I deduced from your entire post is all. :dunno:

Nash Diesel
December 11th, 2013, 3:22 PM
Austin's WHAT chants, Hogan's VITAMINS/PRAYERS catchphrase, etc. have nothing to do with Bryan's YES chants. "Scaling back" on the biggest crowd interaction today would be a horrible mistake. And like I mentioned just minutes ago, the chants would peeter out, but not die.





Right there, there, and there.

It's what I deduced from your entire post is all. :dunno:

Well, what I meant was exactly what I posted, that just because someone stops "influencing" the chant, doesn't mean it'll vanish. And still doesn't show me saying I think it'd be COOL if he stopped doing it altogether, in my later post I even spit out an idea for him to still acknowledge the YES chant by doing it when he enters the ring and climbs the 2nd turnbuckle as opposed to bouncing down the aisle all jolly and giddy throwing his arms up in the air. My idea of altering his character into a more serious, darker version of himself won't work if you don't alter a single thing about him.

Again, if you think that Daniel Bryan will be affected negatively because of a chant dying down, think again. It's definitely helped him, but it doesn't define him and it won't define him because a catchphrase, especially ONE catchphrase, can only take you so far. Trust me, I don't think you'll find too many fans of his that will say they're only a fan because they get to chant YES/NO with him. There's more than just 2-3 letters to this guy, just like there was/is more to guys like Rock, Cena, Austin, Punk, than the catchphrases they are known for..

WizoOzz
December 11th, 2013, 3:23 PM
I think, essentially, Bryan's over because he loves what he does. It's evident by basically everything the guy is involved in.

Taking out the fun aspect of what the character's become would destroy it long term. That is, unless you were going to go full on serious full heel (a la Jericho's going from the Save Us era to the suit and tie prick era).

Daniel Bryan, the way the character is right now, is a character to be loved. He's scrappy, small (comparatively), and the underdog - not in a trying to defy the rules kind of way, but a defy the odds kind of way.

Keep the character as is. And push him to the moon. Do the Wyatt angle, wrap it up quickly, and then get serious on putting the belt on the guy, and get him involved in an angle with a heel Punk so we can get an Iron Man match at 'Mania.

The crowds are fucking nuclear for him. Pull the trigger already, dammit.

Nash Diesel
December 11th, 2013, 3:33 PM
Yeah I mean, I don't think that my idea will ever come to fruition and even if it does, I don't expect him to be that way for the rest of his life. I could definitely see the day where he cuts his hair, trims his beard, and goes full blown heel again. But like with Jericho, when he turns back to face, he'll go right back to the YES YES YES stuff. Sometimes though, it's good to reinvent yourself and be fresh so you don't become stale.

Nash Diesel
January 6th, 2014, 1:17 PM
I know I'm not the only one who knows that both Kurt Cobain and Daniel Bryan hail from Aberdeen, WA. I think that like Kurt Cobain and Nirvana did to the music industry back in 1991, that Daniel Bryan has slowly been doing the same to the wrestling industry. He hasn't done it alone, CM Punk should get credit as well, but the similarities in Cobain and DB starting with their hometown, Nirvana's distinct difference in image compared to who the mainstream music industry was shoving down people's throats, DB's in that same boat when looking at who the WWE wants us to scream and shout over versus who we tend to favor more.

I don't know, it was just something I was thinking about when someone posted a new pic of Daniel Bryan jokingly saying it was an audition to be the new drummer for Slipknot.

Stringer Bell
January 6th, 2014, 2:07 PM
http://dailywrestlingnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/bryan-wyatt.jpg

VHS
January 6th, 2014, 2:35 PM
With only 3 months left until Wrestlemania... this better end quicker than a sneeze.

MikeHunt
January 6th, 2014, 2:41 PM
I know I'm not the only one who knows that both Kurt Cobain and Daniel Bryan hail from Aberdeen, WA. I think that like Kurt Cobain and Nirvana did to the music industry back in 1991, that Daniel Bryan has slowly been doing the same to the wrestling industry. He hasn't done it alone, CM Punk should get credit as well, but the similarities in Cobain and DB starting with their hometown, Nirvana's distinct difference in image compared to who the mainstream music industry was shoving down people's throats, DB's in that same boat when looking at who the WWE wants us to scream and shout over versus who we tend to favor more.

I don't know, it was just something I was thinking about when someone posted a new pic of Daniel Bryan jokingly saying it was an audition to be the new drummer for Slipknot.

Holy fuck! Hahahahahaahahahahahaha! Have you read what you're writing?

Nash Diesel
January 6th, 2014, 2:44 PM
Holy fuck! Hahahahahaahahahahahaha! Have you read what you're writing?

lol.

That post looks like what about 100 people on this board have posted toward you, so now I feel part of the crazy clique. FINALLY.

WizoOzz
January 6th, 2014, 2:47 PM
I think it's more a testament of your post being able to be read that Daniel Bryan should shoot himself.

To which I sadly disagree.

Nash Diesel
January 6th, 2014, 2:57 PM
Well if that's what you got out of it you're an idiot. There was more to Kurt Cobain and Nirvana than his suicide, without their influence on mainstream music we'd be even worse off than we are now.

WizoOzz
January 6th, 2014, 2:59 PM
Not saying that's how I read it - but that it could be read that way.

Just saying.

Nash Diesel
January 6th, 2014, 3:07 PM
Again, you're an idiot if you in any way shape or form got that I think DB should kill himself out of the very specific comparison I made when it came to Nirvana changing music and DB being the guy to usher in a change in pro wrestling. Mike Hunt is just a moron who likes to start shit and it can be very entertaining to read some of the stupid shit that he comes up with, but for someone that I find somewhat intelligent on this forum to say something as stupid as what you implied, blows my mind (no pun intended).

WizoOzz
January 6th, 2014, 3:17 PM
Dude, are you merely arguing for the sake of arguing? Or do you not know how to read something in jest?

Nash Diesel
January 6th, 2014, 3:24 PM
Dude, are you merely arguing for the sake of arguing? Or do you not know how to read something in jest?

Sounds to me like you just like trolling me, which is why you rarely if at all respond to people who say the same thing I do (such as virmicious in the TNA thread right now).

And that's not a "poor me" statement, that's literal.

MikeHunt
January 6th, 2014, 3:50 PM
Well if that's what you got out of it you're an idiot. There was more to Kurt Cobain and Nirvana than his suicide, without their influence on mainstream music we'd be even worse off than we are now.

I will argue this point to death about nirvana, what utter bullshit.

Matthew
January 6th, 2014, 3:54 PM
if you thought wizozz was serious with his first statement, you are an idiot

his second makes this very very obvious

Nash Diesel
January 6th, 2014, 5:08 PM
if you thought wizozz was serious with his first statement, you are an idiot

his second makes this very very obvious

He pulled some stupid shit out of thin air like Mike Hunt was even implying anything other than "Let's take a shit on this weird comparison". If Mike Hunt came in and said "So are you trying to say Daniel Bryan should kill himself" then I could understand, but Wizz has a tendency to pull shit out of nowhere just to start something. Remind you of anyone?

Jimmy Zero
January 6th, 2014, 6:08 PM
Holy crap, Wizz was quite obviously making a joke.

I know sarcasm doesn't translate well on the internet, but fucking hell.